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Based on the number we are looking at there will be THREE main adventure (The third one will be a midpoint adventure) plus 24 Sidetrek adventures that will be roughly 400+ pages in length. While you might not start at first level I think you will have A LOT OF FUN playing it all the way thru (if we reach all our goals).*Glances in*
As a personal note, uh, I probably wouldn't refer to two books, plus sidequests, as an 'Adventure Path'. At the moment, this sounds closer to being an "Extended Two-part Adventure", especially if you're not starting at Level 1 or 2 and going all the way up.
It sounds like the structure of the adventure path will be quite different to that of traditional APs. I presume that the various side treks will allow parties to take various non-linear paths from the opening adventure to the big finale (which I presume need to be tightly scripted)?
Will the side treks be ranked into different tiers so that you can choose those appropriate for your own group's power level? Will there be any linkages between the various side treks or are they completely standalone?
Can you say anything else about how you will manage the plot structure?
People who want the limited edition hardcover want it for various reasons. Not just that it will be one of twenty five. If this is the only time you are printing it, increasing the number in circulation won't really be an issue I don't think. Especially if you state upfront that you might open up more of those print slots if demand requires it. I think limiting the print option is probably a good idea, especially considering what the poor guys at DSP have been through to date with UltPsi, if you are unsure on how much interest and funding you are going to get. They are still going through fulfillment issues on physical products and it has been one of the major headaches they ran into from most updates they sent out.
Another way that we might handling this is the color version are ONLY available during the kickstarter, while the B&W version are available for retail sales only. So the people who support the kickstarter actually get something unique.
I think Steve's attitude is probably more widespread in Kickstarter backers than you might think. I certainly tend towards that too.
I am noticing that.
Check out the pledge levels of FGG and Kobold kickstarters for examples.
I will. Thanks!
Also more input about the content, concept and crew is IMO needed. Personally I'm not that excited yet. I need more details. If Boomers stuff from the Tumbler makes it in I'm hyped. He spent a lot of thought on the concept and made some gorgeous high level NPCs. Including the tarrasque or even several tarrasques (dare I say mythic tarrasque) tying this to Rovagug being freed would certainly up the interest IMO.
That is the plan.
It sounds like the structure of the adventure path will be quite different to that of traditional APs. I presume that the various side treks will allow parties to take various non-linear paths from the opening adventure to the big finale (which I presume need to be tightly scripted)?
Correct. Very correct.
Will the side treks be ranked into different tiers so that you can choose those appropriate for your own group's power level? Will there be any linkages between the various side treks or are they completely standalone?
The side treks were built to expand the main three adventures (which we refer to as Alpha, Delta and Omega). My original though process was that PCs would start at 3rd level with the Prequel, then move on to Alpha for 4th to 6th; 1st side trek group (5th to 12th); Delta (10th to 12th); 2nd side trek group (11th to 18th); finally Omega (16th and up). We have debated this with the writers and project manager and come up with several options to handle the side treks, but nothing is in stone as of yet.
Can you say anything else about how you will manage the plot structure?
We are keeping the actual plot close to the chest, because it is the "special sauce" of this adventure path. But, we have created "beats" AKA important moments that help propel the plot along to it exciting conclusion. Plus we have come up with a way that people will get a chance to see AND play part of this the amazing AP before we do the kickstarter.
Making bespoke items and encouraging exclusivity should not be what 3PPs are about.
Actually, let 3PPs do what they will. It's not like this is a regulated industry with standards or proper payments schedules for freelancers. Mostly I see self interested business people trying to interest gamers with hyperbole.
The OGL will out.
Wolfgang Baur went for exclusive products with the early Open Design patronage projects (way before Kickstarter), but they phased this out more and more. There is probably a good reason for that. Drop him a mail to hear his thoughts about it.
Recent kickstarters such as Southlands or Razor Coast did include some Kickstarter exclusive rewards, but these were mostly super expensive far out products like the letterpress book from Southlands or super deluxe versions like the metal forged version of one of the FGG Kickstarter books, maybe Sword of Air? Or the extra special Rise of the Runelords edition by Paizo. Or extra material/props like the chest and coins and vellum map from a Razor Coast.
Sometimes an exclusive bonus module is KS exclusive (FGG and Kobold did it). Rite Publishing made the Tarnished Soukh HC a Kickstarter exclusive recently, but the softcover is available in color in retail.
I would not restrict a HC and especially not a color version of your core product to Kickstarter if I were you. Exclusivity will generate some hype but in the long run it's detrimental. Maybe make a special KS exclusive bonus module but don't restrict the central book...
Make at least the color version available to all.
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Let me join the chorus in that I want a nice color hardback if I am going to back a kickstarter. I'm old...I want a real book in my hands.
OK I changed the rewards level and I came up with these:
REWARDS
$1 - Back for a Buck (B4$): Thank You. Your name listed as a donor, our eternal gratitude, and lots of good karma!
$2 - Retailer Level: Funding at this level gives retailers the opportunity to purchase printed copies for their retail locations. These copies will be shipped in the US via Media Mail only. Qualified retailers, libraries or distributors only. Contact LPJ Design (LMPjr007 at Gmail.com) to confirm before pledging. This pledge is the only way for retailers, libraries or distributors to get the product, which WILL NOT otherwise be offered through distribution
$20 - Basic Digital: You get PDF copies of Alpha and Omega adventure of Crisis of the World Eater adventures .
$40 - Digital: You get PDF copies of all the adventures and side treks of Crisis of the World Eater. This rewards include all stretch goals that are reached.
$100 - Basic Printed. You get a collected full color softcover printed version of Crisis of the World Eater. You get PDF copies of all the adventures and side treks of Crisis of the World Eater.This rewards include all stretch goals that are reached.
$140 - Advanced Printed. You get a collected full color hardcover printed version of Crisis of the World Eater. You get PDF copies of all the adventures and side treks of Crisis of the World Eater.This rewards include all stretch goals that are reached.
$175 - Excellent Level Reward.You get a collected full color hardcover printed version of Crisis of the World Eater. You get PDF copies of all the adventures and side treks of Crisis of the World Eater.This rewards include all stretch goals that are reached. Your image as the basis of a headshot that will appear in the Crisis of the World Eater book OR future LPJ Design release. Limit 35 people
$200 - Remarkable Level Reward. You get a collected full color hardcover printed version of Crisis of the World Eater. You get PDF copies of all the adventures and side treks of Crisis of the World Eater.This rewards include all stretch goals that are reached. You will be able to pitch your ideas for future 3PP original content over Skype and you'll join the ranks of fully credited designers in the Crisis of the World Eater book. Limit 20 people
$300 - Incredible Level Reward. You get a collected full color hardcover printed version of Crisis of the World Eater. You get PDF copies of all the adventures and side treks of Crisis of the World Eater.This rewards include all stretch goals that are reached. You will be able to pitch your ideas for future 3PP original content over Skype and you'll join the ranks of fully credited designers in the Crisis of the World Eater book. Also you will to submit up to three (3) feats, three (3) spells, three (3) magic items and / or three (3) monsters (subject to design review, see FAQ) for Crisis of the World Eater book OR future LPJ Design release. Limit 15 people
$400 - Amazing Level Reward. You get a collected full color hardcover printed version of Crisis of the World Eater. You get PDF copies of all the adventures and side treks of Crisis of the World Eater.This rewards include all stretch goals that are reached. You will be able to pitch your ideas for future 3PP original content over Skype and you'll join the ranks of fully credited designers in the Crisis of the World Eater book. Also work with the LPJ Design team to create one of eight iconic characters for Crisis of the World Eater. Your name will be listed in Adventure Path Iconics: Crisis of the World Eater as a design and a free copy of that book when it is released. Limit 8 people
Ha Louis - you almost FASERIP'd it!
Okay, now that I'd be likely to back at Advanced.
I'd probably pop for advanced printed, too.
Ha Louis - you almost FASERIP'd it!
LOL!!!! You know it!!!!! Just wait for the Shift X level reward!
Thanks for taking the feedback on board, Louis.
I'll definitely back at advanced level or higher. Make sure you make a post in this forum when the kickstarter is launched. :)
Yes I would as long as the it was fantasy based and all the companies involved had good reputations.
Seconded.
Since I have heard more that once about "companies involved had good reputations" who would you want to see involved? Basically which 3PP are automatically ones you would give money to support AND why?
And if you are real daring, what 3PP would you NOT support in something like this AND why?
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For me, Frog God and Open Design are at the top. Next tier would be Legendary Games, Raging Swan, Radiant House, and Green Ronan. If some of these were involved (along with other 3PPs), that would be enough of a draw for me to consider it.
There aren't really any 3PP that would cause me to pass on a project like this. Maybe ENWorld I guess, but only if I was really only 50/50 to begin with.
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Whoever it was that did the Zeitgeist AP [It was EN Publishing 'wolf. Thanks 'wolf.] Solid is as solid does, and their Campaign Setting is extremely well developed. The steampunkery of it might frighten off some fans.
Richard Develyn. Rave reviews for adventures that mean something. And as a smaller 3PP, I'd rather support him than a behemoth. And the behemoths tend to favour safe, generic and boring themes we've seen since the hobby's inception.
Kobold Press - well, mostly because I think Midgard is also well supported as a Campaign Setting, but it would have to be authored by Wolfgang Baur, Ben McFarland or similar - not because they are the best or the greatest (though given the Breaking of Forstor Nagar and IMHO To Resurrect the Steigenadler from Midgard Tales for Ben and an old 3E adventure by Wolfgang called The Gryphon's Legacy), but because they have a passion for the Campaign Setting, and if it's just a freelancer hired by them, then it isn't really much of a KP thing then is it?
And that's a point I made earlier - I am talking Campaign Settings more than the 3PP's that provide them, or the freelancers they hire.
Little Red Goblin Games/Necropunk Campaign Setting, or failing that if it is too sci-horror, something new they cook up or any of their mini campaign settings. I don't actually think I have seen an adventure by them, but they are always actually transparent, on time and brimming to overflowing with unique ideas. Which the behemoths are not.
Kyoudai Games - Thunderscape is an awesome book, the Campaign Setting is well developed across media platforms over at least two decades and they write adventures as well. Nocturnals and the Fallen beg for a Crisis of the World Eater.
Rite Publishing's Kaidan deserves a visit. Rite know adventures fairly well (Adventure Quarterly, the aforementioned Breaking, and the Kaidan line). Kaidan also benefits from being more in the fantasy wheelhouse than any of the Sci-fantasy stuff.
I'd love to see a visit to Skybourne, but I'm not sure if it is as ready as it would need to be. From what I have read, Woodfaring Adventures sounds like a lot of fun.
As much as I am incensed by the lack of movement on Steampunk Musha, and dislike recommending them for that reason, Fat Goblin Games Shadows over Vathak. Lots of support, and authors who are fairly invested in the setting. And it's creepy as hell. World Eater all-you-can-eatery. But that Steampunk Musha thing is really a thorn, and I would hesitate to support a KS that included them - though to be fair, Rick is trying his hardest to pick up the slack after a massive blowout on/of collaboration.
You'll see I do not include anything from Frog God or Legendary Games. I don't really have anything to say about FGG as I have none of their stuff, and it all looks a bit ho-hum. Old-Skool was cool when it was old-skool. Now it just feels like a retread I no longer need. Even the Legendary Planet stuff looks like the same old thing, with the same big Paizo-conversant AP-alumni names, but in space.
LPJ's Neo-Exodus and the creepy one [Obsidian Apocalypse 'wolf. Thanks 'wolf] don't need a mention, because I doubt you'd curate this without including them.
TPK sedem to be doing a run of interesting adventures.
SAGA RPG stuff looks good, and their world fairly polished.
Raging Swan Press as a constant presence is a good idea - perhaps a little Dressing in each volume?
Purple Duck's Porphyra also has a lot of support.
I'm not really a fan of Veranthea or Aventyr, but they seem to be well supported and well managed.
Oh yes - just read the poster before me: Green Ronin.
Which also makes me think of two others - whoever it was that did Razor Coast (umm, that WAS actually FGG nitwit. Oooooh. Well then. Is good I like. Except they never fixed the Yohunga class...)
And
Cerulean Seas. Very well supported. Though more of a bunch of rulesets and expansions than a themed Campaign Setting.
Oh, and Mystical Kingdom of Monsters, if they present their Campaign Setting.
Yep. Just all of them would be interesting.
Fell like I'm still missing something...
And just maybe....Adventure a Week (are they related to Aventyr or Veranthea?). They seem to be able to produce, I dunno, an Adventure. A. Week.
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Ascension Game's Path of Shadows was pretty impressive, wouldn't mind seeing more of their stuff.
Up until recently I've always been a fan of Dreamscarred Press. Lately the "martials need fixes/feats are horrible design" being forced down my throat every new product being talked about is getting a bit tiresome. But I love the core Psi stuff.
Necropunk was good, and I've backed the Snow White kickstarter from AAW.
Pactmagic from Radiance House is a favorite of our group as well.
+1 for Cerulean Seas. Good idea.
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Whoever it was that did the Zeitgeist AP [It was EN Publishing 'wolf. Thanks 'wolf.] Solid is as solid does, and their Campaign Setting is extremely well developed. The steampunkery of it might frighten off some fans.
On my list. Thanks!
Richard Develyn. Rave reviews for adventures that mean something. And as a smaller 3PP, I'd rather support him than a behemoth. And the behemoths tend to favour safe, generic and boring themes we've seen since the hobby's inception.
Don't know him, so I will need more research on him.
Kobold Press - well, mostly because I think Midgard is also well supported as a Campaign Setting, but it would have to be authored by Wolfgang Baur, Ben McFarland or similar - not because they are the best or the greatest (though given the Breaking of Forstor Nagar and IMHO To Resurrect the Steigenadler from Midgard Tales for Ben and an old 3E adventure by Wolfgang called The Gryphon's Legacy), but because they have a passion for the Campaign Setting, and if it's just a freelancer hired by them, then it isn't really much of a KP thing then is it?
Sent out a email to Ben, waiting to hear back. I know how busy he can be so it might be tough.
And that's a point I made earlier - I am talking Campaign Settings more than the 3PP's that provide them, or the freelancers they hire.
Yep.
Little Red Goblin Games/Necropunk Campaign Setting, or failing that if it is too sci-horror, something new they cook up or any of their mini campaign settings. I don't actually think I have seen an adventure by them, but they are always actually transparent, on time and brimming to overflowing with unique ideas. Which the behemoths are not.
OK.
Kyoudai Games - Thunderscape is an awesome book, the Campaign Setting is well developed across media platforms over at least two decades and they write adventures as well. Nocturnals and the Fallen beg for a Crisis of the World Eater.
Sounds good.
Rite Publishing's Kaidan deserves a visit. Rite know adventures fairly well (Adventure Quarterly, the aforementioned Breaking, and the Kaidan line). Kaidan also benefits from being more in the fantasy wheelhouse than any of the Sci-fantasy stuff.
I would like to even include their Questhaven line too.
I'd love to see a visit to Skybourne, but I'm not sure if it is as ready as it would need to be. From what I have read, Woodfaring Adventures sounds like a lot of fun.
Agreed.
As much as I am incensed by the lack of movement on Steampunk Musha, and dislike recommending them for that reason, Fat Goblin Games Shadows over Vathak. Lots of support, and authors who are fairly invested in the setting. And it's creepy as hell. World Eater all-you-can-eatery. But that Steampunk Musha thing is really a thorn, and I would hesitate to support a KS that included them - though to be fair, Rick is trying his hardest to pick up the slack after a massive blowout on/of collaboration.
Shadows over Vathak is more likely be the one we talk about adding to Crisis of the World Eater.
You'll see I do not include anything from Frog God or Legendary Games. I don't really have anything to say about FGG as I have none of their stuff, and it all looks a bit ho-hum. Old-Skool was cool when it was old-skool. Now it just feels like a retread I no longer need. Even the Legendary Planet stuff looks like the same old thing, with the same big Paizo-conversant AP-alumni names, but in space.
Both Frog God and Legendary Games are not just good 3PP that are friends, who's quality is never in question. While it might not be fore everyone, they are something that 3PP would like to see included.
LPJ's Neo-Exodus and the creepy one [Obsidian Apocalypse 'wolf. Thanks 'wolf] don't need a mention, because I doubt you'd curate this without including them.
NeoExodus, Yes. Obsidian Apocalypse, Maybe.
TPK sedem to be doing a run of interesting adventures.
I will be getting in touch with them.
SAGA RPG stuff looks good, and their world fairly polished.
Don't know much about them to make a comment either way.
Raging Swan Press as a constant presence is a good idea - perhaps a little Dressing in each volume?
I have wanted to work with Creighton Broadhurst for a while so this might be my way to do it
Purple Duck's Porphyra also has a lot of support.
Of course.
I'm not really a fan of Veranthea or Aventyr, but they seem to be well supported and well managed.
Agreed.
Oh yes - just read the poster before me: Green Ronin.
That will be "tricky" for several reason. We will have to see.
Which also makes me think of two others - whoever it was that did Razor Coast (umm, that WAS actually FGG nitwit. Oooooh. Well then. Is good I like. Except they never fixed the Yohunga class...)
No comment.
Cerulean Seas. Very well supported. Though more of a bunch of rulesets and expansions than a themed Campaign Setting.
I have to see if they are still supporting the Cerulean Seas line.
Oh, and Mystical Kingdom of Monsters, if they present their Campaign Setting.
I will have to learn more about them. Thanks for all your input!
Add Legendary Games for their Mythic-Fu and experience with AP support and filing of the serial numbers so to speak. They would be the go-to guys for those parts which pertain to Golarion.
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LPJ being advised on transparency, heh. I didn't see that one coming!
You guys should check out the 80+ Transparency Agenda videos on his Google+ page
Louis, you should do your next video on this project.
Since you asked for it, here you go: Transparency Agenda 87: #After GenCon, NeoExodus Kickstarter & Crisis of the World Eater Kickstarter
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Richard Develyn. Rave reviews for adventures that mean something. And as a smaller 3PP, I'd rather support him than a behemoth. And the behemoths tend to favour safe, generic and boring themes we've seen since the hobby's inception.Don't know him, so I will need more research on him.
I write these:
http://paizo.com/store/byCompany/f/fourDollarDungeons
Richard
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ARMR Studios would gladly be a part of this. While I am working on two different Pathfinder compatible campaign settings, one uses its own level progression table, and its own rules for eliminating magic items from character progression. The other is a setting where magic simply does not exist with its own varied rule set.
However, I am available for classes, encounters, monsters, magic items, archetypes, etc.
-edit-
Oh, I am also available to promote the kickstarter through my webshow in YouTube
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I'll also pitch-in scintillating praise for Richard Develyn's work (the man behind Four Dollar Dungeons). As an owner of 3 of his recent modules, I'd easily put all 3 of them in the elite tier of design & development work for Pathfinder 3PP.
If you need any confirmations on what Oceanshield and I say, go check out Richard's reviews for all the 5-Star fawning of his FDD modules. It's all *extremely* well deserved.
***
Glad to see Creighton Broadhurst is under consideration as well.
Now your talking reward level wise. You have to realize that the RPG industry has changed since the eighties and ninties. Back then the average customers was a cash poor teenager/collage student spending loose change on a hobby. But we grew up got good jobs and can afford to spend our hard earned cash on hardcover books. I hate pdf's they are hard to read and annoying give me a beautiful hardcover book anyday. But despite all that me personally I don't need leather covers etc. although many do want them and will pay handsomely for them.
I'll throw my hat in the ring for your consideration, Louis, if you're still mining for contributors. Reign Of Ruin is my sole adventure-writing credit to date, but I'm also the de facto line editor and sometimes-developer for the Deadly Delves product line. Feel free to PM me if you're in need of soldiers!
Now your talking reward level wise. You have to realize that the RPG industry has changed since the eighties and ninties. Back then the average customers was a cash poor teenager/collage student spending loose change on a hobby. But we grew up got good jobs and can afford to spend our hard earned cash on hardcover books. I hate pdf's they are hard to read and annoying give me a beautiful hardcover book anyday. But despite all that me personally I don't need leather covers etc. although many do want them and will pay handsomely for them.
I am finally understanding this. I always feel that I don't want people to feel overcharged for something.
Well, as I said, I try to avoid using publishers as a deciding factor. I can, however, say which campaign settings I would like to see involved:
--Porphyra (Purple Duck Games), which conveniently is open gaming content.
Agreed.
--Coliseum Morpheuon (Rite Publishing)
This would be a very strong maybe to yes.
--Questhaven (Rite Publishing)
VERY YES!
--Lost Isles (Rite Publishing): this one could be trickier to do properly, since only an outline is available in the original In the Company of Dragons. A full version was funded via KS, but hasn't been released yet, so care would need to be taken to prevent a Lost Isles sidetreck from contradicting the upcoming world book. Depending on the timing, it might be possible for Steven, Wendall, or Ben Mcfarland to write a Lost Isles sidetrek as part of your kickstarter, using unreleased details about the setting. I don't actually know if such a thing would be possible, though.
Ben Mcfarland you say...
--The Glimmer, the setting outlined in Interjection Games' Subterranean Races: The Puddlings.
Don't know much about it but I will look it up.
--Dark Roads & Golden Hells (Kobold): okay, I'll admit it. I actually want Planescape, but I doubt you could get WotC to agree to participate in your project.
Well maybe BOTH might be possible. We will have to see.
--Third Dawn (DSP)
YES!
--Obsidian Apocalypse: but I expect you were already planning on using that one:)
Tell you the truth, since this AP is planned to start in a generic campaign world (so you can drop it in anywhere) I might choose NeoExodus over Obsidian Apocalypse. Plus OA might be gettign some thing cool for itself.
Campaign settings I would not be interested in include
--the world of Rappan Athuk
Why?
--Razor Coast (FGG)
Hmmm Why?
--The setting for Rise of the Drow (Adventure a Week).
Why?
--Golarion (although, as with Planescape, I doubt you could get the rights to it anyways, so I probably have nothing to worry about)
I understand.
--Forgotten Realms (ditto on me having nothing to worry about).
Well...
Hmm,interesting,but it does not sound like something I could input into my gaming easily--meaning, it would not get played.
Now your talking reward level wise. You have to realize that the RPG industry has changed since the eighties and ninties. Back then the average customers was a cash poor teenager/collage student spending loose change on a hobby. But we grew up got good jobs and can afford to spend our hard earned cash on hardcover books. I hate pdf's they are hard to read and annoying give me a beautiful hardcover book anyday. But despite all that me personally I don't need leather covers etc. although many do want them and will pay handsomely for them.Despite that, the RGP industry in total remains a small one... with an overall smaller pie than it used to be. The entire market last year for every company combined, WOTC, Paizo, Steve Jackson Games, every other company thrown in was about 15 million dollars. That was gross take before expenses, such as operations, printing, promotions, publicity, maintaining things like this website, et. al.
Sources for those data are dubious at best (rely on self reporting from only a fraction of distribution channels) AND only include sales of rules content. It is entirely unclear if adventure supplements are included in those numbers and it is a certainty that Amazon, kickstarter, and subscription sales are not included.
What is ALSO not included are any accessories to game play like dice, gm screens, sounds/music content, art, miniatures, terrain, maps, player aides, gm aides, software, etc.
There is money out there to be earned.
Now your talking reward level wise. You have to realize that the RPG industry has changed since the eighties and ninties. Back then the average customers was a cash poor teenager/collage student spending loose change on a hobby. But we grew up got good jobs and can afford to spend our hard earned cash on hardcover books. I hate pdf's they are hard to read and annoying give me a beautiful hardcover book anyday. But despite all that me personally I don't need leather covers etc. although many do want them and will pay handsomely for them.Despite that, the RGP industry in total remains a small one... with an overall smaller pie than it used to be. The entire market last year for every company combined, WOTC, Paizo, Steve Jackson Games, every other company thrown in was about 15 million dollars. That was gross take before expenses, such as operations, printing, promotions, publicity, maintaining things like this website, et. al.
This seems like fuzzy math to me. Just the Kickstarter alone of Reaper's Bones II last year raised over 3 million dollars, so I might check your math.
Hmm,interesting,but it does not sound like something I could input into my gaming easily--meaning, it would not get played.
Well maybe, BUT why don't you wait until you see the prequel (which we are planning to release in November for FREE) and then see where it might fit in. Does that sound reasonable to you? :-)
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We would be interested either with Necropunk or with one of our smaller campaign inspirations we've published (or something new). We would expand the campaign inspiration into something more robust if needed.
It's also almost certain that Louis Porter Jr, the owner of a successful RPG company, knows more about the finances of the RPG industry than LazarX, a random forumite known for posting his strongly held beliefs on every subject (34353 times and counting) without bothering to back them up.
Hey...not cool. We can have differences of opinion with sounding like we are attacking someone. LazarX might feel this way (and I am sure a LOT of people believe the table top gaming market is tiny) but like with most things we can check on what is real or rumor. But like any business in any area I assume 20% of the companies generate 80% of the sales.
In the case of Rappan Athuk, because while the dungeon traps are well done, the world it presents and the NPCs are utterly uninspiring to me.
To me that would be a perfect opportunity to make something amazing. Some of the best characters in entertainment of people who start out as complete bores and because complete bad asses! Wesley Wyndam-Pryce anyone
In the case of FGG's Lost Lands and Razor Coast and because it is a specific sub-genre of fantasy that doesn't particularly interest me.
Fair enough.
In the case of Rise of the Drow, I feel intrigue is much less exciting when one 'side' is obviously bad and one 'side' is obviously good. Also, I'm more a fan of the Drow of Orkney mythology than the Gygax/Greenwood drow.
The feels like a personal choice issue, so I understand.
We would be interested either with Necropunk or with one of our smaller campaign inspirations we've published (or something new). We would expand the campaign inspiration into something more robust if needed.
I am going to be sending a email to all the 3PP when we are closer to D-Day on this project. Thanks for the interest.
Hey Louis, I would be interested in participating in this as well. I have not been doing this long enough to have developed a whole campaign settting, but I would like to contributing something. New monsters, magic items, or character options. Something along those lines.
Russ Brown
Rusted Iron Games
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Hey Louis, I would be interested in participating in this as well. I have not been doing this long enough to have developed a whole campaign settting, but I would like to contributing something. New monsters, magic items, or character options. Something along those lines.
Russ Brown
Rusted Iron Games
I am going to be sending a email to all the 3PP when we are closer to D-Day on this project. Thanks for the interest.
Hmm,interesting,but it does not sound like something I could input into my gaming easily--meaning, it would not get played.
Christina/LPJ: how about a Spiros Blaak side trek for this AP?
Hmm,interesting,but it does not sound like something I could input into my gaming easily--meaning, it would not get played.Christina/LPJ: how about a Spiros Blaak side trek for this AP?
I would be up for that.
If you were interested in what our plans with this whole Crisis of the World Eater kickstarter with the other 3PPs, then please watch this video!
Interesting idea, but given that I'm not really playing Pathfinder much anymore i doubt I'd back it personally. But I'll throw my two cents in with Steve and the others... when it comes to a Kickstarter, I might back for just a PDF if it's something I'm not sure about but want to take a look at, but more often than not, if I'm not getting a physical book, then I don't have any real interest. In fact the only RPG I can recall backing as PDF only is Tales from the Floating Vagabond, and that was only because I had cashflow issues at the time and couldn't afford a physical book.
Ok I am wondering, what are the top three rewards that you would like to see from a Kickstarter? Be as specific or as broad as you would like. We want to know if we are missing anything for our list of rewards. Thanks!
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I don't trust companies to put out an adventure based on the kind of fantasy I like because I like fantasy a lot different from what other people seem to like (and don't ask me what kind of fantasy I do like: I've tried and you people still don't understand me).
Try me, I bet I can figure it out. I have had some unconventional ideas regarding fantasy myself.
Ok I am wondering, what are the top three rewards that you would like to see from a Kickstarter? Be as specific or as broad as you would like. We want to know if we are missing anything for our list of rewards. Thanks!
It would be interesting to see a sourcebook printed in Glow-in-the-Dark paper, or to get a bag of exotic gaming dice (such as the D3 (Trihedron), D5, D7, D30, and so on)
@ Glow in the dark paper. Maybe the cover. Putting the pages in the book on that stuff would be pointless. If the book was closed they'd never charge to glow :(
So I have been thinking of what threshold rewards we are going to come up at the start to this kickstarter, and this is what I have so far:
$3K -Alpha Adventure (Goal Reached)
$4K - More Artwork
$5K - Double Size of Alpha
$6K - Omega adventure
$7K - More Artwork
$8K - Double size of Omega
$10K - Delta adventure
$11K - More Artwork
$12K - Double size of Delta
After $12K, every $2K we are doing rewards that include 3PP.
And with that we are having Donor level rewards also. Here they are:
50 donors - Guest Introduction by Owen KC Stephens
75 donors - Introduction to 3PP Campaign Worlds
100 donors - Alpha Adventure Item & Face Cards PDF
120 donors - Omega Adventure Item & Face Cards PDF
140 donors - Alpha Adventure Campaign Cards PDF
160 donors - Omega Adventure Campaign Cards PDF
200 donors - Delta Adventure Item & Face Cards PDF
220 donors - Delta Adventure Campaign Cards PF
And of course more 3PP as we get higher in the donor numbers. While this is not in cement and can (and most likely will) change, this will give you an idea at where we are going. Hope this helps a few of you make up you mind about being on the fence.
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Going by the World-Eater theme, I would put the emphasis on the Campaign Settings involved over the idea of 3PP collaborating or backing to supporting popular 3PPs. Third party publishers have collaborated before on Kickstarters, I don't expect the KS outcome to be different in this case, even if it's nominally a bigger project because it seems each 3PP only has a small part to play in the AP.
Really the draw of this project is the promise of an Planescape or Spelljammer inspired epic romp through some of the more recognizable 3PP settings that are Pathfinder Compatible. Deliver on that concept and the project can tap into the crossover potential.
Conversely, what of 3PP who aren't known for a particular setting or even a barebones implied setting offered in adventures, there are those who focus more on offering player options and monsters over settings and adventures. Their involvement in this is not as strong a draw. While they can still contribute, they wouldn't have a "star" milieu to present for the AP (or put it another way, a World to place before the Eater).
If the non-setting'ed 3PP were to develop a setting specifically for this AP, then that doesn't hold the same draw as a 3PP with an established setting, unless the 3PP is already well established and has an existing strong demand from their fanbase to produce a setting along their style and strength.
With the existing settings, while it is nice for the PCs to visit them as a sort of sight-seeing day tour, there isn't a true cross-over unless elements start to bleed over between worlds. Traditionally in the comics inspiring this World-Eater concept, when worlds cross-over, it's a big mashup between heroes and villains. The PCs stand in for the super heroes (but it would still be nice to see some other familiar faces from the settings interact across the veil of worlds). You would need villains and monsters to cross over. The latter is easily done because most monsters are under a shared license. However, the bigger draw is villains who cross-over and then setting IP is involved. That may be more difficult to work out, both from the logistical perspective and from a writing perspective.
What I'm saying is, this is beyond the scope of Infinite Crisis (IP all controlled by one company). This is more like Amalgam Comics or a true cross-over between different companies (aka Marvel & DC). As fans, it is more gratifying to see Dr. Doom invade Thermyscira or Lex Luthor trying to obtain vibranium from Wakanda*, compared to if both companies decided to invent the "Megamaster" (insert random generic ultra villain) who is trying to invade both settings and each world goes about dealing with this new threat entirely self-contained with no input other than a handful of outworlders helping out.
*Meanwhile the Guardians of the Galaxy are delayed by Angela... wait...
Also, even if villains cross-over, the villains of a setting may have a very different style or even magic/technology level compared to the world they arrive in. That will have to be ironed out. Their motivation would also have to be determined. If Midgard's Master of Demon Mountain arrives on NeoExodus, his goal is probably to get back to Midgard as his primary motivation is the proliferation of a setting specific bloodline in Midgard (and if NeoExodus is an entirely different world void of this bloodline, what use is it to him) and his powerbase is strongly tied to Demon Mountain. There are workarounds of course, but things to consider. On the other hand, using Baba Yaga is free, but I wouldn't call Baba Yaga a Midgard villain. It would be like if DC suddenly used Thor, but not the Marvel Thor. That's cheating.
As for the organization of the Alpha, Delta, Omega adventures with the 3PP settings as side-treks, this seems to push the 3PP settings out into the fringes.
What worlds will be the focus of the Alpha/Delta/Omega adventure?
If some of them are new worlds created for this AP, then their fate and/or destruction will hold less impact.
If they are established settings, some players might not like them and what if they want to skip the Delta adventure if it's set in Midgard, but the group things Midgard is too plain vanilla for their tastes. Or maybe they hate kobolds and gearforged and Midgard is a cardinal sin.
What if NeoExodus is the Delta and is scripted to be consumed by the World-Eater, but the group are NeoExodus fans, they just failed in saving the setting they liked the most. Sure they might save all the others, but they've let their homeworld be destroyed.
Same applies for the Alpha and Omega. What if the group wants to start from a particular setting, how does the Alpha figure into it. Will there be a prequel adventure for each setting involved, etc.
Perhaps you've all these logistical issues figured out. Then that's great. If not, then please use the time to first determine how much of each setting will be intermixing into this formula. I feel the success of this project lies in striking the right balance between involving the settings. Too little and it becomes a cross-over in name only; too much and some might gloss over chapters. Create too much new stuff for the main adventures and we're back to cross-over in name only.
Not to sound negative. I really would like to see this get off the ground, but at the same time, hope it arrives in a format capable of addressing some of the unknowns mentioned above.