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So, I was looking at the Pure Legion Enforcer prestige class and have become interested in building one. That said, I don't want to be having to save against Cure spells whenever someone is wanting to help me stay alive. So that begs the question:
Especially in PFS, what can I do to heal myself without divine sources?
What classes could I be, items could I use, or other tricks I could pull to keep myself standing so I don't have to waste other people's resources?
A UMD score of +10 and a wand of infernal healing. Boots of the Earth, alternatively.
A UMD score of +10 and a wand of infernal healing. Boots of the Earth, alternatively.
Boots of the Earth seems to be the only option, as any divine spell requires him to save against. So even if he's UMDing to cast Infernal Healing, he then needs to save against it after.
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A UMD score of +10 and a wand of infernal healing. Boots of the Earth, alternatively.Boots of the Earth seems to be the only option, as any divine spell requires him to save against. So even if he's UMDing to cast Infernal Healing, he then needs to save against it after.
Actually, this kind of raises a good question, specifically for PFS, because outside, there are many arcane classes that can cast infernal healing. But in PFS, where wands are neither arcane or divine, do you have to save only if a cleric/oracle activates the wand?
Infernal healing, while it has the evil tag, is available to arcane and divine.
The witch healing hex for healing is also arcane.
There is also Godless Healing.
As to PFS, with scrolls and wands not having an arcane/divine distinction, why would UMD need to save?
/cevah
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Godless Healing is required to be a Pure Legion Enforcer, but it's rather paltry healing, being only once per day. Obviously I intend to take it, but I didn't see it as a viable method for healing except for in a major bind, and I am looking for ways to heal outside of just that.
I was not aware that scrolls were not typed in PFS, though mostly because the scrolls I've encountered have been scribed rather than used, so I guess I never looked into it. That would definitely call into question the wands, seeing how Bards and Witches have the Cure spells on their lists.
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Well, checking the guide, what it actually says is that there is no difference between an arcane and divine scroll or wand. Not that it's neither divine or arcane. So, you could say it counts as both, in which case you would have to save against it.
I would HATE for that to be the case, but I think I'd rather plan on that being the case than be blindsided when a GM rules that way. Though I would say another ruling could be it depends on who is casting it, but that may end up being a bit pedantic and confusing (what about somebody who can't cast normally using it?), so I'd personally look at it from a worst-case perspective.
I don't play PFS so I don't know the rules that well.
Godless Healing is 1/day per feat. You can get it more than once.
Also, the healing skill unlock from unchained has some significant healing capabilities.
/cevah
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Also, I know it's kind of new, but a number of the psychic classes have the cure spells on their spell lists, and I know mesmerist and spiritualist both have some removal spells on their list.
ooooh, a Mesmerist/Pure Legion Enforcer could be interesting... Confess, I can already feel it in your thoughts...
Also, the healing skill unlock from unchained has some significant healing capabilities.
Skill Unlocks are only available to Unchained Rogues in PFS. Still within the realm of possibility, but not necessarily the path I want to take with this character
This prestige class would be a bad idea for PFS, where you often will have divine PCs in the party and fairly often will need to cooperate with divine NPCs to achieve mission goals. I can't think of a reason why a member of the Pure Legion would do that.
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This prestige class would be a bad idea for PFS, where you often will have divine PCs in the party and fairly often will need to cooperate with divine NPCs to achieve mission goals. I can't think of a reason why a member of the Pure Legion would do that.
He uses his access to the Pathfinder Society to compile a list of as many divine magic practitioners as possible, all of which he reports back to his comrades in the Pure Legion.
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This prestige class would be a bad idea for PFS, where you often will have divine PCs in the party and fairly often will need to cooperate with divine NPCs to achieve mission goals. I can't think of a reason why a member of the Pure Legion would do that.He uses his access to the Pathfinder Society to compile a list of as many divine magic practitioners as possible, all of which he reports back to his comrades in the Pure Legion.
Or he could recognize he's outside his jurisdiction (Rahadoum) and not be a putz by decrying all who pray to a divine being as weak and unworthy of his help or should be arrested :-P I don't see why, in his own time, he can't be part of an organization of explorers and archeologists and work with divine casters, even though he may spurn their offers of spellcasting.
I see it in the same way that a Paladin and Necromancer may end up being in the same party: it very well could happen, but there's no reason the player should be disruptive about it.
Now, if he plays in the Heresy of Man series... ;-P
So I do not intent to play my Pure Legion Enforcer as an anti-cleric, declaring the might of his laws over all and picking fights with people because they pray to a deity, I am going to play him as recognizing his realm of influence is Rahadoum and its holdings, nowhere else, and will be respectful of the fact that not everywhere is Rahadoum and no everywhere agrees with its philosophy. He will still respectfully decline offers of divine aid, but I'm not going to have him go out of his way to be rude and disrespectful about it, because that's not his job.
Occultists not only gain access to the full healing line, but they can also use their implements to heal. I have a PFS Necroccultist who has yet to use his wand thanks to his mastery over life and death.
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This prestige class would be a bad idea for PFS, where you often will have divine PCs in the party and fairly often will need to cooperate with divine NPCs to achieve mission goals. I can't think of a reason why a member of the Pure Legion would do that.He uses his access to the Pathfinder Society to compile a list of as many divine magic practitioners as possible, all of which he reports back to his comrades in the Pure Legion.
Save that the Pure Legion KNOWS that the outside world is flooded with divine casters. And they don't give a rat's tail about them as long as they stay OUTSIDE their country. Rahadoum has no interest in a foolhardy crusade to export their ideology, they just want to be left alone.
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Save that the Pure Legion KNOWS that the outside world is flooded with divine casters. And they don't give a rat's tail about them as long as they stay OUTSIDE their country. Rahadoum has no interest in a foolhardy crusade to export their ideology, they just want to be left alone.This prestige class would be a bad idea for PFS, where you often will have divine PCs in the party and fairly often will need to cooperate with divine NPCs to achieve mission goals. I can't think of a reason why a member of the Pure Legion would do that.He uses his access to the Pathfinder Society to compile a list of as many divine magic practitioners as possible, all of which he reports back to his comrades in the Pure Legion.
That doesn't mean that a Pure Legion Enforcer wouldn't collect a detailed list of names and descriptions of divine casters to post at border checkpoints and Pure Legion posts inside Rahadoum. Having a detailed knowledge of those that are outside your borders means they are more likely to be caught if they do try to infiltrate.
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Non-divine classes with access to healing stuff.
Bard, witch (especially with healing patron), alchemist/investigator, occultist, spiritualist.
Your problem isn't nessissarily healing, it is things like restoration and cure disease, which are much harder to come by on non-divine lists. I only know of alchemists/investigators, healing patron witches, and spiritualists that count.
EDIT: also the white Mage arcanist can heal, (not restoration). Up to the GM if it counts as 'divine' healing as I is flavored that way but isn't mechanically divine.
That doesn't mean that a Pure Legion Enforcer wouldn't collect a detailed list of names and descriptions of divine casters to post at border checkpoints and Pure Legion posts inside Rahadoum. Having a detailed knowledge of those that are outside your borders means they are more likely to be caught if they do try to infiltrate.Save that the Pure Legion KNOWS that the outside world is flooded with divine casters. And they don't give a rat's tail about them as long as they stay OUTSIDE their country. Rahadoum has no interest in a foolhardy crusade to export their ideology, they just want to be left alone.This prestige class would be a bad idea for PFS, where you often will have divine PCs in the party and fairly often will need to cooperate with divine NPCs to achieve mission goals. I can't think of a reason why a member of the Pure Legion would do that.He uses his access to the Pathfinder Society to compile a list of as many divine magic practitioners as possible, all of which he reports back to his comrades in the Pure Legion.
That's what the border inspections are for. The thing is about divine casters.... they need their [un]holy symbols. Anyone who shows up at a border entry is first given the opportunity to surrender any divine foci that they are carrying. Then they will be searched for any that they may be hiding. Clerics don't tend to be trained very well in sleight of hand, so the majority of them will be caught by this point.
The other thing you don't seem to understand is that Golarion isn't full of ways to rapidly send and share large amounts of information, so what you're proposing isn't really that practical. And a global cenus of divine casters gives nothing but a mountainful of meaningless data. After all checking against a list of thousands or so casters, isn't going to be a practical option at border patrol.
Keep also in mind that a Pure Legionaire violates his oath and creed if he accepts ANY form of divine healing, resurrection, or restoration, whether he's in Rahadoum or not.
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Yeah, there are lots of options here (mostly listed by VampByDay). Though a Pain Discipline Psychic gets some Lay on Hands for themself only at 5th, so you might be able to make that work. Sorta, anyway.
I'd be inclined to go Investigator, personally, just for the flavor synchronicity (and because it gets the most benefit out of Divine Detective), but Occultist has some good flavor too, and Bard could be fun. Go Empiricist Investigator with Student of Philosophy and you can be a philosophical atheist and attempt to convert people to your way of thinking.
For any of those three, I'd grab 7th level as quick as I could (maybe after 1 level of Enforcer) just so as to have 3rd level spells.
Mesmerist and Witch (and Psychic) have some issues mechanically, given how much they rely on their casting. Losing levels of that for Pure Legion Enforcer really sucks for them. Spiritualist has a similar problem, only with their Phantasm not advancing.
Non-divine classes with access to healing stuff.
Bard, witch (especially with healing patron), alchemist/investigator, occultist, spiritualist.
Your problem isn't nessissarily healing, it is things like restoration and cure disease, which are much harder to come by on non-divine lists. I only know of alchemists/investigators, healing patron witches, and spiritualists that count.
EDIT: also the white Mage arcanist can heal, (not restoration). Up to the GM if it counts as 'divine' healing as I is flavored that way but isn't mechanically divine.
Occultist does gain access to other healing effects, it is just through implement powers.
The thing is about divine casters.... they need their [un]holy symbols.
The birthmark trait can help with that. This especially true if the normal symbol is a generic item like a butterfly.
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Your problem isn't nessissarily healing, it is things like restoration and cure disease, which are much harder to come by on non-divine lists. I only know of alchemists/investigators, healing patron witches, and spiritualists that count.
I actually classify those kinds of things under the banner of "healing," guess I should have specified that in my post.
Yeah, there are lots of options here (mostly listed by VampByDay). Though a Pain Discipline Psychic gets some Lay on Hands for themself only at 5th, so you might be able to make that work. Sorta, anyway.
I'd be inclined to go Investigator, personally, just for the flavor synchronicity (and because it gets the most benefit out of Divine Detective), but Occultist has some good flavor too, and Bard could be fun. Go Empiricist Investigator with Student of Philosophy and you can be a philosophical atheist and attempt to convert people to your way of thinking.
For any of those three, I'd grab 7th level as quick as I could (maybe after 1 level of Enforcer) just so as to have 3rd level spells.
Mesmerist and Witch (and Psychic) have some issues mechanically, given how much they rely on their casting. Losing levels of that for Pure Legion Enforcer really sucks for them. Spiritualist has a similar problem, only with their Phantasm not advancing.
I was having similar thoughts about the investigator, it could be a fun way to go. And I was also thinking about the loss of spell casting for Mesmerists and the like, and was hesitant to choose one of those classes because of it. Though looking at the Occultist it wouldn't be as bad, seeing how they get one spell of each school they know when they gain a new implement.
Still need to run that for y'all.
Looking forward to it :-) Though looking at the blurb for the first part, I DEFINITELY won't be bringing a Pure Legion Enforcer to the table, haha.
Psychics have a sneaky HP healing ability through the Healing Warmth spell. It's actually more efficient in HP/level terms (if not time) than the Cure line, with secondary utility, too.
The thing is about divine casters.... they need their [un]holy symbols.The birthmark trait can help with that. This especially true if the normal symbol is a generic item like a butterfly.
Just because an option exists, doesn't mean that everyone uses it. And when you cast your divine magic you pretty much have to expose that birthmark.
Yeah, there are lots of options here (mostly listed by VampByDay). Though a Pain Discipline Psychic gets some Lay on Hands for themself only at 5th, so you might be able to make that work. Sorta, anyway.
I'd be inclined to go Investigator, personally, just for the flavor synchronicity (and because it gets the most benefit out of Divine Detective), but Occultist has some good flavor too, and Bard could be fun. Go Empiricist Investigator with Student of Philosophy and you can be a philosophical atheist and attempt to convert people to your way of thinking.
For any of those three, I'd grab 7th level as quick as I could (maybe after 1 level of Enforcer) just so as to have 3rd level spells.
Mesmerist and Witch (and Psychic) have some issues mechanically, given how much they rely on their casting. Losing levels of that for Pure Legion Enforcer really sucks for them. Spiritualist has a similar problem, only with their Phantasm not advancing.
What book is the Divine Detective from? I can't seem to find it anywhere.
Occultist does gain access to other healing effects, it is just through implement powers.Non-divine classes with access to healing stuff.
Bard, witch (especially with healing patron), alchemist/investigator, occultist, spiritualist.
Your problem isn't nessissarily healing, it is things like restoration and cure disease, which are much harder to come by on non-divine lists. I only know of alchemists/investigators, healing patron witches, and spiritualists that count.
EDIT: also the white Mage arcanist can heal, (not restoration). Up to the GM if it counts as 'divine' healing as I is flavored that way but isn't mechanically divine.
Yes, the Purge Corruption Focus Power (Conjuration) acts as either Neutralize Poison or Remove Disease.
What book is the Divine Detective from? I can't seem to find it anywhere.It's a Class Feature of the Pure Legion Enforcer. It gives Detect Magic at-will (among other things), something Investigators can make very good use of but have trouble getting.
Oh. I thought it was an archetype like Psychic Detective. :)
Psychics have a sneaky HP healing ability through the Healing Warmth spell. It's actually more efficient in HP/level terms (if not time) than the Cure line, with secondary utility, too.
It's a nice spell, but unfortunately it's only for Ifrits.
Psychics have a sneaky HP healing ability through the Healing Warmth spell. It's actually more efficient in HP/level terms (if not time) than the Cure line, with secondary utility, too.It's a nice spell, but unfortunately it's only for Ifrits.
What's more likely: they put an Ifrit-only spell on the list of a new class just in case the rare Ifrit psychic wanted it, or they intended it to be generally accessible for all psychics, applying the "if your GM allows it rule" automatically to this particular class?
I think it's the only spell on their list normally restricted by race, so option 1 would be particularly bizarre. (Option 3 is that including it was an error and it shouldn't be on there at all, but given that they did...)
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Psychics have a sneaky HP healing ability through the Healing Warmth spell. It's actually more efficient in HP/level terms (if not time) than the Cure line, with secondary utility, too.It's a nice spell, but unfortunately it's only for Ifrits.What's more likely: they put an Ifrit-only spell on the list of a new class just in case the rare Ifrit psychic wanted it, or they intended it to be generally accessible for all psychics, applying the "if your GM allows it rule" automatically to this particular class?
I think it's the only spell on their list normally restricted by race, so option 1 would be particularly bizarre. (Option 3 is that including it was an error and it shouldn't be on there at all, but given that they did...)
I thought the same thing at first, but...
If you're looking for buffing on the Psychic list, Anticipate Thoughts and Contagious Zeal are awesome.I'll have to check those out. One thing I like about the spell list is the inclusion of many formerly race-specific spell from the ARG. I really like Blend for a scouting focused Investigator.Race-specific spells are still race-specific; inclusion in a spell list doesn't change that. Rather, they are just also allowed for members of the new class who have that race.
Similarly, mythic spells on those new classes' lists still require you to be mythic to cast them. They are just open to more classes now.
[Bolding added by me.]
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For reference, here are the problematic spells from the Psychic List (up to level 6 since I was researching Psychic Detectives):
Race-specific spells from the Advanced Race Guide.
agonizing rebuke, ancestral regression, bestow insight, blend, blood blaze, blood scent, commune with birds, fearsome duplicate, forgetful slumber, ghost wolf, half-blood extraction, healing warmth, jitterbugs, major phantom object, minor dream, minor phantom object, nixie’s lure, recharge innate magic, resilient reservoir, savage maw, shadow anchor, shadowy haven, sow thought, steal breath, touch of combustion, truespeak, village veil, vomit twin, and whispering lore.
Race-specific spells from the Monster Codex.
air breathing, amplify stench, blood in the water, fleshy facade, ironskin, isolate, spellsteal, swarm of fangs, and transfer regeneration.
Mythic spells from Mythic Adventures.
bleed glory, deathless, lend path, mythic severance, restore mythic power, share glory, and steal power.
So Healing Warmth isn't the only one.
Thanks, that's useful. Some of these aren't listed as restricted in the pfsrd, although I see that Nethys uses a R code for many of them.
Thanks, that's useful. Some of these aren't listed as restricted in the pfsrd, although I see that Nethys uses a R code for many of them.
You're welcome. The PRD also doesn't label the source of those spells even though the book does.
It looks like there are only two problematic spell from levels 7 through 9.
Mythic Adventures
ascension and terraform.
Thanks, that's useful. Some of these aren't listed as restricted in the pfsrd, although I see that Nethys uses a R code for many of them.
R for racial. Many GM's, myself among them, will restrict racial spells as appropriate.
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It suddenly occurs to me that I should be patient for another 5 days so that I can peruse Ultimate Intrigue for something of interest to this :-P I'm sure there will be something in the class archetypes that may help me, be that another class that has healing/restoration abilities or just super flavorful for the concept :-)
It suddenly occurs to me that I should be patient for another 5 days so that I can peruse Ultimate Intrigue for something of interest to this :-P I'm sure there will be something in the class archetypes that may help me, be that another class that has healing/restoration abilities or just super flavorful for the concept :-)
I would be prepared in case Ultimate Intrigue is not sanctioned in the next update. That seems unlikely, but I am the cautious sort.
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It suddenly occurs to me that I should be patient for another 5 days so that I can peruse Ultimate Intrigue for something of interest to this :-P I'm sure there will be something in the class archetypes that may help me, be that another class that has healing/restoration abilities or just super flavorful for the concept :-)I would be prepared in case Ultimate Intrigue is not sanctioned in the next update. That seems unlikely, but I am the cautious sort.
I'm probably not going to be playing this character within the next month or so because I have WAY to many other characters already, so I can be patient while they sanction what they want to from it :-) Though I'll operate under the assumption that anything with Leadership is not sanctioned :-P