to hit issues


Advice


i am a druid lvl 6.
str = 16 (20 as large animal) and i find that with power attack i am only +7 to hit .... hence, not to much.
druid are VERY feat starved and the DM keep's us really thin on items.

as such, i find that i mostly need to not use power attack, which lower alot the damage.

ANY tips?


Furious Focus, Greater Magic Fang, and an Amulet of Mighty Fists are a start.


Cataphor wrote:
Furious Focus, Greater Magic Fang, and an Amulet of Mighty Fists are a start.

well... Furious Focus - only work on att #1, great if i'll go the path of vital strike and 1 big kaboom...

magic fang is already in the above to hit.
and the amulet wont stack with the spell.

we can create magic items, (although we are VERY poor) but we cant buy any.

The Exchange

Switch to battlefield control with your spells and watch the DM pull his hair out when none of the monsters can get you.

or

Avoid power attack until you can do it effectively, like when your a huge constrictor with air swim, longstrider and greater magic fang


mmm...
sounds legit... so go to be a summoner / buffer a bit more - and strike when opponent are with less AC / in the flank.

also - it might be worth not taking the tiger / many attack form and really focus on a 1 hit wonder.
than, with vital strike, power att adn furious focus, aid and flank with the pet and full greater magic wepon - i might do some real pain

Grand Lodge

Flank, catch foe flat-footed, attack from higher ground, entangle the foe, attack from below with a burrow speed.

There a lot of options.

What is your build?


what's attack from below with a burrow speed. got to do with it ?
it will keep me alive, but wont allow me better hits:)
build: (we have special rule that allow retrain 1 feat every 4 lvls)
str: 16, dex:14, con: 14, int :10, wis :16, cha: 8
hp = 56
ac = 14 as wild shape (poor)
feats: power att, natural spell, spell focus (conj), craft wonderous items.

total gold : 3K
items: scimitar +1, hide +1 some potions of healing.

animal companion: dead, planning to grab a new boar or wolf.

future feat planning: lvl 7=aug summoner lvl 9 = either vital strike or planar wild shape.

Grand Lodge

When you hit from below, you catch the opponent flat-footed.


? where did you found that? sound nice!


I'd suggest skipping Vital Strike in favor of Furious Focus. The attack bonus will benefit you more than the damage die.

Increasing your number of attack rolls is a good way to get more hits, so choosing an animal from with 3 or even 5 attacks is good.

As mentioned above, flanking is your friend:)


true...
so future feat plan :
lvl 7 : aug summoning
lvl 8 : retrain craft wonderous for furious focus
lvl 9 : vital strike or planar wild shape.

niot bad


How are you going to retrain a feat?


special house rule... we got retrain for feats every 4 lvl (1 only) likr fighter do.
to prevent mistakes.


Do Fighters get to retrain their Bonus feats and their level progression feats?


yap


Nice...

Though before to long you might want to pick Craft Wondrous Items again after a while if you don't have another character in the party with it.


i agree... pitty there're so many great feats with so few slots.
is there another feat list you think is better?


If your GM is keeping you cash starved try asking him if you can use harvested materials from unusual creatures as components to make items in place of cash as it is more thematic and he can still limit your selection by saying "Hmmm well yes the iron spikes from that manticore can be used to make enchanted shield spikes or a magical morning star but it's not suitable for that amulet of natural armor ect."


Power attack, like deadly aim, is frequently a poor feat choice for 3/4 BAB combatants. You are already having to struggle to keep up with a full BAB progression, anything that reduces your to hit is generally a bad idea.

Bull's strength is your friend here though.


blackbloodtroll wrote:
When you hit from below, you catch the opponent flat-footed.

Where do you see this BBT? I've not heard this before.

Grand Lodge

Adamantine Dragon wrote:
blackbloodtroll wrote:
When you hit from below, you catch the opponent flat-footed.
Where do you see this BBT? I've not heard this before.

Whilst in the ground, you have total concealment.

It makes you effectively invisible.


how ever, while in the ground, you cant see either...
no tremorsense - not even via items or spells.


Adamantine Dragon wrote:

Power attack, like deadly aim, is frequently a poor feat choice for 3/4 BAB combatants. You are already having to struggle to keep up with a full BAB progression, anything that reduces your to hit is generally a bad idea.

Bull's strength is your friend here though.

so save it to use with furious focus on 1 hit wonder only i guess.


blackbloodtroll wrote:
Adamantine Dragon wrote:
blackbloodtroll wrote:
When you hit from below, you catch the opponent flat-footed.
Where do you see this BBT? I've not heard this before.

Whilst in the ground, you have total concealment.

It makes you effectively invisible.

OK, so "hitting while in the ground with total concealment" is not remotely the same thing as "hitting from below."

Also "burrowing" is not necessarily going to allow you to "hit from the ground with concealment". This might work in earth elemental form where you can literally move through the earth, but a medium sized creature "burrowing" in the ground is not going to be something that escapes notice, and if your target can't see you, how can you see your target? If you are concealed from your target by the dirt, then your target would also be concealed from you. Unless you can show me some rule that allows "peeking" through the ground to hit your opponent.


666bender wrote:
Adamantine Dragon wrote:

Power attack, like deadly aim, is frequently a poor feat choice for 3/4 BAB combatants. You are already having to struggle to keep up with a full BAB progression, anything that reduces your to hit is generally a bad idea.

Bull's strength is your friend here though.

so save it to use with furious focus on 1 hit wonder only i guess.

So, how is a wild-shaped druid using furious focus anyway?


Adamantine Dragon wrote:
blackbloodtroll wrote:
Adamantine Dragon wrote:
blackbloodtroll wrote:
When you hit from below, you catch the opponent flat-footed.
Where do you see this BBT? I've not heard this before.

Whilst in the ground, you have total concealment.

It makes you effectively invisible.

OK, so "hitting while in the ground with total concealment" is not remotely the same thing as "hitting from below."

Also "burrowing" is not necessarily going to allow you to "hit from the ground with concealment". This might work in earth elemental form where you can literally move through the earth, but a medium sized creature "burrowing" in the ground is not going to be something that escapes notice, and if your target can't see you, how can you see your target? If you are concealed from your target by the dirt, then your target would also be concealed from you. Unless you can show me some rule that allows "peeking" through the ground to hit your opponent.

Considering Incorporeal creatures still suffer 50% miss chance on their attacks while remaining within objects and a PC is allowed to ready an action to hit them as their attacking appendage exits the ground, I find it hard to believe a physically corporeal creature displacing the ground would have an advantage the incorporeal creature doesn't.

Dark Archive

Weapon focus claw

If your characters are so poor, read up on the expected wealth value of characters by level on page 399 of the core rule book and ask the GM if they want to reconsider character wealth.

I concur power attack on a 3/4 is usually not a good idea.

Grand Lodge

Brotato wrote:
Adamantine Dragon wrote:


OK, so "hitting while in the ground with total concealment" is not remotely the same thing as "hitting from below."

Also "burrowing" is not necessarily going to allow you to "hit from the ground with concealment". This might work in earth elemental form where you can literally move through the earth, but a medium sized creature "burrowing" in the ground is not going to be something that escapes notice, and if your target can't see you, how can you see your target? If you are concealed from your target by the dirt, then your target would also be concealed from you. Unless you can show me some rule that allows "peeking" through the ground to hit your opponent.

Considering Incorporeal creatures still suffer 50% miss chance on their attacks while remaining within objects and a PC is allowed to ready an action to hit them as their attacking appendage exits the ground, I find it hard to believe a physically corporeal creature displacing the ground would have an advantage the incorporeal creature doesn't.

Weird thing to get offended by.

I am sorry I offended.

Using burrow, to gain total concealment, stealth in process, then catch the opponent flat-footed, is a tactic I have seen used.

If it was totally wrong, and so was the players, and DMs I have seen using the tactic, then by all means, show me the error of my ways.

I could actually use that to my advantage.


Brotato wrote:
Adamantine Dragon wrote:
blackbloodtroll wrote:
Adamantine Dragon wrote:
blackbloodtroll wrote:
When you hit from below, you catch the opponent flat-footed.
Where do you see this BBT? I've not heard this before.

Whilst in the ground, you have total concealment.

It makes you effectively invisible.

OK, so "hitting while in the ground with total concealment" is not remotely the same thing as "hitting from below."

Also "burrowing" is not necessarily going to allow you to "hit from the ground with concealment". This might work in earth elemental form where you can literally move through the earth, but a medium sized creature "burrowing" in the ground is not going to be something that escapes notice, and if your target can't see you, how can you see your target? If you are concealed from your target by the dirt, then your target would also be concealed from you. Unless you can show me some rule that allows "peeking" through the ground to hit your opponent.

Considering Incorporeal creatures still suffer 50% miss chance on their attacks while remaining within objects and a PC is allowed to ready an action to hit them as their attacking appendage exits the ground, I find it hard to believe a physically corporeal creature displacing the ground would have an advantage the incorporeal creature doesn't.

What BBT is describing sounds much more like Cover than Concealment to me. Line of effect is going to get blocked by the earth.


blackbloodtroll wrote:
Brotato wrote:
Adamantine Dragon wrote:


OK, so "hitting while in the ground with total concealment" is not remotely the same thing as "hitting from below."

Also "burrowing" is not necessarily going to allow you to "hit from the ground with concealment". This might work in earth elemental form where you can literally move through the earth, but a medium sized creature "burrowing" in the ground is not going to be something that escapes notice, and if your target can't see you, how can you see your target? If you are concealed from your target by the dirt, then your target would also be concealed from you. Unless you can show me some rule that allows "peeking" through the ground to hit your opponent.

Considering Incorporeal creatures still suffer 50% miss chance on their attacks while remaining within objects and a PC is allowed to ready an action to hit them as their attacking appendage exits the ground, I find it hard to believe a physically corporeal creature displacing the ground would have an advantage the incorporeal creature doesn't.

Weird thing to get offended by.

I am sorry I offended.

Using burrow, to gain total concealment, stealth in process, then catch the opponent flat-footed, is a tactic I have seen used.

If it was totally wrong, and so was the players, and DMs I have seen using the tactic, then by all means, show me the error of my ways.

I could actually use that to my advantage.

I don't get offended on the internet BBT, I'm too old. =)

On a conceptual level I actually think you have a solid strategy. The problem is the rules don't play out that way, at least not beyond the first attack. The incorporeal special quality states that

Quote:
An incorporeal creature inside an object has total cover, but when it attacks a creature outside the object it only has cover, so a creature outside with a readied action could strike at it as it attacks.

The moment a creature's appendage leaves the ground, the creature goes from total to only partial cover. This leaves it open to readied attacks.

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