How high can a bluff check get?


Pathfinder First Edition General Discussion


Title says everything. If you wanted to get your bluff check as high as possible, how high can you make it? Here is what I came up with:
Lara, human bard 20(Negotiator), tells an officer she isn't actually drunk:

+5 CHA from 20 base CHA

+3 from CHA boosts

+2 from wish spells CHA boosts

+20 from skill ranks

+20 glibness

+20 take 20

+10 bard 1/2 CL

+8 hero point

+10 mask of stony demeanor

+6 skill focus

+1 social traits->fast talker

+4 Deceitful

+20 moment of prescience from a scroll

+4 false friend

+3 viper familiar(skill focus(any knowledge)->eldritch heritage(arcane)->viper familiar)

+3 class skill

+1 profane bonus from a succubus (courtesy of CWheezy)

=140 total

Thoughts?


You missed a +1, plus 2 charisma from a succubus.


I don't think one can take 20 on a Bluff check.


You cant Take 20 with Bluff. (aka you cant keep on telling him different stories until you get a really good one)

But you can Take 10.


Guru-Meditation wrote:

You cant Take 20 with Bluff. (aka you cant keep on telling him different stories until you get a really good one)

But you can Take 10.

From a "Negotiator" bard archetype:

Master of Rhetoric (Ex)

At 5th level, the negotiator can take 10 on any Bluff, Diplomacy, Intimidate, Knowledge (local), or Sense Motive check if he has ranks in that skill.

A negotiator can choose not to take 10 and can instead roll normally. In addition, the negotiator can take 20 on one of those skill checks (without spending any additional time). The negotiator can do this once per day at 5th level, twice per day at 11th level, and three times per day at 17th level.


+1 from masterwork tool


Klara Meison/Negotiator Bard archetype wrote:

At 5th level, the negotiator can take 10 on any Bluff, Diplomacy, Intimidate, Knowledge (local), or Sense Motive check if he has ranks in that skill.

A negotiator can choose not to take 10 and can instead roll normally. In addition, the negotiator can take 20 on one of those skill checks (without spending any additional time). The negotiator can do this once per day at 5th level, twice per day at 11th level, and three times per day at 17th level.

Wow. I wish they wouldn't have used the phrase "take 20" there. It gives me visions of Maxwell Smart.

wikiquote wrote:

Smart: At the moment, seven Coast Guard cutters are converging on us. Would you believe it?

Mr Big: I find that hard to believe.
Smart: Hmmm . . . Would you believe six?
Mr Big: I don't think so.
Smart: How about two cops in a rowboat?


If Mythic and at least Tier 2:

Display of Charisma: +20 Circumstance Bonus <- Free Action
Legendary Item: Adroit (Bluff): +20 Insight Bonus <- Swift Action

...Gotta check your action economy carefully, though. XD

Guard: What are you doing here? *Watches as the PC spends thirty seconds casting stuff on themselves*
Player: Uh, nothing important? 8D
Guard: D<


In your Charisma bonus, did you include both your +5 bonus from leveling and your +6 bonus from a headband of alluring charisma? Because it doesn't look like you did.

You can also bump your Charisma up further by being venerable age and using a Lilitu rather than a succubus.

You can add your Intelligence bonus to Bluff checks in addition to your Charisma by taking a level in Kitsune Trickster rogue. I'm assuming you already took racial heritage (kitsune) to get false friend, which incidentally doesn't actually apply in this situation.

You can add your Wisdom bonus to Bluff checks in addition to your Charisma by taking a level in Heretic or Infiltrator inquisitor.

You could probably scrape out a few more points of bonus by going into the Master Spy prestige class at some point. +0.5/level is nice, but +1/level is better.

And then there are some miscellaneous bonuses.
+2 circumstance from a masterwork tool
+2 luck from a luckstone and Fate's Favored
+4 morale from greater heroism, doubled to +8 with Moment of Greatness
another +1 trait from Alien Origins or Propitiation or something instead of Fast Talker
+3 from Voice of the Sibyl
+3 from Deific Obedience (Norgorber)
+4 circumstance from Pageant of the Peacock
+2 racial from being a kitsune with the duplicitous racial trait
another +5 insight from getting a CL 25 scroll of moment of prescience


Instead of a succubus, you may go for a lilitu, which offers a +4 profane bonus instead of a +2. Which means another +1 to the bluff check.
Remember to take the trait Power of Suggestions to have some fun.


Klara Meison wrote:

Title says everything. If you wanted to get your bluff check as high as possible, how high can you make it? Here is what I came up with:

Lara, human bard 20(Negotiator), tells an officer she isn't actually drunk:

+5 CHA from 20 base CHA

+3 from CHA boosts

+2 from wish spells CHA boosts

+20 from skill ranks

+20 glibness

+20 take 20

+10 bard 1/2 CL

+8 hero point

+10 mask of stony demeanor

+6 skill focus

+1 social traits->fast talker

+4 Deceitful

+20 moment of prescience from a scroll

+4 false friend

+3 viper familiar(skill focus(any knowledge)->eldritch heritage(arcane)->viper familiar)

+3 class skill

+1 profane bonus from a succubus (courtesy of CWheezy)

=140 total

Thoughts?

Thoughts? THOUGHTS?

My Thoughts is that the situation would look something like this

http://imgur.com/FTn8Llw


Draconic Perfume?

Also, a Lilitu Demon is better than a Succubus, because the Lilitu gives +4 to a stat as opposed to the Succubus's +2(EDIT:this was already mentioned above, but I am pointing it out again).

Dark Archive

Klara Meison wrote:

Title says everything. If you wanted to get your bluff check as high as possible, how high can you make it? Here is what I came up with:

Lara, human bard 20(Negotiator), tells an officer she isn't actually drunk:

+5 CHA from 20 base CHA

+3 from CHA boosts

+2 from wish spells CHA boosts

Wouldn't work since your headband of charisma doesn't stack with Eagle's Splendor or other enhancement boosts to Cha.

Quote:

+20 from skill ranks

+20 glibness

+20 take 20

Don't think you can take 20 here since there's consequences for failure.

Quote:

+10 bard 1/2 CL

+8 hero point

+10 mask of stony demeanor

+6 skill focus

+1 social traits->fast talker

+4 Deceitful

+20 moment of prescience from a scroll

+4 false friend

+3 viper familiar(skill focus(any knowledge)->eldritch heritage(arcane)->viper familiar)

+3 class skill

+1 profane bonus from a succubus (courtesy of CWheezy)

=140 total

Thoughts?

Your total may be a little high for the reasons I mentioned above. You should double check if several of those items are able to stack.


A Kitsune with a single level in Rogue can take the Kitsune Trickster archetype. For more fun they get an alternate racial.

In addition you can worship Arshea for a +4 sacred bonus to anyone that could be sexually attracted to you. (Which is basically everything humanoid in Pathfinder.) And could BECOME a Succubus through the ubber evil path laid iut in the demon book.


Kahel Stormbender wrote:
Klara Meison wrote:

Title says everything. If you wanted to get your bluff check as high as possible, how high can you make it? Here is what I came up with:

Lara, human bard 20(Negotiator), tells an officer she isn't actually drunk:

+5 CHA from 20 base CHA

+3 from CHA boosts

+2 from wish spells CHA boosts

Wouldn't work since your headband of charisma doesn't stack with Eagle's Splendor or other enhancement boosts to Cha.

Isn't it 20 base, +6 from a headband and +5 from Wish(inherent bonus, not enhancement)? I don't see anything that implies that Eagle's Splendor.

In fact, I don't see level boosts to Cha in that list. The Bard should have 36 Cha at level 20 from base+wish+levels+headband, for a total bonus of +13.

Quote:


Quote:

+20 from skill ranks

+20 glibness

+20 take 20

Don't think you can take 20 here since there's consequences for failure.

Take 20 is explicitly permitted by the Bard's archetype (Negotiator).

Dark Archive

Snowblind wrote:

Isn't it 20 base, +6 from a headband and +5 from Wish(inherent bonus, not enhancement)? I don't see anything that implies that Eagle's Splendor.

In fact, I don't see level boosts to Cha in that list. The Bard should have 36 Cha at level 20 from base+wish+levels+headband, for a total bonus of +13.

No mention of what spell was used is made. Just "+2 from spells". And if you're assuming +5 cha from wish, why not instead opt for stat tomes? Presumably someone in the party is able to craft them if you're getting idealized equipment and buffs, and it's less likely to backfire then relying on Wish spells.


Kahel Stormbender wrote:
Klara Meison wrote:

Title says everything. If you wanted to get your bluff check as high as possible, how high can you make it? Here is what I came up with:

Lara, human bard 20(Negotiator), tells an officer she isn't actually drunk:

+5 CHA from 20 base CHA

+3 from CHA boosts

+2 from wish spells CHA boosts

Wouldn't work since your headband of charisma doesn't stack with Eagle's Splendor or other enhancement boosts to Cha.

Quote:

+20 from skill ranks

+20 glibness

+20 take 20

Don't think you can take 20 here since there's consequences for failure.

Quote:

+10 bard 1/2 CL

+8 hero point

+10 mask of stony demeanor

+6 skill focus

+1 social traits->fast talker

+4 Deceitful

+20 moment of prescience from a scroll

+4 false friend

+3 viper familiar(skill focus(any knowledge)->eldritch heritage(arcane)->viper familiar)

+3 class skill

+1 profane bonus from a succubus (courtesy of CWheezy)

=140 total

Thoughts?

Your total may be a little high for the reasons I mentioned above. You should double check if several of those items are able to stack.

>Wouldn't work since your headband of charisma doesn't stack with Eagle's Splendor or other enhancement boosts to Cha.

My headband of CHA gives me a +3(+3 from CHA boosts). I don't use Eagle's Splendor and never mentioned it, I believe?


Kahel Stormbender wrote:
No mention of what spell was used is made. Just "+2 from spells".

Uh, it doesn't say that anywhere? Maybe you are thinking of the +2 from wish spells?


  • +8 untyped bonus to a d20 roll from Inexplicable Luck.
  • +4 from a helpful Halfling using Aid Another.


2 people marked this as a favorite.
VRMH wrote:
+4 from a helpful Halfling using Aid Another.

If you're willing to make use of halfling assistance, why stop there?

Take five levels in the Halfling Opportunist prestige class, buy a Ring of Tactical Precision, and then take Leadership.
Get a Evangelist Cleric 16/Cavalier 1/Battle Herald 1 cohort with Strategy variant channeling and the Teamwork inspiring command.
Then get a horde of helpful halfling followers recruited from gillman orphanages.
When your cohort uses channel energy and inspiring command and your followers all use aid another, you will get a +17 bonus per follower.
And the only limit is how many cohorts your GM thinks would be able to help you at one time. This number is clearly in the hundreds.
"Have you been drinking?"
"No."
*cues stampede of vigorously nodding halflings*

Let's see what else we can come up with:
+10 untyped bonus from Honeytongue Elixir
+4 profane bonus from a demon tongue implant
+4 sacred bonus from Deific Obedience (Abadar) (Norgorber doesn't stack with your demonic tongue)
+2 circumstance bonus from an Alter of Norgorber (but his alter does)
+2 circumstance bonus from a portable alter of Calistria (peculiar worshiping habits, I guess)
+1 untyped bonus from Lenses of the Predator's Gaze

With a little bit of creative thinking, your lie can also benefit from a couple of more circumstantial bonuses (no pun intended).
+5 untyped bonus from Chastise ("won't your boss get mad at you if you arrest an innocent pedestrian?")
+4 enhancement bonus from a knight's pennon of parley ("just a moment, officer, let me approach so we can discuss this")
+2 circumstance bonus from a blue book ("actually, officer, I have the local public intoxication laws right here")


Remember that same type bonuses don't stack, avoron, so some of those aren't too useful - nice list though!


Blakmane wrote:
Remember that same type bonuses don't stack, avoron, so some of those aren't too useful - nice list though!

Circumstance bonuses are an exception to that rule.

Bonus Types wrote:
With the exception of dodge bonuses, most circumstance bonuses, and racial bonuses, only the better bonus of a given type works (see Combining Magical Effects)...Bonuses without a type always stack, unless they are from the same source.

Most of the bonuses I listed were circumstance or untyped. Has anyone else proposed an alternative source for a sacred, profane, or enhancement bonus to Bluff checks?

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