Need a bit of input on a homebrew class idea

[KageNoRyu]

I'm currently in a bit of a discussion for a homebrew class and would need a bit of input on the basic idea there (as currently the players are bit divided there on if it still feels pathfinder like).

As example for the basic idea lets take a criminal.the basic idea is a generic class there which gains general abilities on even classes and talents on uneven. the talents though are specific and chooseable each like choosung betweenanilities for an assassin or a thieves bonus to pick locks, ... thu more or less profession specific abilities).

In the discussion with my players we werent sure if it still feels pathfinderlike or not that way (so to say generic classes vs. specific profession classes like assassin & thief)?

[Dasrak]

There are plenty of classes that could already be used to build that - Rogue, Slayer, and Vigilante all immediately come to mind. All of them facilitate a stealthy character, have lots of skill options, and get a broad selection of powers every few levels.

If you want to develop on a custom class like this, the first thing you should do is figure out what distinguishes your class from these other similar ones and what unique abilities it has the others do not. There can be overlap, but if you find a lot of overlap with an existing class then that's a sign you should be making an archetype instead.

[KageNoRyu]

@dasrak Yepp i know. The example was mostly meant as a means to see what I meant. The classes I have in mind are very different from what is there so far also talentwise.
Iam not sure though if having a general class that allows you to choose abilities that go into a few directions instead of one would be against something integral (thematicwise) for pf or not. (Criminal was the easiest example I could think of to explain what direction I meant)

[Ciaran Barnes]

It’s difficult to critique a concept (not impossible though). You’ll get more input if you write something and then let read it. Like Dasrak said you can borrow from other classes, but you also need something that is unique to the class. For example, you could use rogue, slayer, and vigilante talents (plus some custom talents) to cover all of your miscellaneous abilities. However, you need something brand new that will make playing this character different from playing a multiclass rogue/slayer/vigilante.

[Chad Nedzlek]

I agree with Dasrak, your example really sounds like an archetype. "A specific kind of things with a few unique ability" is almost the definition of an archetype. All the good ones trade away some of the genericness of their base class with specific, but flavorful and useful options.

Classes with "choose abilities from a list" are extremely common. Matter of fact, _most_ classes do that. Rogues have talents, Clerics have domains, Barbarians have rage powers, rangers have a weapon style... on and one.

Also, they are extremely difficult to balance, because you need to consider and playtest every possible combination of abilities to make sure there aren't any hidden interactions.

I've seen a lot of homebrew classes (and some official ones) that mess this up, and while there may be 100 options, there are really only 2 that anyone picks, because they are so much better than the others, and break things.

A good rule of thumb in homebrew is starting as small as possible, and only getting bigger if you need to. In your example, don't create a whole class, just create some rogue talents... some theifier ones and some assanssinier ones. Of if that doesn't quite do it, maybe pick an archetype that trades some talent choices for some specific cool things.

A class is almost the largest change you can make the the system and still be able to call it Pathfinder, and I very rarely seen it done well. To the point I largely can't bring myself to read homebrew classes because they make me too sad/frustrated. But I love archetypes or spells or interesting magic items or rogue talents or kineticist talents...

[KageNoRyu]

Mhm Tnx all