Let Us Build a House!

[Vurrunna]

So... How?

I'm the GM in my group, and one of my players wants to build himself a house in a forest. As we play a sandbox game, and as I am loath to deny him his crazy ideas, I plan to let him build a house. However, there are a few questions I have as to how to go about this:

1. What check is this? I'd say that if he builds a small lean-to, it's a Survival check, but once he gets to the size of a proper house, I think it ought to become either a Craft or Profession. The question is which one. I'd think it would be Profession, but I may be wrong.

2. How long does this take? Let's assume he's building a house made up of small trees (the largest being about a foot across) and mud to fill in the gaps. How long should this take?

3. What does he need? Are small trees and mud enough, or should he really use other supplies, such as stone and straw?

Thanks in advance!

[Opuk0]

Craft or Profession

Is there a real need to time it? Is he racing a clock?

Ask him what he wants to do, people have historically made houses out of less

[clff rice]

craft engineering builds structures and fortifications.

[Stormrunner]

Vurrunna wrote:

So... How?

I'm the GM in my group, and one of my players wants to build himself a house in a forest. As we play a sandbox game, and as I am loath to deny him his crazy ideas, I plan to let him build a house. However, there are a few questions I have as to how to go about this:

1. What check is this? I'd say that if he builds a small lean-to, it's a Survival check, but once he gets to the size of a proper house, I think it ought to become either a Craft or Profession. The question is which one. I'd think it would be Profession, but I may be wrong.

2. How long does this take? Let's assume he's building a house made up of small trees (the largest being about a foot across) and mud to fill in the gaps. How long should this take?

3. What does he need? Are small trees and mud enough, or should he really use other supplies, such as stone and straw?

Thanks in advance!

Most log cabins are simple enough (one room, maybe with interior dividers) that you don't really need Profession:Architect - Craft:Woodworking and/or Profession:Lumberjack ought to be sufficient.

There are two basic types of log construction: butt-and-pass and notched. In butt-and-pass, logs alternately "butt" up against a log of the adjoining wall, or "pass" the adjoining-wall log, sticking out 1-2 feet past the wall. Each log butts on one end and passes on the other: the first log of the N wall butts against the E wall and passes the W wall, the next N log passes the E wall and butts against the W wall, and so on. This is the quickest and easiest method, and can be done by a raw beginner, but is not quite as sturdy as notched (though it is a little less prone to settling over time). In the notched style, each log has notches cut in it near the ends, so they lock together exactly like those old Lincoln Log toys. This requires a bit more skill with the axe, and experience with log construction, to get the notches in the right place and the right depth. The logs in notched style don't stick out past the corners nearly as much as they do in butt-and-pass style.
When chinking the logs, you will need to mix straw with the mud as a binder to make adobe, otherwise the mud will crack and fall out as it dries. Dried moss can be used to fill the crack between the logs before plastering with the adobe. A stone foundation is not necessary (though it will make the cabin last longer), but you will need some stone to build a fireplace (unless you have a cast-iron stove, which is more efficient but heavy to haul out to the wilderness).

[Stormrunner]

Oh, and time: if you are an experienced log builder, you can slap together the outer shell in a couple days, and another couple days to roof it. For a beginner, figure 2-3 weeks with plans and instructions, probably twice that if puzzling it out yourself. Finishing the interior (laying a floor, building partitions, installing window shutters and a door, etc) would definitely be a Craft:Woodworking check and take maybe a month (it's not as physically difficult as building the shell but requires more finicky precision work).

Edit: This is assuming a minimum 3-man-and-a-horse crew (horse to lift the log via rope-and-pulley, one man to control the horse, one man at each end of the wall to position the new log as it's lowered into place). It is *possible* for a lone man to do it all (even without a horse!) but figure 3-4x the time, and you have to use smaller logs. A one-man cabin would be a max of, oh, call it 8' x 10' interior dimensions, any larger and the logs get too heavy to easily handle. A standard "frontier family" cabin would be about 10'x20' - much larger than that and you start to need multiple fireplaces to heat it.

And if you're having to fell your own logs, trim the branches off, and haul each one to the site, that's extra. :)

[Corvino]

If you're keeping things very simple then a wood framed building with wattle-and-daub infill could be the way to go. While the structural frame is still complex the majority of the walls ends up made of simple woven sticks with an adobe-type mix to make it weatherproof. This technique was common for centuries, and produces a building that looks appropriate to most fantasy settings after the wattle and daub is painted with lime. It also requires very little training to do at a basic level. The only essential supplies would be tools, some logs, sticks and mud that could be found locally, some straw and lime.

Paying a couple of hirelings might be a good idea. A carpenter at 3s+ per day and a couple of unskilled labourers at a few copper a day each should cut down build time to something manageable. Once the carpenter's done the skilled work the player should be able to finish it off themself.

Stormrunner's got a lot of useful stuff about the construction of cabins too. I'd agree that 10' by 10' seems a reasonable size for a simple cabin (sticking to 5 foot squares for game logic) that could be completed in a couple of days. Bigger takes longer and requires more help from party members or hirelings.

[Corvino]

If you'd prefer a boring "pay x money get a house" approach then you could use the downtime rules. Here's the Shack room stat block:

Shack

Create 3 Goods, 2 Labor (100 gp); Time 3 days; Size 2–4 squares

Upgrades To Lavatory, Storage

This no-frills wooden shelter contains a simple table, pallet bed, and stool. One person can build a shack with simple tools and basic materials. For an additional 1 point of Goods and 2 points of Labor, you can construct a brick or stone hut instead of a wooden shack.

Given that you're a bit more roleplay and sandbox inclined then this may not be useful.

[Arrius]

This is a Architecture skill (corresponds Craft (Architecture)) to entry I added to work in conjunction with my turn-based strategy layer to my homebrew games.

Architecture wrote:

Architecture (Int)
This skill allows you to design, build, and evaluate wooden, stone, concrete, and metal structures (including bookcases, desks, walls, houses, and so forth), and extends to various fields such as plumbing, drywall, laying cement, and building cabinets. For the sake of convenience, it also covers wood carving, allowing you to craft wands and staves.
Check: As per general Craft rules, and see below.
Build Structure: When building a structure from scratch, the character describes the kind of structure he or she wants to construct, and provides an estimate of how large it is (in 5-ft. cubes). A player may increase the volume of the cubes and calculate cost modification accordingly.

Structure size Check DC
10-100 cubes ; 15
100 – 1,000 cubes ; 20
1,000 – 10,000 cubes ; 25
10,000 – 100,000 cubes ; 30
100,000 – 1,000,000 cubes ; 35

Under these rules are quick ways to calculate the cost of a building, a wall, or a building wing.
A building must be divided into 5-ft. cubes calculating all three dimensions of space; width, length, and height.
For each 1 cube (5-ft. cube) of volume, it costs 10 gp of materials (construction) and 16 hours to build (two days).
If the construction material is wood (as purchased) it would add no cost; and it would possess all the hardness and hit points per thickness of wood.
Stone, since it is more expensive, may command a heavier price when purchasing, and multipliers always apply. Walls are typically 4 inches thick, with +1 gp for each additional inch. There is no added cost on additional walls or ceilings. One may choose to allow all walls to be as thick, or may choose only few cubes to allow so thick.

Cost Variance:
For each additional worker on the project it takes +1% more gp investiture, and creates 1 more cube 8 hours of construction. This does not account for the worker’s salary; usual workers require their check result in salary as normal characters.
It is wise to total their average payment and then submit their salaries, usually after the job is done.

Expansions:
Building a wing independently (or an expansion) takes less time, as it requires smaller rooms, and can be built later. It, however, costs 20% more than it would cost normally, due to its structure needing to be integrated, and has a DC equal to the total building size.
Maintenance:
There is no cost for maintenance on buildings unless they are destroyed; calculate total 5-sq. cubes damaged and calculate needed materials, paying one-half the materials for each square cube, as normal for all repair checks.

Example:
The formula for cost for a peasant house (15 ft. wide, 30 ft. tall, and 15 ft. high) totals for 45 cubes of volume; it would cost 450 gp (4,500 sp) to make a house with these specifications.
Since the cost of 1 Materials: Refined (Construction) (in Settlement rules reckoning) is 225 gp, it could cost about 2 Materials to build the house.
The house (referring to its size) would be a DC 15 Architecture check to finish, following the same rules for crafting, and would take 3 months (45 x 2) days to finish if working alone.

If you intend to use this skill, please provide feedback.

[Indagare]

Is the character a spell-caster or does he have one or two that would be willing to help? The druid spell wood shape would be pretty useful here. Wall of stone - though fairly high level, and requiring existing stone structures - would also be pretty useful. Expeditious excavation would be helpful for any cellars, though the higher-level move earth could allow for more versatility.

[Vurrunna]

A little more info:

The PC is a Rogue, with a good amount of skill in Trapping and Thievery. He was planning to build the house on his own, but that was because he was able to stay a bit longer than the other player and he ran into the forest (the safe kind) to try and build a house. He does have a donkey, and has the funds to hire labor in a nearby town if needed.

Considering that he doesn't have any skill in Woodworking, Architecture, or Engineering, how could he make the house? I believe he's trying to impress an NPC he met recently, so he may opt to build it all on his own. If he were to tr this root, would it be reasonable to say he could, but it just took a heck of a long time?

Also, thanks for the advice so far. I'll probably use those rules officially, but for now, I'm unsure if he's capable of doing it himself. He'll probably get help if he needs it, at which point I'll just have the NPC's do the checks.

[Corvino]

To build a very simple structure you don't need a huge amount of training. If your player really wants to do it alone with no skills, experience or help then just be realistic about what he can expect - a very basic hut. A one room hut won't require an architect or engineer, and only minimal woodworking skill.

It's a sandbox, so signpost out some options. Maybe it comes up in conversation with the guy selling tools that a local builder/joiner is looking for work. Perhaps they get invited to help at a local barn-raising getting some basic teaching and a neighbour or two to help out in return.

[Panguinslayer7]

Also depending on your time period, building a house was just a part of peoples lives. There wasn't really any renting a place in the wilderness. Chances are fair that the rogue could have learned how to do it from a parent, probably even helped with summer time house repairs to the roof and such.
Maybe just level (or half level) +Int. bonus added to a d20 roll if you want to keep it simple. Say a week of work depending on size. Maybe not super accurate but for game purposes it could work.

Not going on the cover of Architect Digest, but a house.

[Speaknoevil1]

There is also the classic option of having an NPC turn to the party for help and offer up his father's old hunting lodge or something to that effect as a reward. Basically they get the rights to a rustic little cabin, something that is a bit of a fixer upper. Maybe the problem is a few nasty monsters now call it home, or some creepy cultists.

"Please noble adventurer I am in dire need. A hunting lodge once belonging to my family is now infested with giant spiders that have been raiding the village and carrying off our livestock. I have very little to offer but if you can clear out the vile beasts the lodge is yours. It has solid bones and simply needs tenants that can give it some love."

That way he gets to have a home out in the woods and it comes naturally from his adventuring. It also gives the house a good story element. If everyone pitches in to salvage the home the party members could all grow to be attached to it. Then it can be a natural base or safe place for storing extra equipment, an alchemist's lab, etc. It can even be a plot seed for further adventures . . . The Epic Quest To Find Some Drapes That Match The Wizard's Robes!

[LazarX]

I remember there was one modern western movie that shows you just what kind of house you get from someone with no enginerring skill whatsoever. I think it was "Unforgiven", but that roof was about as secure from rain as a whisk.