I had posted this several months ago, but didn't get much feedback as it wasn't fleshed out much.
I am looking for some playtesting and suggestions for this class. I've linked a Google Doc with the class description. The yellow highlighted lines are incomplete because I haven't thought of anything yet.
The concept was born from me looking at the existing summoner class and feeling that it doesn't accurately represent what I believe a summoner would be. The Manifester is a full caster that draws his power from other planes. Rather than gain a companion, he imbues himself with this power to gain abilities. He also has a summoning SLA that is less powerful than the summoner's (because he has 9 levels of spells). I reduced spell list will be made eventually, and it will likely be primarily conjuration, abjuration, and transmutation spells.
The abilities should represent something unique to each plane. Example: all agathions have lay on hands, so the (NG) plane gives access to a less powerful lay on hands. The goal of these powers is for the lesser ones to be on with bloodline powers/revelations and the greater ones to be a bit better.
Google Doc Link
I like the concept.
A few observations:
- the familiar is probably not necessary--as a player, you're already running several different creatures.
- I would handle innate summoning either like the summoner's ability or like the druid's spontaneous summons ability.
- I'd also like the aspects to have a bigger impact (maybe add a medium ability).
I like the direction you're going, but I feel the concept needs a little more meat on its bones.
Amanuensis wrote: - I would handle innate summoning either like the summoner's ability or like the druid's spontaneous summons ability. The summoner's ability is too strong for a full caster, that's why it's limited so much. And the druid is a prepared caster, so the only way to replicate that would be to just give summon monster as bonus spells, which I found boring and unflavorful.
Cyrad wrote: I like the direction you're going, but I feel the concept needs a little more meat on its bones. Do you have any suggestions? I'm not sure how to interpret this.
Some Other Guy wrote: Amanuensis wrote: - I would handle innate summoning either like the summoner's ability or like the druid's spontaneous summons ability. The summoner's ability is too strong for a full caster, that's why it's limited so much. And the druid is a prepared caster, so the only way to replicate that would be to just give summon monster as bonus spells, which I found boring and unflavorful. Obviously, we won't be able to evaluate how powerful the manifester's spellcasting is until you have put the spell list together. But I doubt it would be much stronger than the summoner's spell list, considering the summoner gains access to 8th- and 9th-level wizard spells. And while the summoner's design may be flawed in many ways, the split between summons and other spells makes sense, as it ensures that you do other things with your spell slots than just summoning.
Maybe you could expand the aspect feature, similar to a sorcerer bloodline? Each could have its own class skills, modified summon monster list, and special abilities. That would be a lot of work though.
Amanuensis wrote: Maybe you could expand the aspect feature, similar to a sorcerer bloodline? Each could have its own class skills, modified summon monster list, and special abilities. That would be a lot of work though. I had considered this, but you're right. It would be a lot of work. I also wanted options. One thing I don't like about the sorcerer, is that I'm more or less locked in to the abilities I get once I choose a bloodline.
I prefer modular abilities as well and I think the way you handled aspects and manifestations was smart. It makes the concept less essentialist than sorcerer bloodlines. To set it apart from the summoner, I would focus more on these elements, maybe even remove spellcasting completely.
I like where you're going with this and want to see more.
UsagiTaicho wrote: I like where you're going with this and want to see more. I would like to see more also, but the only advice I seem to get is "why not do this instead" without any actually reasoning behind it.
Sorry if that wasn't helpful, but I think I gave my reasoning.
What kind of feedback are you looking for?
Amanuensis wrote: Sorry if that wasn't helpful, but I think I gave my reasoning.
What kind of feedback are you looking for?
Ah, sorry. It wasn't directed at a particular individual and you did.
Amanuensis wrote: I prefer modular abilities as well and I think the way you handled aspects and manifestations was smart. It makes the concept less essentialist than sorcerer bloodlines. To set it apart from the summoner, I would focus more on these elements, maybe even remove spellcasting completely. If I did remove the spellcasting, I would try to create some system where the character summons monsters and then uses them to augment his own body to gain abilities, sort of like wild shape but a bit different.
If you remove the spell-casting you'll probably end up with something a bit like the Primal. Maybe you can draw some inspiration from that. Personally I like the flavor of yours better.
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