Okay, I've been working over the general rules and such to make sure that I'm doing things right. As it is, I've settled on a Human Oracle, with the Deaf Curse and battle mystery. Going for a "hear no evil speak no evil" theme. As it is, I'm going to play him more akin to a casting fighter than a pure caster. So, if you all don't mind, I'd like your thoughts, and make sure I did everything correctly:
Human, Oracle
Battle Mystery, Deaf Curse.
Faction: Grand Lodge
Str: 16 (10 points)
Dex: 12 (2 points)
Con: 13 (3 points)
Int: 10 (0 points)
Wis: 10 (0 points)
Cha: 14+2(5 points) the +2 is my racial bonus.
Feats: Improved Initiative, Extra Revelation
Traits: Reactionary, Observant
Revelations: Skill at Arms, Weapon Mastery (Greatsword)
Spells:
0; Detect Magic, Light, Create Water, Mending
1; Cure Light Wounds, Shield of Faith
So my basic premise is as earlier stated, "Hear no Evil, Speak no Evil", and I'm playing him as a "fighter with divine guidance". I didn't want to go paladin, because I feel that that's a little weighty on the code of conduct for this type of character, who would be more similar to a greyguard.
The idea is is that through the use of Extra Revelation, I took Weapon Mastery to substitute 3 feats for my 1 feat I would've normally had, and therefore supplementing myself a la a fighter. I've seen a lot of people on the boards saying that they need more clerics, and I figured this is a semi-capable way of filling that niche without pigeonholing myself.
Moving forward, I'll probably use up most of my feats to take additional combat feats that I otherwise would not acquire using my revelations, and then using my revelations to gain those other said revelations to supplement my feat pool and turn me into a very dynamic fighter.
I plan to use my first Ability Boost at 4 to round off my Con, and then use the rest to boost my CHA so I have enough to cast the appropriate level spells.
Also: I decided to leave my INT at 10, because with Human Skilled and my favored class bonuses, I felt I'd receive enough Skillpoints per level as it was. I also took Observant to supplement my otherwise low perception score due to low Wisdom, and because I need it for lipreading since my character is deaf. I also took both reactionary and improved initiative due to my current -2 to initiative, which ultimately cancels out the bonus and then improves upon it, having me end with a +6 to initiative, and then I think at 5 the penalty goes away entirely, and it'll be +8 base.
I am open to suggestions.
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Where is he from? What is his name? Why is he a Pathfinder? Who does he worship? How did he become cursed? What faction is he? Where is he spending his skill points - is there a knowledge skill that he'll be fluent in?
This looks very capable in combat, but make sure you put some work into his personality and backstory as well - otherwise other players might just end up referring to your hero as 'fighter' or 'greatsword guy.'
Personally I find the inquisitor to be a better Greyguard but that's me :) Just a math fix for you. Put the +2 mod to str doing that you could get Str 17 Dex 13 con 14 int 10 wis 10 cha 14. At lvl 4 I would do the str and after that right into cha. That would put you right up to lvl 12. I would put power attack as your go to level 3 feat. I'm partial to divine favor too when you can
I think you have another spell coming
In addition to the spells gained by oracles as they gain levels, each oracle also adds all of either the cure spells or the inflict spells to her list of spells known.
@Ekibus & BigNorseWolf: I was thinking of power attack as well, but I'm hesitant to put those points into STR because that means I won't get access to 9th level spells later unless I put each and every ability boost into Charisma, which would leave me with two odd ability scores. With the knowledge of getting to add cure spells for free, I'll probably take Magic Weapon to help boost my damage and to hit, which leaves me with my 16 Strength but still with the additional +1 from magic weapon.
@Andrei: Yeah, I was working through that. I'm not entirely familiar with Golarion, so I'm trying to look through everything to see what would best fit the concept in terms of home locality and name. As for skills, I was thinking about taking History as a knowledge skill to at least keep a few ranks in, feeling that perhaps he would've joined the Grand Lodge (which I did mention :P) due to a thirst for both exploration and battle. He'd most likely worship Iomedae, though he'd fall into the Neutral GOod realm.
The common high level in society is level 12 in Pathfinder. Reason being that is the retirement level however if your lucky to reach that high their are scenarios/modules/adventure paths that go beyond that and you can apply it to your level 12+ character. Which means you only need 16 Charisma for Level 6 spells which is the common peak of spell casting, so starting with 14 Charisma and boosting it by 1 at levels 8 and 12 will easily put you within normal reach of spellcasting. You will not hit 9th level spells until Level 18.
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access to 9th level spells
I wouldn't worry about this too much. PFS primarily covers levels 1-12, so a Cha of 16 (maybe 17) should be plenty to cover your minimum casting needs. If you play modules into the mid/high-teen levels, you can easily supplement with a Wisdom headband to cover spell levels 7-9.
BTW, welcome to the society!
Remember...
Explore! Report! Cooperate!
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I think you have another spell coming
In addition to the spells gained by oracles as they gain levels, each oracle also adds all of either the cure spells or the inflict spells to her list of spells known.
Yeah, Cure Light Wounds is a bonus spell to your spells known.
There are many good first level spells to add, and remember that an Oracle can swap out spells known as it levels up.
As far as background, Gorum might be a very good god to have chosen you, and his favored weapon is the greatsword. An interesting fact about oracles is that the power that chose them need not be the same as whom they worship themselves.
Pathfinder Wiki link is a good description for Gorum, and the wiki is a great source that can help you find additional materials you might need.
Hmmm, fair point. So might it simply be better then to switch my racial directly to str and have 18? That way with one point in con at four I can spend the rest on cha, or at least two more so that with a headband +4 I'm covered.
Thanks Bob!
DH: Oh nice! Thanks, the only god I'm really familiar with is Cayden Cailean (aka my hero :-P ) so I wasn't really familiar with them all. This one fits nicely, though my character will probably take a more good aligned approach to the whole thing.
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Rather than 12 Dexterity and 13 Constitution, I'd go for 10 in one and 14 in the other. I'd even say 10 in both and make your Charisma a total of 18, but since you're trying to be a "holy warrior" rather than an "oracle Oracle," maybe not (although if you want to be like a Paladin without the code of conduct, remember that Charisma is actually their primary ability as often as not) - you could also do 14 in one of those, 14 Strength, and 18 Charisma. I don't know about you, but odd numbers bug me. It made sense enough when the level cap was 12/13, but as has been previously alluded to, it's kept rising.
I agree with you IHIYC, odd numbers bug me as well, which is why I had such a devil of a time when initially assigning points. However that's also why my first ability point spent will be in Con to round it out to 14. And I thought about that at first, but as a lot of other people have noted, my charisma doesn't need to be that high for a while. Right now I have enough CHA to last me until level 8 for 4th level spells. At which time I take another point which gets me to 15 for 10th level 5th level spells. Then when I go to 12th for 6th level spells, another point added in charisma keeps me ahead of the curve. After that I would fall behind, but I'm sure by then I could've at least picked up a headband of charisma +2.
Personally you save (i think) 3 points by going with a 17 str instead of 18 which could go into other stats. I just can't see you not going power attack. When I played a pole arm cleric Power attack is one of the first feats I picked up. Since you probably wont be doing multiple attacks right away you want to make sure yours hurt. You can get all those nice buff spells (divine favor ftw) at level 1 it gives you +1hit and damage....give up the +1 to hit and now you are doing +4 damage
I'd only be buying the 16 str I have now, I would just be moving my racial bonus from Cha to Str, so I wouldn't spend any more points. Also thanks for the point on Divine Favor, definitely picking that up as my extra spell.
If you have a spare trait there is Fate's Favored (+1 to all luck bonus) Down side to Divine favor is it only lasts 1 min, but really do we need more? :)
I might take that instead of reactionary, since I'll already have improved initiative.
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Bear in mind, I think the present level cap is 18th, meaning if you get to see it all the way through you'll earn *4* ability score increases from levels (4th, 8th, 12th, and 16th).
@ekibus: Yeah, Fate's Favored...I didn't realize until checking just now that that works with divine favor and prayer among other things, making it awesome for the right character (yours, FlySkyHigh, is one of them). It'll take you a long time, but maybe then you should save up 20,000 gold for a luckstone (contrariwise, maybe not so much in your case, since it won't be cumulative with prayer, and while it retains clear advantages in spite of that, it might be enough to make you decide you have other things you can do with that kind of money).
Wooooah. Okay, so I'm definitely picking up Fate's Favored now, and totally getting the Luckstone later to help supplement my otherwise low saves. Thanks IHIYC!
I think what you have is perfectly playable. Your description sounds more like an inquisitor than an oracle though. So you might want to look into it. The oracle will have more spells than the inquisitor. However, if you are primarily a melee weapon build, I think you will find you rarely have an opportunity to cast very many of your spells.
Usually PC's that are trying to be mostly martial with casting (not counting magus here of course) only end up casting about 4 spells total during all the fights in a given scenario.
"Oh, those have huge numbers of hit points. Divine favor then melee with power attack."
"Oh, those have mental powers. Protection from evil then melee with power attack."
Of course the other option is to make many of your oracle spell to be long lasting buffs (like greater magic weapon) or out of combat utility spells (like share language).
I would definitely agree on power attack if you are using a 2 handed weapon. I might not if I was planning on using a 1 handed weapon and shield.
Kydeem, that was essentially what I was planning on doing, was just using a fair number of long-duration buff spells and utility, both to help increase my own capabilities in and out of combat, and to provide some more assistance to the rest of the group other than "smash what's in front of them"
I looked into Inquisitor, but it just didn't really click with me. And I think I may ultimately end up picking up a 1 hander and a shield just in case, but hopefully I'll have a benevolent arcane caster in my group that will be kind enough to cast Shield on me. :)
That is reasonable. I've just seen a number of people lately that have umpteen combat buffs known/prepared that they never get the opportunity to use. Or worse yet. The spend 4 rounds of combat buffing themselves while the others are getting stomped on.
... but hopefully I'll have a benevolent arcane caster in my group that will be kind enough to cast Shield on me. :)
Nope. That particular spell is a personal range spell. So that caster can only use it on himself. Have to find a different one to ask for. =)
That is reasonable. I've just seen a number of people lately that have umpteen combat buffs known/prepared that they never get the opportunity to use. Or worse yet. The spend 4 rounds of combat buffing themselves while the others are getting stomped on.
... but hopefully I'll have a benevolent arcane caster in my group that will be kind enough to cast Shield on me. :)Nope. That particular spell is a personal range spell. So that caster can only use it on himself. Have to find a different one to ask for. =)
Darnit. I always get that and Mage Armor mixed up in terms of personal/not. Ah well. With my Dex, Scale Armor, and Shield of Faith, I'll still have roughly a 18 AC, which isn't terrible. I can always pick up a shield and a longsword in case I really need that extra AC.
EDIT: and hopefully later in the game I can get an Animated Shield to let me still use my greatsword :D
Very common error.
And an 18 AC is fine for the 1-2 level as long as you are reasonably careful. Most things have only about a +2 to +3 on to hits at that level range.
My Kensi on the other hand is AC 18 at level 4. That is starting to become kinda dicey. I'm learning I have to be very careful with him since most attacks hit and he doesn't have high hit points.
Well, with my Skill at Arms I'll be able to pick up a higher level of Armor, preferably ultimately Full Plate for a full +8, and Shield of Faith will be scaling with me as well, so I think my AC will keep a pretty good Curve moving forward.
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Human, Oracle
Battle Mystery, Deaf Curse.
Faction: Grand Lodge
Str: 16 (10 points)
Dex: 12 (2 points)
Con: 13 (3 points)
Int: 10 (0 points)
Wis: 10 (0 points)
Cha: 14+2(5 points) the +2 is my racial bonus.Feats: Improved Initiative, Extra Revelation
Traits: Reactionary, ObservantRevelations: Skill at Arms, Weapon Mastery (Greatsword)
OK, this is a poor build; and here's an itemized list of why: (Are you ready? Awesome!)
1) You're taking the Deaf Curse *and* Improved Initiative and Reactionary to offset deafened's INIT-4 penalty, while only having a 12 DEX. At 1st level, your INIT mod is only +3 after blowing a trait and a feat. (By contrast, a standard wizard or rogue will easily have a INIT mod near or in the double-digits at 1st.)
General rule: glomming a lot of "cancel each other out" effects into a build is usually very suboptimal. In this case, you're much better off either not being deaf and going high INIT, or being deaf and not caring if you go dead last in the surprise rounds.
So, choose one path.
2. I'm seeing yet another 2hPA ("Two-handed Power Attack") 3/4ths BAB d8 class that'll stand a high chance of getting its face ripped off in PFS at upper tiers. You do half the damage of a barbarian and have half a barbarian's hit-points and resiliency; and become increasingly marginalized at higher levels when you can't hack melee but have all your feats devoted to it. Sure: you'll have healing, but that come's in measured doses, whereas the ray/AoE you ate and the crit which dropped you come on the enemy's turn. Your AC will be there, but nothing like a "professional" sword-n-board fighter's. You'll have, at best, half the "on demand" combat-oriented feats and class-features of a d10 class.
-- In "well-oiled machine" home games in which the GM plans around the characters, such builds do OK; in "Living"-style play with random mustered tables, they run into trouble fast (usually by voluntarily running into trouble fast).
3. with an INT of 10 and a WIS of 10 in a human, taking Observant (a Pathfinder Lodge faction trait) merely gets your Perception score from awful to myeh. Oh, guess what else kills your Perception? [b]Being deaf![/i] -- you automatically FAIL any Perception check involving noise! The Scent and Tremorsense compensations don't come until near PFS postmortem levels.
4. 16,13,12,12,10,10 is not an efficient 20pt array. Additionally, you're not raising the stat you're spending the most points to buy (always suboptimal).
5. You're a snail with 5' reach and lousy AC -- because that's what divine casters in plate armor are. Anything that wants to avoid you, will. Anything you want to avoid, you can't.
~ ~ ~ ~ ~
Advice: look at the "Reach Cleric" guide for tips on better pursuing this type of concept.
Human, Oracle
Battle Mystery, Deaf Curse.
Faction: Grand Lodge
Str: 16 (10 points)
Dex: 12 (2 points)
Con: 13 (3 points)
Int: 10 (0 points)
Wis: 10 (0 points)
Cha: 14+2(5 points) the +2 is my racial bonus.Feats: Improved Initiative, Extra Revelation
Traits: Reactionary, ObservantRevelations: Skill at Arms, Weapon Mastery (Greatsword)
OK, this is a poor build; and here's an itemized list of why: (Are you ready? Awesome!)
1) You're taking the Deaf Curse *and* Improved Initiative and Reactionary to offset deafened's INIT-4 penalty, while only having a 12 DEX. At 1st level, your INIT mod is only +3 after blowing a trait and a feat. (By contrast, a standard wizard or rogue will easily have a INIT mod near or in the double-digits at 1st.)
General rule: glomming a lot of "cancel each other out" effects into a build is usually very suboptimal. In this case, you're much better off either not being deaf and going high INIT, or being deaf and not caring if you go dead last in the surprise rounds.
So, choose one path.
2. I'm seeing yet another 2hPA ("Two-handed Power Attack") 3/4ths BAB d8 class that'll stand a high chance of getting its face ripped off in PFS at upper tiers. You do half the damage of a barbarian and have half a barbarian's hit-points and resiliency; and become increasingly marginalized at higher levels when you can't hack melee but have all your feats devoted to it. Sure: you'll have healing, but that come's in measured doses, whereas the ray/AoE you ate and the crit which dropped you come on the enemy's turn. Your AC will be there, but nothing like a "professional" sword-n-board fighter's. You'll have, at best, half the "on demand" combat-oriented feats and class-features of a d10 class.
-- In "well-oiled machine" home games in which the GM plans around the characters, such builds do OK; in "Living"-style play with random mustered tables, they run into trouble fast (usually by voluntarily running into trouble fast)....
So this is a horribly late reply (I frequently forget these boards exist) but thanks for this! Always good to get more advice.
