Slashing grace and natural attacks

[Aroth Khashar]

Can you use the feat "Slashing Grace" from the Advanced Class Guide with natural attacks?

[avr]

No, it needs to be a weapon that you wield.

In any case natural attacks are usually best with multiple different kinds of attacks, using as many limbs as possible. Slashing grace works with one hand, and only while you keep the other free. Even if you can use slashing grace with a natural weapon you probably shouldn't.

[zza ni]

right while you can choose a natural weapon for this feat (as it say to choose a light or one handed weapon. and natural weapon is considered a light weapon -see weapon finesse feat).
the benefit of this feat only appear when you wield it - you actually never wield a natural weapon..

[glass]

zza ni wrote:

right while you can choose a natural weapon for this feat (as it say to choose a light or one handed weapon. and natural weapon is considered a light weapon -see weapon finesse feat).

the benefit of this feat only appear when you wield it - you actually never wield a natural weapon..

I am not sure I agree that you never weild a natural weapon. However, since you certainly do not weild it in one hand I definitely agree with the overall conclusion.

_
glass.

[Scott Wilhelm]

glass wrote:

zza ni wrote:

right while you can choose a natural weapon for this feat (as it say to choose a light or one handed weapon. and natural weapon is considered a light weapon -see weapon finesse feat).

the benefit of this feat only appear when you wield it - you actually never wield a natural weapon..

I am not sure I agree that you never weild a natural weapon. However, since you certainly do not weild it in one hand I definitely agree with the overall conclusion.

_
glass.

I'd say you could wield a Claw in 1 hand, but I would not say you are wielding a Gore or Bite in 1 hand.

There is another problem:

Slashing Grace wrote:

You do not gain this benefit while fighting with two weapons or using flurry of blows, or any time another hand is otherwise occupied.

You almost never have only 1 Claw. You almost always have 2. I don't quite see how 1 hand could be wielding the Claw, but not the other. I wouldn't see wanting this as a prime feature of any Natural Attacking character of mine. It seems to me that the whole point of a Natural Attack build is to heap on lots of Attacks. Play a Tengu for the Bite and 2 Claws. Dip 2 levels in Barbarian for the Gore Attack. Dip a level in White Haired Witch for the Hair attack, etc. And that just does not work with Slashing Grace at all.

But what if your Catgirl Swashbuckler was disarmed, and she wants to keep fighting with 1 of her claws using Slashing Grace as if it were a Scimitar? Maybe?

It seems like a bad idea for a Natural Attack build. It is problematic at best per RAW. I can see a GM allowing it in adversity.

[TxSam88]

https://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/combat-feats/slashing-grace-combat/

The FAQ online implies that Slashing Grace will work with the natural attack you choose it for.

[MrCharisma]

I agree with Scott and Sam - you can wield Natural Weapons.

The actual usefulness is somewhat limited because of the 1-hand limit - since Natural Attacks don't get iterative attacks you'll only ever be getting 1 attack per round (I guess 2 with Haste). Even Scott's example of a swashbuckler with claws isn't great, since Slashing Grace can't be taken twice you'd be putting 2 feats into getting DEX-to-damage with a backup weapon but you wouldn't have that with your main weapon (or you'd be relying on an Agile weapon).

[AwesomenessDog]

Agile Amulet of Mighty Fists is cheaper on a build and gives you exactly what you need.

[Scott Wilhelm]

MrCharisma wrote:

I agree with Scott and Sam - you can wield Natural Weapons.

The actual usefulness is somewhat limited because of the 1-hand limit - since Natural Attacks don't get iterative attacks you'll only ever be getting 1 attack per round (I guess 2 with Haste). Even Scott's example of a swashbuckler with claws isn't great, since Slashing Grace can't be taken twice you'd be putting 2 feats into getting DEX-to-damage with a backup weapon but you wouldn't have that with your main weapon (or you'd be relying on an Agile weapon).

That's pretty much where I was going with that. Not looking at it very closely, it's probably illegal, an definitely not very good, so a poor choice for a character build even if you were allowed to do that.

[vhok]

natural attacks work just fine with slashing grace, you need to take the feat for every natural attack separately as it only applies to 1 weapon and since you can't take it multiple times it really does not work for a natural attack character since they usually have many natural attacks.

just pick up an agile amulet of mighty fists for 4000gp

[AM NOT HELPING]

You only wield a natural attack if you hold it in a hand. So you don't wield any natural weapons unless you grab it in one hand and swing it.
To wield a claw, you must hold it with the other hand.

wield
/wēld/
verb
hold and use

[willuwontu]

FAQ wrote:

Slashing Grace: In the 2nd printing errata, what exactly does it mean that “You do not gain this benefit while fighting with two weapons or using flurry of blows, or any time another hand is otherwise occupied?” Can I use a shield? What about a buckler? Can I use flurry of blows? Brawler’s flurry? Two-weapon fighting? Spell combat? Attack with natural weapons? What if I throw the weapon? What about swordmaster’s flair?

Slashing Grace does not allow most shields, but bucklers work because they don’t occupy the hand. Flurry of blows, brawler’s flurry, two-weapon fighting, and spell combat all don’t work with Slashing Grace. Attacking with natural weapons beyond the weapon you chose for Slashing Grace also does not work. Slashing Grace only works with melee attacks, not thrown attacks with a melee weapon. Swordmaster’s flair should have a sentence added to it that says “Carrying a swordmaster’s flair counts as having that hand free for the purpose of abilities that require a free hand, though you still can’t hold another object in that hand.”

The FAQ seems to imply that it works for natural weapons.

[vhok]

AM NOT HELPING wrote:

You only wield a natural attack if you hold it in a hand. So you don't wield any natural weapons unless you grab it in one hand and swing it.

To wield a claw, you must hold it with the other hand.

wield
/wēld/
verb
hold and use

as far as the game terms care you wield natural weapons. it would break many abilities and it has been discusses many times before over the last 10 years. YES you count as "wielding" natural attacks.

found a post by SKR.

[Scott Wilhelm]

Since Slashing Grace only works for a single weapon and demands you can't be using a 2nd weapon or a shield, it's probably not the Feat you want for Natural Attacks. What you want is either the Unchained Rogue Class Ability Finesse Training or the Deadly Agility Feat.

[vhok]

deadly agility is 3rd party and not a real feat.

[Scott Wilhelm]

vhok wrote:

deadly agility is 3rd party and not a real feat.

What, that means he can't use Deadly Agility in Pathfinder Society? If

Tygrwmn's thinking of asking his GM if he can use Slashing Grace with his Natural Weapons, he might as well ask if he can use Deadly Agility.

Anyway, some GMs allow Path of War. It's almost respectable. He should vet his character build with his GM in any event.