So!
Hello.
I'm developing a setting and bashed out some races for it.
1) I'm not fully proficient, yet, in 5E-ism
2) I'm interested in making the races fun, fit their flavor, and (reasonably, sort of) balanced
Needless world-lore:
The world is a vaguely Castrovel-alike.
The region has mostly lashunta and elves, followed by half-elves, and, locally, changelings. After that, it's catfolk, hobgoblins, kitsune, kobold, wayang.
Anyway, feedback appreciated!
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Catfolk:
- ability: +2 dex, +1 cha
- age: as lashunta
- alignment: usually chaotic; independent, reactive, emotional, playful, sensual, loving, predatory
- medium
- fleet foot: speed 35
- darkvision
- anthrozoomorphic rapport: gain advantage on handle animal checks with animals of your kind
- cat attacks: claw (d4) or bite (d4) attacks
Subraces: house folk, wild folk, jungle folk, or royal folk
- - House: keen scent (advantage on Wisdom [perception] checks involving scent), protective (force disadvantage on attacks against adjacent allies); distractible (disadvantage on checks against distracting phenomena)
- - Wild: keen scent, mask of the wild (you can attempt to hide even when only lightly obscured by foliage, heavy rain, falling snow, mist, or other natural phenomena); nervous (disadvantage on any saves against fear effects)
- - Jungle: mask of the wild, dangerous mien (gain proficiency in intimidation, and advantage on all charisma-based checks related to being afraid of you; and disadvantage on all effects made to trusting you)
- - Royal: +1 charisma, any skill, authoritative (gain advantage on any social check that requires you to assert your authority or charge over others)
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Changeling:
- ability: +1 wisdom, +2 charisma
- age: as non-hag parent race, but ages faster
- alignment: usually chaotic
- medium
- speed: as non-hag parent
- darkvision
- hidden monster: unarmored AC is 11+dexterity, claw attack (d4)
Subraces: depending on the hag mother
- - annis hag (gain a claw attack as a bonus action),
- - ash hag (advantage on saves v. fire),
- - blood hag (Insight rolls against take disadvantage),
- - green hag ([choose one proficiency] deception or persuasion),
- - mute hag (advantage on saves v. gaze attacks),
- - night hag (advantage v. disease),
- - sea hag (proficiency with athletics; advantage in swimming),
- - storm hag (resistance to all weather-based effects and lightning damage),
- - winter hag (proficiency with athletics; advantage when used on ice)
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Hobgoblin:
- ability: +1 dex, +2 con
- age: as human
- alignment: usually lawful and evil
- medium
- speed: standard
- darkvision
- beast-tamer: training in handle animal
- martial training: gain training in simple and martial weapons, light and medium armor
- martial advantage: (1/turn) deal +2d6 damage with weapon attacks v. a target if another ally is in 5 ft. and isn’t incapacitated
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Kitsune:
- ability: +1 dex, +2 charisma
- age: as elf
- alignment: usually chaotic
- medium
- speed: 30 ft.
- darkvision
- biting: bite attack (d4)
Subraces: vulpesoul, ninetails, nogitsune
- - ninetails: kitsune magic ([3/day] dancing lights, druidcraft, prestidigitation)
-> nine tails with a deeply mystical and aloof mein
- - nogitsune: vicious ([choose one] gain a bite attack as a bonus action when you make an attack (1/day per level); or (1/day) auto-advantage or negate disadvantage on a bite attack, gain a bite attack) {or: the first combat you enter each day, gain advantage with your bite attack, and you may make 1 bite attack as a bonus action each round}; cruel (gain proficiency with a poison kit; if a class gives you proficiency, gain advantage, instead); contagious whisper (when you successfully use deception or a charm effect, others who interact with the affected target have disadvantage against that same lie or charm effect)
-> seven tails with a deep sense of fury and cruelty
- - vulpesoul: foxform (gain the druid ability to wildshape as a druid (1/day), but only into the form of a fox; can begin or end this as a reaction) can be done as a reaction); mask of the wild; proficiency (acrobatics)
-> one tail, extremely cautious and movement-focused
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Kobold:
- ability: +4 dexterity
- age: short (maturity at 12, maximum age at 60)
- alignment: lawful and evil
- small
- speed: 30 ft.
- anthrozoomorphic rapport: gain advantage on handle animal checks with animals of your kind
- pack tactics (gain advantage on attack when any ally that isn’t incapacitated is within 5 ft. of a foe)
- darkvision
- sunlight sensitivity
- tunnel trapper (training in perception and stealth; gain advantage on checks and saves v. traps)
- natural armor (unarmored they gain 12+dex modifier)
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Ratfolk:
- ability: +2 dexterity, +1 intelligence
- age: short (maturity at 12, maximum age at 60)
- alignment: lawful or neutral
- small
- speed: 20 ft.
- anthrozoomorphic rapport: gain advantage on handle animal checks with animals of your kind
- swarming (gain advantage on attack when any ally that isn’t incapacitated is within 5 ft. of a foe)
- darkvision
- keen scent
- skulk (gain advantage in stealth)
- packrat (training and advantage in sleight of hand)
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Wayang:
- ability: +1 dexterity, +2 intelligence
- age: as a gnome
- alignment: lawful
- small
- speed: 20 ft.
- shadow resistance: gain advantage saves against shadowy effects, and resistance to necrotic damage
- shadow magic ([1/day] minor illusion, pass without trace)
- superior darkvision
- sunlight sensitivity
- skulk (gain advantage in stealth)
- trickster (training in deception and sleight of hand)
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Half-Elf (Lashunta)
Ability +2 cha, +1 int, dex
Age: standard would be ~435 years
Alignment: ??
Size: medium; usually 4-6.5 ft. tall
Speed: 30
Languages: lashunta; and: elven, quori, sylvan, blah
Knowledgeable: gain advantage on any one intelligence-based skill of your choice
Lashunta magic: friends cantrip; (1/day) prestidigitation [3rd], detect thoughts [5th]
Limited Telepathy: with those you share a language with in 30 ft.
Lashunta
Ability +2 cha, +1 int, dex
Age: standard would be ~435 years
Alignment: ??
Size: medium; usually 4-6.5 ft. tall
Speed: 30
Languages: lashunta; and: elven, quori, sylvan, blah
Knowledgeable: gain advantage on any one intelligence-based skill of your choice
Lashunta magic: mage hand cantrip; (1/day) detect thoughts or dissonant whisper [5th]
Limited Telepathy: with those you share a language with in 30 ft.
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Originals for conversion found here, though hobgoblins (and kobolds) pulled more from the 5E MM than anything else (though my kobolds - and hobgoblins, really, but less - are demonstrably better than those in the MM).
These are very likely not the final versions, no matter what.
If there are any "official" treatments, I'd love to see them! Thanks!
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Annis hag changeling bonus claw attack might or might not be unbalanced. Maybe if it was working as a off-hand weapon with two-weapon fighting rules...
Mm! Good call. I'd been wanting to make sure it was usable without being overpowered.
It's worth noting the "royal" catfolk thing could be obnoxious, as currently written - unlike the others, it is only "sort of" meant as a PC race.
Kobolds are kind of all over the place. If I went strictly by that MM entry, they'd be very underpowered. I dunno how I did on balancing them.
With lashunta, the dissonant whisper was chosen because it is a rare psychic effect and compared it daze... but it's also an aggressive damage-dealing SLA, which I don't think exists, yet.
Nogitune also has three different concepts I'd like to hear feedback on how they might compare.
Thanks!
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Here are some basis for kobold stats:
5e works with small bonuses, a +4 to Dex is a lot. I suggest you tone it down to a +2 and add the + to somewhere else.
In 5e,you can use Dex for attack and damage so you could get a swashbuckling kobold that could get 17 ac with mage armor and 19 ac if they put on a shield.
And 5e to hits aren't really that high.
I play with a kobold so I know there are many ways to negate sunlight sensitivity. Like your familiar could aid you, or you could go beastmaster ranger and ride on a wolf...
Here are some basis for kobold stats:
Mm. Not official, but I'll definitely keep it in mind.
5e works with small bonuses, a +4 to Dex is a lot. I suggest you tone it down to a +2 and add the + to somewhere else.
In 5e,you can use Dex for attack and damage so you could get a swashbuckling kobold that could get 17 ac with mage armor and 19 ac if they put on a shield.
And 5e to hits aren't really that high.
Indeed. It was an intentional decision, though I knew it was different compared to normal. The MM kobold clearly had the equivalent of a +4, but it also had negatives to many of its other scores. I was curious what people would say about such things. The +2 is fine, the main problem is where to add the extra whatever. I was thinking of a +3. One element of restriction, though, is that even with the high bonus, you can't get anything higher than 20 - it's a hard cap without rare magic or strange abilities.
Still, it's worth considering, and I'd be interested in hearing more thoughts on how it would suss itself out.
I play with a kobold so I know there are many ways to negate sunlight sensitivity. Like your familiar could aid you, or you could go beastmaster ranger and ride on a wolf...
How do either of those negate sunlight sensitivity?
EDIT: Ugh. Hopefully fixed quotes.
Neat! Thanks!
Sweet! Thanks!
I'm interested that they actually get a penalty to strength. Are the the only creature that have a penalty to their scores?
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Kobolds are in the monster section of races in Volos, so they're not strictly balanced against PC races. Hence we see penalties.
You've put up a lot of work. Here's a tip though, constant advantage/disadvantage to things is pretty rare in 5e, so I'd avoid sticking it onto races.
Catfolk - Check out Tabaxi and use that as a base to build subraces for. At the least, Keen Scent isn't for PCs, free skill prof in Perception is.
You've used short hand so I'm not sure what you consider claw attacks. Is it an upgraded damage die for Unarmed Strike?
Changeling: Should be speed 30, or else there's an optimal non-hag parent choice.
Hobgoblin: Refer to Volo's. +2d6 every turn is nuts.
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Okay, I'm happy to continue reviewing your work, but I think at this point my number one recommendation is to check out Volo's to get a sense of how other races are done. That should give you some solid perspective for revising.
Thanks for the feedback!
What is Volo's?
Why isn't keen scent for PCs? How often does smell-based perception arise in general?
Also, the damage value is explicitly from the MM (the DMG is unhelpful and vague, implying the same in the MM, though I just found stats for both hobgoblin on pg 282 - they apparently lack stat changes at all, and martial advantage and darkvision is their only thing; kobolds are there, too).
As for claw and bite and similar - it's basically just a modified unarmed strike, yes.
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Perception is probably the most used skill in the game, and essentially everything has a scent.
I know that value is from the MM, but that doesn't mean it's PC appropriate. The MM monster races aren't meant to be reverse-engineered into PC races like that, because the values are nuts for PCs.
Sure. EDIT: but just because everything has a smell, doesn't mean that you can, in any event, identify, locate, or pinpoint something just by that smell. It is certainly possible, but it is not guaranteed. Especially in the world, like the ones presented in most DND Products, and which there are lots of strong, competing smells. What, exactly, is the scent of a particular magic item? Can you locate a single piece of paper, among many, just by having a sense of smell? Perhaps. But I am less certain. I'm interested if there is any higher reasoning then cooks everything has I sent"-it's a solid point, and one that I hadn't considered, but I am curious how many GM's would explicitly suggest that such a thing comes up and play.
Just to be clear - by challenging or asking for citation or clarification, I'm not rejecting or even disagreeing with advice or concepts, but asking to gain a greater mastery of the system. As an example, though I've not change posted stats, I've abandoned "my" kobolds entirely and am changing the annis and Changling speeds.
What is the damage value in Volo's? I appreciate the link and recommendation, but I'm afraid I'm not going to be able to acquire it for quite some time, so, if there's any specific information that I should know, I'd appreciate figuring out what that is together! Thank you, again, for all your feedback!
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True that small things like that you probably won't scent out, but I think some of those examples (ex. finding a specific paper in a stack) leans towards Investigation rather than Perception anyway. For awareness of enemies, the main use of perception, there's nearly always a scent.
Hobgoblins don't have free sneak attack at all in Volo's. They have a feature called "Saving Grace" which is a short rest recharge ability to get a bonus on a failed d20 when you have nearby allies watching.
I do highly recommend doing away with skill advantage coming from race, as opposed to free skill prof from race.
Maybe we can look at refining them one at a time.
HOLY COW
I just realized it was fifty dollars.
... yeah, I'm not going to pick up that one for a long time.
You would say that advantage on one skill outweighs both advantage and resistance to one damage type, or advantage to saves and immunity to another type?
Or if we compare the Actor feat, Dungeon Delver feat, or grappler feat; Keen Smell seems approximately 1/3 as powerful as any of those, which, when combined with the other effects, "feels" about right. From my understanding (based off of another's analysis - I haven't done my own), statistically, advantage actually works out to be exceptionally similar to slightly-more-than +2 (albeit being much more "swing-y" in the process): proficiency, then, gives a much bigger bonus over the course of a career (+2 to +6), while advantage grants one in a field.
Re: creatures v. objects - that's fair, and I expect it's at least partially an artifact of differing GMing styles. I don't expect my players to face all that many (comparatively) invisible or fully hidden creatures (outside of effects like darkness), and instead to be more clues-based searching. Again - the fact that everything has a smell is a really good point, but it may be diminished in my GMing style.
(Also, again, not dismissing criticism, but seeking to understand its source and process.)
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Are you referencing Fey Ancestry here? The immunity to magical sleep and resistance vs. charms?
Defensive abilities like that are different from active abilities.
Proficiency is relatively easy to have, advantage (especially consistent advantage) is difficult. Advantage is roughly +5 in value.
I can see how this might seem strange, but it's a very deliberate thing 5e does. Elves also have Keen Senses, which means skill proficiency in Perception.
When they want to show a race as being exceptional at something, they give it pseudo-Expertise. That is, they can make that skill check using twice their proficiency bonus rather what they normally might get. But this is used for fringe cases. Dwarven Stonecunning gives them this bonus to History checks relating to stonework, for example. Races don't get this to common skills.
An example of that for your races would be anthrozoomorphic rapport allowing them to add twice their proficiency bonus (instead of their normal proficiency bonus) when it comes to Animal Handling their type of critter, but not for Perception checks.