I'm currently finishing Carrion Hill and would like my next game to be S&S but written for goodish characters and I was hoping to bounce some ideas off the board.
Up front caveats as to what I like for my games: PCs to be heroes and I don't particularly like high-level games so I usually cap my games off somewhere around level 10. BTW, I'm not totally familiar with S&S but I think I know enough to be dangerous. :)
The main idea of the campaign will be about revenge from Harrigan and the PCs will be 'good pirates' with a strong bent against slavery.
With that in mind, here are my thoughts. Have all the PCs be 'rescued' by a 'patron' and rescued from Harrigan or his goons. That serves to cement their hatred for Harrigan and gives them a reason to work together (they owe a debt to my patron). My patron tells them to lay low and that the time will come for them to make good on their promise to kill Harrigan.
Patron sends them a message to 'get taken' to the Wormwood. Cue adventure 1, which I don't think needs much of a re-write, if at all. I 'might' change the man's promise to a be a slaver ship but could leave it as is and have the players deal with them doing something bad, under orders but bad nonetheless. Thoughts on Adventure 1?
Adventure 2 can be run pretty much as is with the exception of the 'pirate acts' but I think I can easily make them go after slavers and/or other pirates and/or unscrupulous merchants. The rest of the adventure should be OK.
At the start of adventure 3, the PCs are already at level 7th so I'm already looking for a satisfying way to end this campaign. Could the 'rumors' Tessa has the PCs investigate on Adventure 3 be something my patron asks the PCs to investigate be about a big slaver ring? if so, that would take my PCs to level 9...
Right now I'm leaning to having the end of the campaign as the PCs take down Harrigan after they find out that he's behind the slavers. I know he goes down after a naval defense of the PCs base, which is not doable because the PCs likely would have made NO pirate friends. I'm also not keen on the naval battles, which I heard are only fun for the captain anyways.
So the end could be infiltrating Harrigan's fortress (adventure 5) for which I will have to significantly lower their stats to make it challenging for a group of level 9 PCs or just blow by a couple of levels and have the PCs be level 12. Thoughts?
Patron: I was thinking of making him an Andoran privateer bent on taking down slavers. Thoughts?
I like PCs with good backgrounds so I will tie whatever I can of the campaign to their background so I'm sure things will change some.
How easy will be for my PCs to go around the Shackles and take down some pirates, lots of slavers, and some 'evil' merchants without having a pirate fleet come after them.
Any fatal flaws you guys can spot? And a fix, please.
Thanks for any tips!
No thoughts? No comments?
Either I developed a nit-picker-proof campaign (highly doubtful) or no one really cares, which is very sad for my purposes since I have other questions.
Like... how would the Infamy and Disrepute system work for such a 'pirate crew'?
Should I just screw the patron idea? If so, what would 'bind' the PCs? Just shared experience?
I'm also struggling with the overall theme or goal of this campaign; somehow just 'revenge against Harrigan' doesn't feel 'grand enough'?
But for goodish pirates what else is there with the exception of taking down the whole system which is not really believable nor do I want to take on such a high-level campaign.
Anyone out there feel like helping a fellow GM? Anyone? :)
OK, I promise to stop begging after this post. :)
My initial thoughts on the subject...
Feel free to drop me a line if you want to discuss it further.
I have only gotten to the Man's Promise so far and they are on day 5 there but have not had an issue with most being of good alignment. The camaraderie of the group has kept them together so far and they are about to mutiny on script. What help are you looking for?
@Lopke: I did read that thread.
@Story Archer: I sent you a PM a few days ago...
All;
I have since changed the focus a little bit after reading lots of old posts on the whole AP.
However one question remains.
How easy will be for my PCs to go around the Shackles and take down some pirates, lots of slavers, and some 'evil' merchants without having a pirate fleet come after them?
|
I suppose the question to ask is can your PC's go under cover in the "Gang", "mafia" "Dictator regime" and not go native? Infamy is based on tales of your exploits. What happens when folks start noticing that they don't attack merchant vessels? Because remember it aint just them, they have a whole crew with them.
Thanks for the input.
The way I see it is that they do attack merchant vessels but they are very picky as to which ones.
They also attack slaver ships (a sort of merchant vessel) and also attack pirates (some).
So unless the PCs attack pirates under the protection of a bigger pirate, I would think they would be OK.
It is normal for pirate ships to attack other pirates, right?
I could see pirate A just stole cargo from merchant and is in turn attacked by pirate B who in turn steals the cargo.
My PCs would be pirate B.
Thoughts?
Thanks for the input.
The way I see it is that they do attack merchant vessels but they are very picky as to which ones.
They also attack slaver ships (a sort of merchant vessel) and also attack pirates (some).
So unless the PCs attack pirates under the protection of a bigger pirate, I would think they would be OK.
It is normal for pirate ships to attack other pirates, right?
I could see pirate A just stole cargo from merchant and is in turn attacked by pirate B who in turn steals the cargo.
My PCs would be pirate B.
Thoughts?
While this would be perfectly logical, there is a code among pirates (really more like guidelines) that the targets of piracy are those who pass through those waters from other countries to other countries... This is a nation of pirates after all and pirate on pirate attacks would probably be uncommon enough as to say its not 'the norm'. A few here and there likely wouldn't be a problem beyond creating some gossip, but you never know who had a brother or a protege who might come looking for their revenge. Moreover, should the PC's gain that reputation it might well become open season on them.
More to the point, if the PC's begin to do such a thing regularly, they're bound to come across pirates who are allied or are members of larger fleets - you take down one or two ships of Tessa's or Bonefist's personal fleet you can bet they are going to come looking for you.
|
|
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Thanks for the input.
The way I see it is that they do attack merchant vessels but they are very picky as to which ones.
.
Thoughts?
I cant see any situation that this does not give you evil points. "We only killed people from that nation, so we could TAKE there stuff" And there will be deaths. To flat out attack and kill someone just so you can have your steak instead of hamburger is not neutral.
I cant see any situation that this does not give you evil points. "We only killed people from that nation, so we could TAKE there stuff" And there will be deaths. To flat out attack and kill someone just so you can have your steak instead of hamburger is not neutral.Thanks for the input.
The way I see it is that they do attack merchant vessels but they are very picky as to which ones.
.
Thoughts?
I don't know about that. If I'm at war with the nation of Cheliax and attack their ships in an effort to reduce their power and confiscate their weapons and goods in an effort to pay for my war efforts, I don't see how that is inherently evil within the context of the game. Same thing if I'm targetting slavers in the same manner because I find their trade evil.
It is the difference between a privateer and a pirate although there is usually a government issuing letters of marque to make it legal. It was common practice during the day. Our own government used letters of marque to fight the British although not that successfully. You really needed a navy to back them up which was why the British and French were so much better at it.
|
|
I don't know about that. If I'm at war with the nation of Cheliax and attack their ships in an effort to reduce their power and confiscate their weapons and goods in an effort to pay for my war efforts, I don't see how that is inherently evil within the context of the game. Same thing if I'm targetting slavers in the same manner because I find their trade evil.I cant see any situation that this does not give you evil points. "We only killed people from that nation, so we could TAKE there stuff" And there will be deaths. To flat out attack and kill someone just so you can have your steak instead of hamburger is not neutral.Thanks for the input.
The way I see it is that they do attack merchant vessels but they are very picky as to which ones.
.
Thoughts?
Thats just it, you arnt at "WAR" with cheliax or anyone. You start as a low level person allied with your self. But lets say you figure out a way. How many ships are going to be just cheliax. 1 out of 10, 1 out of 50? How many juicy merchant ships will you let go just for one countries ships? In my game you wouldnt have much of a crew left to sail your ship. Buy it aint mine and if you and your players are happy than give it a go.
Wow! This is more like it. Thanks everyone for their input.
The 'how to be goodish pirates' is an easy fix. As long as my PCs aren't actively engaged in slaughtering defenseless victims then I think they would be OK.
So attacking other pirates is OK, attacking slavers is OK, attacking merchant ships who are 'evil' (obtained their goods through evil acts like exploitation of natives, etc.) is OK. I could even see them attacking merchant ships because they are just rich and letting them go after the PCs take their due. Yes, this last one is stealing but no one bats an eyelash when the PCs go about desecrating ancient tombs. :)
With regards to crew, we are looking at 20-30 individuals who share the same 'goodish viewpoint', which is not an extreme situation in the least.
I agree the PCs would not be at war with anyone but perhaps they could be motivated to strike out at a certain pirate lord from the start. It would be easy for the PCs to have an extreme dislike to anything 'Harrigan' and even though they could not take him on at the beginning, they could start harassing Harrigan pirates.
While on the subject, let me share the 'fluff' that will be used to recruit players. I borrowed heavily from people on the boards for this so if you think you read this somewhere, you probably have. Again, please be kind and provide comments/suggestions.
Thanks guys!
--------
Skull & Shackles ala Fabian – Player’s Guide
I am looking for a ‘goodish’ motley crew with an appreciation for the freedom of the high seas and the willingness to fight for it. In this game, you will be trying to take down Captain Harrigan so think of yourselves not as pirates but as privateers and smugglers. You will not prey on the defenseless and engage on senseless plunder, looting, and pillaging but rather prey on vicious pirates and other unscrupulous merchants. What I am not looking for is a bunch of rape-and-murder types trying to indulge their dark fantasies.
Please work the following into your background. At one point in your past, Dumont D’Argent (see below) saved your ‘butt big time’ (freed you from slavery, found you dying, saved you in a fight, etc.). The details of this event are left up to you but please include Pirate Captain Harrigan as the perpetrator of your woes. At that time, you pledged yourself to Dumont and wanted to join his crew whereas Dumont told you to lay low and that the time would come for you to sail with him. A month ago you received a message telling you that Dumont would be at Port Peril early in July 4713.
Revenge is a B%#~#
Early in the campaign you are likely to make some enemies, some of these enemies will be big and all encompassing, and others will be petty and vindictive. The Shackles is a massive Sandbox, which means not every challenge is beatable at the level you first face it. What does this mean? Sometimes vengeance must wait for the opportune moment.
Captain Dumont D’Argent
Dumont is a living legend in the Shackles. Although, he never held a seat in the Pirate Council, Dumont is well-known by practically every pirate in the Shackles. Captain Dumont is fair to his crew and feared by his enemies and his enemies are sometimes pirates. Dumont preys on particularly vicious pirates, slavers, and unscrupulous merchants. He stands for freedom of the seas and has always walked a fine line between angering the stronger pirate lords and continuing to ply his trade. Slavers, in particular, dread to catch a glimpse of his colors with their bellies full. Although, many times in the past, small pirate fleets have tried to take him down, Dumont somehow found a way to escape and/or defeated them. The captain is well past his prime but tales of these exploits are still sung in every port of the Shackles.
Traits (pick any two)
The PCs will bond through their debt to Dumont D’Argent and may also bond through their hatred of Captain Harrigan. As such, modified traits from the Carrion Crown AP and the Curse of the Crimson Throne AP may be used, substituting Dumont for Professor Lorrimor and Harrigan for Lamm. Bear in mind that some minor modifications will have to be made to make these traits fit the pirate/sea theme of the campaign.
Skills
The campaign is heavy on roleplaying so some sort of social skill will be very useful. You also get 1 extra skill points per level to be used in profession-sailor, craft-ships, or craft-sails; other allocations will be made available for this extra skill point as the campaign advances.
General
This is a pirate-themed campaign so leave your heavily-armored knights in Lastwall and give me some appropriately themed characters (archetypes, bloodlines, domains, etc.). The campaign will entail adventures near, on, and under the sea and ships will be a recurring feature. Since we can’t have pirates without guns, this campaign will use the ‘emerging guns’ category.
I’m also a firm believer in tailoring the campaign to the PCs so make sure there are at least a couple of plot hooks in your background for me to incorporate into the game.
At least one of the predesigned encounters in Raiders of the Fever Sea is based on attacking another pirate.
I told my players that some pirates are defended by might pirate lords, and that if you attack a Tessa Fairwind-allied pirate, you're inviting revenge.. whereas if you're attack non-aligned pirates, there'll be no official revenge. That'll also give them a reason to seek out protection from Tessa Fairwind later in the campaign.
As long as the PC's doesn't solely target pirates, they could take down one or two occasionaly, without raising much fuss.
As for recruiting the right crewmembers, that's what detect alignment is for. My players have an anti-paladin, and routinely screen new crew to prevent good guys from joining their ranks. You could easily do the opposite, and keep out the worst evildoers when picking up sailors. They might end up with a few CN-pirates (that seems an appropiate alignment for some pirates), but that's not a big problem.
Furthermore, as rumours spread, they'll attract the crew they want. "Hey, don't go near that captain, I hear he only attacks Aspis Consortium, Chelians and slavers. If you want fat pickings, go elsewhere!" will discourage most Evil pirates, and might even attract a Good'ish crewmate looking for adventure.
@BzAli: thanks for the comments. What you described is pretty much how I see the Shackles being. I'm sure there is preying between pirates. I would even go as far as to say that if my group aligns itself with Tessa (or someone else) and as long as they give Tessa her due (plunder), they could pretty much do what they wanted short of really pissing off a strong pirate lord.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Just FYI, I've gotten through book 1 and my PCs are tacking towards being more merciful than not with no urging from me or the game. They are also against slavery as a whole and merciful towards their crew. They showed mercy to two pirates who fought against them in the final fight against Plugg and Scourge. They encountered the Ginger Belle and actuall haggled for the slaves aboard, bought them and then emancipated them.
The point of me writing this is that in my experience so far, if your PCs have the mindset that they want to be good-natured, jolly buccaneers instead of malicious murderers and pilagers, you don't really need to worry about changing anything because the AP so far has enough leeway for them to do what they like.
Also as a side note: Take the time to BUILD YOUR NPC CREW'S PERSONALITIES! I can't stress this enough. On the Ginger Belle, the PCs thought they could probably kill the primaries on that boat if they wanted to, but realized that their crew would take casualties in the fight and they like them too much to treat them like game pieces. So, they decided to play ball with the slavers, haggled down the price and bought the slaves!
I'm also thinking of using Merril Pegsworthy as an example of a "good pirate" my PCs should tend to warm towards when they meet him. He'll explain that he sails under Tessa Fairwind's fleet and should they impress him and want to join to build their reputation and come find them later.
I'm also, just for fun, designing another NPC captain they'll meet who represents the darker side of piracy. He will try to entice them into a mission for him against a common foe, and then offer a route in that different direction.
Thanks for the input Shaun.
I guess with me stating the campaign intentions up front, then the PCs that want to play shouldn't have any issues being 'goodish pirates'.
Those that don't want to play along need not apply. :)