My friend is about to start a Zelda-themed campaign. I was thinking of being an ocarina-playing bard and keeper of awesome songs. ...but then I made a throwaway line about being a Deku Zen Archer Monk, except with seeds instead of arrows. My GM was amused by the idea and said I should totally do it. So with GM's blessing I can work on an archetype of the archetype.
My goal is to be Race: Deku Scrub, Class: Deku Scrub. Sort of how playing a Stonelord Paladin Dwarf feels like playing Dwarf as your class.
This following is a rough draft for the Deku race; as I am the only player considering playing a Deku, my GM is fairly flexible with redesigning it to accommodate this concept. (Most notably the current Seed Shot ability; I need more than 1 seed/day!)
Fey (includes low-light vision)
Slow Speed
Small size
Ability Scores: Standard (+2 Con, +2 Wis, -2 Str)
Standard Languages
Defensive Traits: Natural Armor +1
Skill Traits: Camouflage (forest)
Water Skipping: Deku can run on the surface of liquids at a speed of 10 ft per round with a successful Acrobatics check each round. The DC starts at 10 and increases by 1 for each previous consecutive check (the DC resets to 10 if solid ground or a floating item of sufficient size to hold up the Deku is reached).
Slow Fall: Deku can, as a swift action, flare their head-leaves outward to catch air and slow down when falling. This functions as an at-will feather fall, but can target only the Deku and has indefinite duration. The effect ends, however, if the Deku takes damage while falling.
Seed Shot: As a standard action, a Deku can spit one of its seeds at an enemy within 30 ft. This seed is treated as a ranged attack roll with a base damage of d4 and does not add Strength to its damage, but adds all other ranged damage modifiers (such as from Deadly Aim). A Deku starts the day with one seed per character level, and its store of seeds refreshes each dawn.
Here are some musings on abilities I think would be great if my deku had.
Stunning Fist: Normally this ability is swapped out for Perfect Strike, but I’m thinking I want this ability back. Why? It’d make the perfect Deku Nut!
Special Seeds: Beyond Stunning fist, I’m thinking other seeds could be cool. Abilities you might modify an Alchemist’s bombs with, like a tanglefoot bomb.
Minor Wildshape ability: I’m thinking some ki-fueled wildshaping would be really cool. It would be limited only to Deku forms, like a long-range Deku with a greater range increment than 30ft, Medium sized Dekus with bigger damage die for seeds than d4s, a mobile Deku with greater than 20ft movement speed, a gliding Deku to not just feather fall, but to fly while falling 5ft each round.
Seed Regeneration: While my GM is completely sympathetic with expanding my seed pool, for verisimilitude, he doesn't want it to be unlimited. I'm thinking something like 2+(2*level)+Con per day, but then you regenerate them between battles, or at the expense of ki, or whenever you wildshape. ...or something like that.
What do you think would be some great abilities for a Deku to have?
Can you enchant your gut seeds or find a way to add strength to them? You are going to be perilously underpowered otherwise. I don't see why these seeds aren't unlimited either. 1d4 is sort of garbage for ranged damage, even for simple weapons (it is like a thrown dagger that doesn't even crit on a 19). I would argue that the seeds restock at a rate of 1 a minute at no cost. Why does the GM want verisimilitude for floating gun plants? Why can't magic be a good enough excuse?
I am not sure why this guy gets natural armor, either.
But anyways:
Bush Ambush: A Deku can meld into small patches of plant life to hide effectively. A Deku shrub may hide in any amount of foliage taller than simple grass as long as the Deku stays in one place and makes no attacks. If the plant is large enough to provide at least 25% cover, the deku receives a +5 to all stealth checks to remain hidden in the bush and in one place.
Thoughts:
- I'd say give them Sylvan as a bonus language at 1st, with Aklo and elemental languages available to sufficiently high level Int characters.
- Camoflage needs to be better defined. Is it a straight bonus to stealth in forests / jungles? If so, is it a static amount or are they getting Skill Focus in it or what?
- Remove the speed requirement on Water Skipping, moving faster should make it easier to skip. Increase the per round DC increment by a point or two.
- Change Slow Fall to an immediate action.
- I'm not sure why Seed Shot isn't getting Str to dmg, it's not broken to do so (you're basically just really good at throwing stones).
Other than that, neat!
Those are some good points about trying to keep competitive with damage. Although I'm okay falling behind the standard ZAM in damage if I get some added versatility. (Like Stunning Fist at range, minor wildshape, other debuffs, battlefield control, etc.) ...but I at least should be able to upgrade my ranged weapon. And I'll think about requesting strength to damage.
Perhaps all Deku begin with a "masterwork" Deku shooter? (Mouth) I believe my GM was planning us on having us bring our rupees to his GMNPC in town to upgrade our equipment. So I imagine he'd allow a similar thing for my Deku: Bring him 2000gp, now you have a +1 Deku shooter! Maybe accompanied by a shiny fairy fountain-esque cut scene.
Well if you think he will allow that (enchantment I mean) then things will likely be more or less okay. I would push towards adding strength too, though. You may be ending up much farther behind than you expect. The difference between the d8 and the d4 is already 2 points of damage lower per hit. And by late game, you would likely be able to get your strength up to 14 or 16 (so that is another 2 or 3 points behind).
Maybe the special seeds would do a good job making up the gap, though.
I submitted some counter-offers to my GM/race designer and here's the Deku race we settled on. (Changes could still happen, but this should be about it.)
Normal Speed
Small size
Ability Scores: Standard (+2 Con, +2 Wis, -2 Cha)
Standard Languages
Skill Traits: Camouflage (forest) +4 stealth in forest terrain
Defensive Traits: Natural Armor +1
Water Skipping : You can move across liquids, but if you end your turn on a liquid, you fall in.
Slow Fall: As an immediate action, Deku can flare their head-leaves outward to catch air and slow down when falling. This functions as an at-will feather fall, but can target only the Deku and has indefinite duration.
Deku Shooter: Deku can shoot seeds from their mouth. This is a ranged natural attack and does not provoke an attack of opportunity. These attacks do not add Strength to damage. The Deku Shooter is a masterwork weapon and can be enchanted as such.
Notes: You generate 2 + 2*level + Con modifier Deku seeds every day. You can load Deku seeds as part of an attack action. Deku seeds are available at 100 seeds for 1 rupee. Deku Shooter is a weapon with a range increment of 30ft. It deals d6 bludgeoning damage and crit is 20/x2
Special Seeds: You can create a variety of seeds. These seeds all deal damage as though one size category smaller.
Spiked: Deals piercing instead of bludgeoning
Flight: Increase range increment by 20ft
Smoke: Creates 10ft cube of smoke. (You can generate 1 Smoke seed instead of 3 normal seeds. Max 1 per day.)
Tangle: Creates 10ft radius, as entangle. DC is 10+1/2 level + Wis. (You can generate 1 Tangle seed instead of 5 normal seeds. Max 1 per day. This seed turns into a regular seed after 24 hours. Cannot be purchased.)
Building off this will produce something inferior to the traditional Zen Archer Monk, at least DPR-wise, but I think it'll be interesting and strong in other ways. The smoke and tangle seeds should be fun, and the Deku Nut (Stunning Fist in a seed) should be great. I'm looking forward to designing the rest of the class features.
I worry that the deku seeds still do not compare favorably to a sling (a simple weapon that adds strength and has a range of 50 feet).
Tangle and smoke probably compensate for that maybe, though. Will the class give you any better seeds later? (something that deafens and dazzles maybe)
Can you enchant seeds like arrows?
I worry that the deku seeds still do not compare favorably to a sling (a simple weapon that adds strength and has a range of 50 feet).
Tangle and smoke probably compensate for that maybe, though. Will the class give you any better seeds later? (something that deafens and dazzles maybe)
Can you enchant seeds like arrows?
Well, for damage at least the damage die is now d6. I also intend to have some minor wildshaping that will get me to a medium sized deku. (Seeds won't shrink like arrows from enlarge person) Also I'll eventually qualify for Improved Natural Attack. (I qualify by level 7) So if I wildshape and use the feat, my damage die will go from... d6 -> d8 -> 2d6. So eventually not so bad.
I could enchant seeds, I suppose, for bane seeds or something?
I would like for my class to give access to some more interesting seeds; although I haven't designed them yet. For starters, I'll be looking at Alchemist discoveries that modify bombs and monk special attacks for inspiration. (Elemental Fist & Touch of Serenity, for example. Oh, and qinggong powers)
Oh. If it counts as a natural attack, then I am willing to call it all copacetic.
For elemental fist: you might want to have a high-ish con and str so you can pick up dragon style and dragon's ferocity to get elemental fist earlier (and make it much better). That may not work out if you don't have a pretty impressive point buy, though.
Oh. If it counts as a natural attack, then I am willing to call it all copacetic.
For elemental fist: you might want to have a high-ish con and str so you can pick up dragon style and dragon's ferocity to get elemental fist earlier (and make it much better). That may not work out if you don't have a pretty impressive point buy, though.
I do have an impressive point buy; I think my stats at level 1 will be...
Str 6
Dex 16
Con 18
Int 16
Wis 21
Cha 6
I figure since Str isn't added to damage, I may as well dump it. Sure, it'll decrease my CMD, but eh. Hopefully I'll be able to keep a safe distance from my opponents, and I should still have a reasonable CMD thanks to my Monk AC/CMD boost.
I'll have a 15lb light load carrying capacity, but given I have no armor or weapons to haul around, I think that'll work okay.
As for Elemental Fist; if I wanted to, I could just say "At level 3 a zen deku gains Elemental Fist. A zen deku may treat seeds as if they were unarmed attacks for the purpose of Elemental Fist." I don't think I will, since my goal isn't necessary super competitive dpr, but just saying. I can design my own archetype. (Will require GM approval, but yeah)
Remember that the deku in Majora's Mask could fly with his propeller thing and the butler with his umbrella.
If you want versatile seed examples use the seeds from Oracle of Seasons as a base.
Remember that the deku in Majora's Mask could fly with his propeller thing and the butler with his umbrella.
If you want versatile seed examples use the seeds from Oracle of Seasons as a base.
At first when looking at the Oracle of Seasons seeds I wasn't too inspired, but after I spent some time on it, (Apparently a month?) something finally clicked; I attempted to infuse every +8 BAB monk move into a seed. (Elemental Fist, Punishing Kick, etc.) However, it would be quite powerful to have access to the same number of these as if I had the feats. (Several different pools of 1 seed/level) So I’m trying to balance how I gain access to them.
Scent Seed (Ex): When you hit a target with a scent seed, you gain the scent ability for the purposes of tracking the target hit. (All deku gain the scent ability?) This effect lasts for 10 minutes/level. If the attack misses the target by 5 or less, no damage is dealt, but this ability still functions. On one attack before the end of your next turn, you can make a Perfect Strike attack against the target. This Perfect Strike improves as a Zen Archer. (Roll 3 dice at level 10)
Ember Seed (Ex): This seed is treated as an unarmed strike modified by Elemental Fist. You can only deal fire damage. This Elemental Fist improves as a Monk of the Four Winds.
Gale Seed (Ex): This seed is treated as an unarmed strike modified by Punishing Kick. This Punishing Kick improves as a Hungry Ghost Monk.
Pegasus Seed (Ex): This seed is treated as an unarmed strike modified by Touch of Serenity. This Touch of Serenity improves as a Monk of the Lotus.
Mystery Seed (Ex): After making an attack roll with a mystery seed, but before results of the attack is revealed, roll a d6. Depending on the result, you could get one of 6 seeds:
1: Deku Nut
2: Scent Seed
3: Ember Seed
4: Gale Seed
5: Pegasus Seed
6: Tangle Seed
(I sort of want to rewrite this to include a “Mystery Seed only” effect; partly depends on how I implement all these seeds.)
Sweet. The mystery bonus could just be a random status condition, or could vary monster to monster dependent on what the GM thinks would work.