(The Strides as part of the shove are more like five-foot-steps that trigger reactions, as you "must move the same distance and in the same direction" as the target of your shove).
Everything else stated is spot-on, but yes, there are two+ ways to read how this feat should work and I'm tempted to lean towards increasing MAP after every shove (as the rules don't say not to) but that you do not take the free movement from each success:
You:
1) Pick 5 adjacent targets
2) Roll shoves against all 5
3) Resolve shoves against all 5
4) Move half your speed
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It's written to say that "You attempt to Shove up to five creatures adjacent to you." This happens before any dice are rolled. The five creatures must be adjacent to you when you start. How you resolve the movement from the Shove success line when your targets start adjacent to you, and then aren't adjacent to you because you shoved the first guy out of the way, just doesn't work.
In any case, I agree that it is ambiguous.
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Agreeing with Draco that the flavor doesn't quite work if you move after each shove, imo. (And definitely that it's ambiguous.)
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The way I read it is you spend the requisite Actions needed, then resolve one Shove per target one at a time and rolling anew for each one which would incur the MAP, obviously capping out on the 3rd Shove.
If it didn't intend to have the MAP stack up against the multiple checks/attacks it would need to state as much.
Once you're done attempting Shoves you then Stride up to half your Speed.
"You Shove... Then Stide."
And nothing about MAP so that applies normally.
Feats will usually be very specific about how they alter MAP; Clear the Way not mentioning any alteration means that, to me, you apply MAP normally to each Shove made. Consider that you can get up to five rolls and half a Stride with only two actions and it seems fair to me that you largely rely on luck for the final 3 Shoves.
CLEAR THE WAY[two-actions] FEAT 6
ARCHETYPE
Prerequisites Mauler Dedication
It now mentions no MAP, but otherwise the same text applies to have it be unclear if the shove applies to max 5 opponents that start adjacent, or if you can shove - move - shove - etc.
Has there been any clarification on that?
Walking in a crowd, it would seem logical to shove and move before the next shove, as you're "clearing the way".
It now mentions no MAP, but otherwise the same text applies to have it be unclear if the shove applies to max 5 opponents that start adjacent, or if you can shove - move - shove - etc.
Has there been any clarification on that?
Walking in a crowd, it would seem logical to shove and move before the next shove, as you're "clearing the way".
There's no such thing as flavor text, and the description of the event as one act, not a multi combo, is (& was) mechanically significant.
You are performing one giant swing of the weapon to do this action.
As was intended in the old version as well, the Shove is a singular push event, not a rapid combo of pushes.
You are doing one singular multi-Shove vs many adjacent targets, then moving.
After the singular multi-Shove, I'd say you could use the movement component of one successful Shove.
But after that one, you then follow the feat's instruction and get to do the half Stride.
This ability taken raw opens the user up to serious risk.
Rolling 5 times gives plenty more opportunity to crit fail and land prone.
I would not run it that way.
It is more reasonable to roll once, check it against every targets DC and resolve each except the choice to move would be given once after all pushes effects are done. If that one roll is a crit fail against any they get the crit fail effect of shove. This makes a high roll a high roll against all targets. Also a bit more fair than having 5 chances to crit fail.
As was intended in the old version as well, the Shove is a singular push event, not a rapid combo of pushes.
You are doing one singular multi-Shove vs many adjacent targets, then moving.
The text makes it very clear you're performing five separate checks, though.
Contrast with Swipe which is very clearly a singular event.
As was intended in the old version as well, the Shove is a singular push event, not a rapid combo of pushes.
You are doing one singular multi-Shove vs many adjacent targets, then moving.The text makes it very clear you're performing five separate checks, though.
Contrast with Swipe which is very clearly a singular event.
Five separate events is also how I read it. So five shoves. But the text appears to indicate that it's the shove without the move (which would change shove) and just have the move after.
So the question from my side is: adjacent at the start of the action, or are these compleet shove and you can actually move during the shove to move closer to other targets (if the shove succeeds)?
So, all of the creatures must be adjacent to you when you perform this activity.
If you Shove one, follow it (per Shove), and are no longer adjacent to the up to four other creatures, then the Shove portion is complete and you then Stride up to half your speed.
Seems pretty clear to me. To shove more than one creature, you would need to forgo one or more of the optional "Stride after [the target]" on a Shove success.
Except following one Shove might keep you adjacent to one of the others you already had been adjacent too. Shoving that one might lead you the other direction to a second one you'd been adjacent too. And so on in a pinwheel of pushing. I don't think that suits the feat though and wouldn't allow the first follow to begin with, partly because it feels like all the Shoves are concurrent (even if they need to be mechanically distinct in order).
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Rolling 5 checks does not mean they are separate swings. 5 rolls is giving the maneuver the ability to create different outcomes upon each target.
Sometimes, the system doesn't need to crowbar it in like this. It can often invoke foe side saves to get variable outcomes.
But, Shove is an aggressor made roll, so they kind of have to do it like this if they want to use the Shove action (and allow the PC to invoke any relevant bonuses) while allowing for foe-variable outcomes. Could not do this with a foe-side roll.
Again, there is no such thing as flavor text. It's clearly one swing that uses multiple rolls, because that's exactly what the text says, lol.
You put your body behind your massive weapon and swing, shoving enemies to clear a wide path.
One swing, hitting multiple enemies.
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Getting into guessing territory, I think the intention was that rolling multiple outcomes was done so that even if one or two foes did not get moved, rolling multiple times would just about guarantee you can always "clear the way" and open up enough space to get out of a foe dogpile.
If you rolled once and used it vs all foes, a single bad roll would mean no one is shoved, and you get stuck unable to do the half-stride.
Again, there is no such thing as flavor text.
Oh, flavor text is real. Are you REALLY going to tell me that when Needle In The God's Eyes says "With sinews of bronze and thews of iron, you leap to the heavens, piercing the arrogant eyes of the gods", the player LITERALLY leaps into the plane Heaven and stabs a random god? Or that you LITERALLY have sinews of bronze and muscles of iron? It's either that, or admit it's flavor text. And once it's made abundantly clear that some text is just flowery descriptors, you can't assume every single sentence had RAW meaning or impacts the rules.
And just to show it's not a one off thing, you can look at One-millimeter Punch: "Your punches have incredible force and control." If we take the stance that it's not flavor text, it would restrict your attack to a punch instead of the actual requirement of "an unarmed attack". In a similar way, Powder Punch Stance says "You infuse your handwraps with black powder" but it actually works with "an unarmed attack, knuckle duster, or black powder knuckle duster" meaning you can kick or headbutt someone without having handwraps or gunpower... heck, it even works if you're in a form that doesn't have limbs but had an unarmed attack like a snake.
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There is another possibility we could understand that when they say punch its allowable to re-flavor it as any unarmed attack as a thing we just do in this game. If can be descriptive and inform what happens without being literal.
Piercing the the arrogant eyes of the gods can be alluding to jumping higher than mortals should be able to effectively sticking it to the gods.
So it can be allusory and descriptive at the same time.
But we still understand what its saying someone who uses the ability can do.
Just another reason I've got to never speak in absolutes, it'll be wrong most of the time and open myself up to objections.
It is very true that game text can be flowery and allusive. But, it is still descriptive of the actual ability, and is mechanically significant.
Especially when seeking to fill an unsaid gap, the descriptor of the event as one big repelling swing should be taken as mechanical rules text.
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This is reminding me of how much pushback there was to the idea of one's Kinetic Aura interfering with stealth due to the floating motes of elemental stuff.
Given the text of the stealth impulse, I don't think there's any room to claim "it's just flavor" like that, but even though I find it alien to think that way, a lot of people do / did insist on that being "non-mechanical flavor."
Compact layers of air diffract and bend light around your body, making you appear as clear as the sky on a perfect day. You become invisible until the end of your next turn. You can Sustain the impulse. If you use a hostile action, the impulse ends after that action is completed. If you activate your kinetic aura, the impulse conceals its elements, though any special effects of your aura might give away your location.
Through your kinetic gate, elements flow from an elemental plane to orbit your person. The form and appearance of this kinetic aura are unique to you. Examples include a chaotic wind orbiting the body, fragments of floating gravel, colorful wicks of flame, stars of raw metal always changing shape, floating snowflakes, or splinters dancing in the air. If you can channel more than one element, pieces of all your kinetic elements appear in the aura.
[...]Your kinetic aura is a 10-foot emanation where pieces of your kinetic element (or all your kinetic elements, if you can channel more than one) flow around you. The kinetic aura can't damage anything or affect the environment around you unless another ability allows it to. Channel Elements has the traits of all your kinetic elements.[...]
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Regardless of flavor text, I go with with what gives me the less headaches overall. For example, no impact on Stealth from an active Kinetic Aura, whatever Clear as Air states. Ruling otherwise needs too many adjudicating on stealth and Invisibility cases for my taste.
Of course if there had been an explicit penalty to stealth for an active Kinetic Aura, I would follow suit.
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Rolling 5 checks does not mean they are separate swings. . .
No, but the last sentence -- "Each attack counts toward your multiple attack penalty, but don’t increase your penalty until you have made all your attacks" -- kinda does since "each attack" counts.
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One of my favorite table interactions:
Super stealthy Gnome approaches minion-guards who are using darkvision.
"They turn to look at you."
"How do they see me?!"
"How do you see them?"
"I have my ligh...oh, crap."
No Gnomes were harmed in the making of this anecdote.