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I am also told I am that guy. You know the one that muilticlass in everyclass cause I can. I build characters on concepts not are they functional in game. I can role play functional. My current concept is really just building on some of my other trying to get down to the good stuff.
So here is what I am looking at:
3 levels of Monk, I like unarmed combat, Plus monastic legacy feat
10 Rouge(survivalist) Archer type. Kind of want the Green Arrow effect. right arrows for the right job etc.
I also like the idea of being able to make it in any enviorment. Key skills
Perception
Stealth
Heal
Survival
Handle Animal(maybe)
I have questions on 2 things really.
How to get my character Nets, Bolas, Whips, and the Sword breaking Dagger. I really like that dagger. Is there anyway to get them without taking four feats?
The second question is kind of up in the air on crafting. Realisticlly my guy would need like 10 different crafts to do what I want him too. So the question is how do you feel about Primitve tech as a craft skill. Allowing one skill to coave working with any primitive(fragile) materal to make anything. Weapons, Baskets, Shelters, Traps etc. In real life I can make most of this with bamboo, and obsidain. So I would like my character to be able too. Any input would be good. I am trying to trim the fat it is the hardest thing for me.
Thanks
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Well, if you were to play a Half Orc, you could take the Beastmaster alternate racial trait (replaces Orc Ferocity): you treat Nets and Whips as martial weapons. Dip 1 level into Fighter to become proficient with all Martial Weapons, and take Exotic Weapon Proficiency (Sword Breaking Dagger) as your bonus feat. If you're allowed character traits, make your Half Orc be half-Shoanti, and take Shoanti Tattoo trait (it's a regional trait). Makes you proficient with Earthbreakers, Klars, and Shoanti Bolas (lethal version of the nonlethal Bolas).
That's the best that I can think of from the top of my head.
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You're welcome. Glad I can help.
If you're willing to change the Weapon Familiarity to something else, you could even squeeze in some more exotic weapons. For example, Chain Fighter would give you Spiked Chain proficiency (only if you aren't found of becoming proficient with any weapon with Orc in its name, and the only one coming to mind would be the Orc Double Axe).
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If you make your monk levels the Sohei archetype, you can get proficiency in all martial weapons without the fighter dip if you go with the half-orc shoanti idea. Although if you were going to be focused on archery, you may want to go Zen Archer instead, 3 levels of zen archer gives you free perfect strike, a free archery feat, free weapon focus in a bow, free point blank master and wisdom to hit with a bow.
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The zen archer even with a fighter dip might still pay off as far as trying to pull off the concept. I am thinking Green Arrow, riddick, Apache type mix. With maybe some Training crzay beast to fight with me. Not sure yet. I like the half-orc for the primitive feel of it. I also thinking about taking the Look human trait/feat not sure which it is, but this would give that riddick feel for seeing in the dark and physical prowless. The archer stuff would be for range and hunting etc survival.
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You're describing a Ranger. Is there a reason you're using Rogue levels instead of Ranger?
Not sure how you feel about 3pp but Super Genius Games has a class Shadow Assassin which would get you all those weapons for a one level dip.
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[Blueluck]I went back and forth on if I should go ranger or rogue. If I go ranger I can't help but want to go trophy hunter/trapper. I decide on rogue for the +2 skill points over the ranger, and a couple of the rogue talents are nice. I agree it is a rogue who thinks he is a ranger. I guess I could go either way and with the Half-orc build it would get me guns too. The other reason I went rogue was for the survivalist archtype. But I could do both,
Half-orc build
3 monk
3 rouge
10 ranger
That would give me the abilites I am looking for and the weapons. If the ranger had the survivalist archtype and or a primitive archtype that covered those weapons then I would go all ranger.
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A Sohei's Unarmed Strike is modified at level 1 to only advance to 4th level. Monastic legacy lets half your non-monk levels count as monk levels, but you are still locked at 1d8 damage no matter how many monk levels you have with Sohei. Spending a feat to add +.5 average damage per attack is a waste imo.
If this isn't for PFS play, you could ask your GM if they would allow you to take Monastic Legacy as a Zen Archer, as the prereqs of "Still Mind class feature and Improved Unarmed strike" could be be argued as Monk level 3.
I suggest that you look over your concept with out the rules once more. That Way i often find i can get a fresh look at how the rules can be used to make my idea come alive. If your concept is carryed by certain feats and rules. Then pehaps you are the guy.
Edit: That came out a bit offensive, sorry.
I meen the guys you are inspired by are all mega cool. So if you make an archer that at level 13 have bab 9 and whoes beat trick is that he can punch folks for 1d8 and only eath every other day. Is that gonna give the Green arrow or Riddick feel?
I think you will be happier with going ranger or arcane archer. with pehaps a dip in monk( sohei or other).
Edit2: sorry for the messy style here my son came and helped me write this.
You can also just throw money at it to get the weapon proficiencies if you wanted. Opalescent white pyramid ioun stones can grant you proficiency in the weapons you want, it will get expensive after 4 or 5 of them though.
I'd scrap the rogue levels and do Zen archer 3/ trapper/(guide or freebooter) ranger 17.
With bonus feats from both classes your archery should be top notch. You're also basically a full bab class. Ranger gets you tons of skills and bonuses on several you want to focus on. You do lose out on 2 sp per level vs a rogue but you get more hp meaning you can take your favored class bonus as skill points and even that out some. Also skill bonuses are cheap to get and most skills don't need to be maxed out, a few points here and there can go along way with a take 10.
For your weapons be a half orc with beastmaster and pick up the swordbreaker with the heirloom weapon trait. That's 3 out of the 4 with no feats.
stat wise you have a choice, you can go traditional archer and pump dex or you can pump wisdom and get better dcs on your traps since the zen archer can use it for to-hit. If you go the wisdom route you'll be a bit weaker at lower levels but should shine more at higher ones.
If I go ranger I can't help but want to go trophy hunter/trapper.
That defeats two of the biggest reasons to use Ranger.
You said you wanted, "Kind of want the Green Arrow effect. right arrows for the right job etc." Trophy Hunger means switching from bows to guns, well, entirely defeating the plan. Also, guns don't really go as well with your survivalist, woodsy approach.
Trapper gets rid of the Ranger's spells, many of which give you cool "arrow abilities": Abundant Ammunition, Deadeye's Arrow, Gravity Bow, Longshot, Arrow Eruption, Ricochet Shot, Versatile Weapon, Venomous Bolt, etc.
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The second question is kind of up in the air on crafting. Realisticlly my guy would need like 10 different crafts to do what I want him too. So the question is how do you feel about Primitve tech as a craft skill. Allowing one skill to coave working with any primitive(fragile) materal to make anything. Weapons, Baskets, Shelters, Traps etc. In real life I can make most of this with bamboo, and obsidain. So I would like my character to be able too. Any input would be good. I am trying to trim the fat it is the hardest thing for me.Thanks
Here i think you need to work with your GM, concerning your expectations to Craft skills. I think the one craft to rule them all( Any tech) may be a bit over powered but Survival and Craft (trap making)may be all you need, since i dont think you plan to sell the stuff you make?
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For your weapons be a half orc with beastmaster and pick up the swordbreaker with the heirloom weapon trait. That's 3 out of the 4 with no feats.
Swordbreaker dagger is an exotic weapon, so you can't use Heirloom Weapon to pick up proficiency with it.
Otherwise, I think Wally's idea may be spot on for the kind of character the OP would like to play. (Although, in the end, the choice is his :)
EDIT: With regards to the craft skills, since you want this character to be like Green Arrow meets Riddick kind of character, try asking your GM if ranks in the skills Profession (Green Arrow) and Profession (Riddick) will count for the craft skills that what you want to use ;-)
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[Cap. Darling] I agree. The base concept I am going for is survival.
Not combat survival parses.
Honestly I can do without the weapon proficiencies just -4 to use them. I can deal with that if I need too.
I want to be able to hunt man or animals or beasties using what Aztec, Incas, or maybe Mayans would have used. The only exception being the sword breaking dagger, I like the look and abilities of it could just have a seriated dagger and be the same. Going for hollow hit survival dagger here;
But as bare min seriated dagger, 50 ropes; week iron rations, water skins (2), Tomahawk; With this I should be able to make everything I need if I was dropped into a hostel environment. I would survive and
more using the key skills
Perception
Stealth
Heal
Survival
Craft: Alchemy, poisons and healing needs
Craft: Primitive tech to cover the other stuff.
Craft: leather work.
Weapons of interest I would like to make and use as needed:
Terbutje: This length of tempered wood, also called a macuahuitl, has bits of shark teeth, obsidian, glass, or similar materials studded all along its length.
Atlatl: Javelin thrower
Bolas
Net
Bows for more range
Darts and a Tomahawk (throwing ax) as well
The bow using rapid shot+many shot would be cool – green arrow like effect
The Dark vision with the deepsight feat would make it 120. Half orc 60ft. And if I could get aspect of the beast it would be Darkvision 150. – Riddick.
I like the unarmed damage of a monk because I would then not need weapons to put up a good fight. Might not win but should be able to stand in the ring.
That’s kind of what I am going for… Some wear in that area anyways.
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For the primitive tech,
A native would have known basketweaving, weapon making, building shelter (huts, lean too, etc) how to field dress a kill and how to use all of the parts of the animal. Hooves for bowels, cups, animal glue(to hold teeth on the Terbutje) That kind of stuff, leather and hide armor, leather,bone, wood shields.
If I kill a bunch of wolfs how to turn them in to food, armor/clothes. Teeth for my weapon. etc. The skills question is why I looked at rogue of ranger to give me more points. I would not be selling the items I made just using them. The only stuff I would sell is if I capture a animal alive and sold it.
Have you ever thought, perhaps, to make a character that actually IS functional so you don't have to pretend to be functional in your RP and then do everything you can to shoot yourself in the foot and prove yourself wrong?
I mean, it makes for a good comedy show (Kinda like "If the 3 Stooges thought they were Green Berets") but I doubt that was the effect you were going for.
Between the +3 bonus for a class skill, +2 to +4 bonus for tools, a decent INT modifier, and a single skill point, it's not hard to get whatever craft skills you want to use up to a level where taking 10 succeeds at nearly any task.
Masterwork tools, Traveler's Any-Tool, All Tools Vest, and eventually Amazing Tools of Manufacture.
Why stop at 3rd level for monk? 4th level is a +1 to BaB, you get your Ki Pool and you can grab a Qinggong ability swapping out Slow fall.
This is probably best. I was thinking about the Animal Companion advancing but seriously with this build I'd recommend taking the freebooter or guide and giving it up.
On Crafting DCs:
Longbow, shortbow, or arrows Bows 12
Composite longbow or composite shortbow Bows 15
Composite longbow or composite shortbow with high strength rating Bows 15 + (2 x rating)
Crossbow, or bolts Weapons 15
Simple melee or thrown weapon Weapons 12
Martial melee or thrown weapon Weapons 15
Exotic melee or thrown weapon Weapons 18
Mechanical trap Traps Varies1
Very simple item (wooden spoon) Varies 5
Typical item (iron pot) Varies 10
High-quality item (bell) Varies 15
Complex or superior item (lock) Varies 20
So to make almost any weapon or any high quality item all you need a 15. but you're taking 10 so you really need 5 points. So 2 skill points in a class and you can't fail. For non class skills you can grab masterwork tools and you still only need 2 points.
On weapons and proficiency:
So this idea is suboptimal. The gnome has bonuses in the wrong places and is small which hurts melee. BUT they do have a optional racial ability you would love:
Master Tinker Gnomes experiment with all manner of mechanical devices. Gnomes with this racial trait gain a +1 bonus on Disable Device and Knowledge (engineering) checks. They are treated as proficient with any weapon they have personally crafted. This racial trait replaces defensive training and hatred.
You're level 13, right? When you say "Crafting" at that level, you're either talking about saving tens of thousands on enchanting your own gear, or you're talking about outfitting an entire army in just days.
Most of the stuff you're talking about crafting is first of all, a complete disconnect from how high-level play works. A ring of sustenance is dirt cheap, constant Endure Elements even cheaper. Also, most of it is either an application of Survival, or a Craft 15 check at most, so a single skill rank should suffice.
More importantly: How do your fellow players feel about you using table time to splash around in the kiddie pool while they're trying to have an adventure?
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If you make your monk levels the Sohei archetype, you can get proficiency in all martial weapons without the fighter dipSohei can significantly out-gun Zen archers in the mid-level game *if* items like Gloves of Dueling can be purchased (i.e., your GM isn't skimping of WBL). I'm talking double the arrows at 7th, with a better attack-bonus.
More importantly: How do your fellow players feel about you using table time to splash around in the kiddie pool (Crafting) while they're trying to have an adventure?
There is nothing as mood-killing as "shopping" (anything related to acquiring gear).
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[Wally the Wizard] I agree with you. I do like the Gnome trait. That way if I craft It I can use it no problems. but like you said it is a Gnome.
[Pupsocket] My character is starting at level 1.I am just getting an idea on how to map him out. Even at high levels when I say crafting I mean making bamboo and obsidan spears, maybe a cage, maybe a basket depends on what is needed for what. At high levels I don't usually by magical weapons or armor. I am happy doing 1d8 maybe a little more at level 13.
"More importantly: How do your fellow players feel about you using table time to splash around in the kiddie pool while they're trying to have an adventure?"
Bashing, burning, destorying, does not an adventure make. I really don't know you what you mean by kiddie pool.(crafting) This is the bread and butter of any real adventuring group. Even in a magic rich fantasy world you will not find everything you need at Adventure's R Us located in every hemlet, village, town. With unlimited supplys of goods that your party wants and needs. So you either make your own or go without.
If the wizard can read a book and the cleric pray then I have time to sharpen a stick, or repair a net, even at high levels.
My GM has kill most of us at one time or other using the environment, Weather; etc. That why want I want to survival the environment. One of my characters died in a landslide, one drown, One froze to death crossing the mountain pass in winter. He got frostbite first.
This tells me that you guys are playing in a wastly different way than my group are. 3 deaths due to enviroment is ALOT in my book.
[Pupsocket] My character is starting at level 1.I am just getting an idea on how to map him out. Even at high levels when I say crafting I mean making bamboo and obsidan spears, maybe a cage, maybe a basket depends on what is needed for what. At high levels I don't usually by magical weapons or armor. I am happy doing 1d8 maybe a little more at level 13.
"More importantly: How do your fellow players feel about you using table time to splash around in the kiddie pool while they're trying to have an adventure?"
Bashing, burning, destorying, does not an adventure make. I really don't know you what you mean by kiddie pool.(crafting) This is the bread and butter of any real adventuring group. Even in a magic rich fantasy world you will not find everything you need at Adventure's R Us located in every hemlet, village, town. With unlimited supplys of goods that your party wants and needs. So you either make your own or go without.If the wizard can read a book and the cleric pray then I have time to sharpen a stick, or repair a net, even at high levels.
We are back at wanting to have the Green Arrow, Riddick feel. IMOP neither of them is content with doing 1d8 at level 13.
It is a balance but in Pathfinder you generally want your charcter to be able to "pull his weight" so to say.In some games GURPS comes to mind it is perfectly possible to go on adventure not packet im magic gear but not in Pathfinder i think.
You really should consider the combination of the human-only feats Fast Learner, Improvisation and Improved Improvisation. The latter two net you -2 non-proficiency with all armor and weapons and allow using any skill that you have no ranks in at a +4 (plus ability score modifiers) - in effect, you get the equivalent of 1 rank +3 class skill in everything for those 2 feats. Pour your actual ranks into Perception, Stealth, Survival, Acrobatics, Climb, Swim and whatever's left into the Craft skills if necessary. The only two Craft skills that you will need beyond a +1 modifier, Improved Improvisation and take 10 are alchemy and traps. (Ok, if you want to take 10 to make a DC of 18, you'll need a +2 modifier and masterwork tools.)
Riddick's darkvision came with light sensitivity by way of cybernetics, so that really translates into either (a) "package" darkvision with light sensitivity in trade for (something), or (b) saving up for goggles of night, or (c) implanting whatever ioun stone it is that grants darkvision (assuming that there is one).