|
Looked at the Word in its indoeuropean roots are pele- (citadel) + gzwher (to ruin) So 'ruined citadel' (with a hint of a hill or high place). So is there is there a big Hill/Citadel in Fallujah? Maybe the Hill is the Ruined Citadel? I figure the Name isn't therefore the original name of the site. You don't go around naming your Citadel - Ruined Citadel.
I looked at the the hebrew word for it. the Pu is a dead give away: Pu at the beginning of the word means 'to rot'. So 'Ruined Citadel' from the arabic roots, 'to Rot' (as in corpses - something that puts the hebrew sources at the scene of the crime) from the hebrew roots. Care to give me another name for this citadel that predates the two out of four horsemen of the apocalypse?
So the only real solution will be to find the citadel. SO anyone been to fallujah and see a hill?
Fallujah is a city of 350 thousand people... theres probably a few hills in it.
The name comes from Pallgutha though, which I think you were getting at, But that is a Syriac language, which is in the Semitic language family and not in the Indo-European family.
.
Another problem is 2,500 years of erosion -- simple rain + wind will grind
any hill flat over that time span. So, looking at the terrain today can
only lend clues.
The real work will have to be by excavation. And observing if a cadre of discovered,
underground artifacts in a small area match what would have existed in the/a citadel circa 500 B.C.
Trying to match today's terrain against yester-year's will be probably be
prohibitively difficult.
.
It doesn't look like it.
.
Possible way to proceed:
1. Find the erosion rates for various densities of earth/ground. I presume
over time loose dirt will erode faster than granite rock, for example.
Geology nerds should have databases with this kind of stuff.
2. Determine with an area map the distribution of ground density over the
Fallujah area. (Maybe oil companies and other people who drill for energy
will already have this constructed and/or maybe the geology nerds will
have this info in their databases too. E.g. ground penetrating radar.)
3. Write a computer model to do reverse erosion over the last 2,500 years.
That is, starting with today's area map and known erosion rates re-constitute
the layers of earth. Then, see if any hills pop up.
.
I will do step 3, if you guys can get me stuff from steps 1 & 2.
.
Fallujah is located in a river basin beside the Euphrates isn't it?
You could also just check wikipedia..."The current name of the city is thought to come from its Syriac name, Pallgutha, which is derived from the word division or "canal regulator" since it was the location where the water of the Euphrates River divided into a canal."
.
This lines of questions is interesting, but what are you trying to tell us?
.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Fallujah is located in a river basin beside the Euphrates isn't it?
You could also just check wikipedia..."The current name of the city is thought to come from its Syriac name, Pallgutha, which is derived from the word division or "canal regulator" since it was the location where the water of the Euphrates River divided into a canal."
.
This lines of questions is interesting, but what are you trying to tell us?
.
He's saying that half baked linguistic interpretation doesn't hold up to the fact that the place is currently a bowling alley and it takes more than a few thousand years to get that way.
.
Oh, how long does it take then?
.
|
|
The name comes from Pallgutha though, which I think you were getting at, But that is a Syriac language, which is in the Semitic language family and not in the Indo-European family.
You say that like its true - Semitic has protoindoeuropean roots just like every other language. Denying it ain't gonna a make it otherwise.
|
|
He's saying that half baked linguistic interpretation doesn't hold up to the fact that the place is currently a bowling alley and it takes more than a few thousand years to get that way.Fallujah is located in a river basin beside the Euphrates isn't it?
You could also just check wikipedia..."The current name of the city is thought to come from its Syriac name, Pallgutha, which is derived from the word division or "canal regulator" since it was the location where the water of the Euphrates River divided into a canal."
.
This lines of questions is interesting, but what are you trying to tell us?
.
The Word means 'ruined citadel. A lot of hills on which ancient citadels were built are made entirely of mud brick hills... So they didn't have hills so they built one. The remains could be fifteen feet down and nothing more than a clay shield separating neolithic levels from the levels of sand that followed.
|
The name comes from Pallgutha though, which I think you were getting at, But that is a Syriac language, which is in the Semitic language family and not in the Indo-European family.You say that like its true - Semitic has protoindoeuropean roots just like every other language. Denying it ain't gonna a make it otherwise.
While it's true that Semitic has PIE roots, I'll pick the nit of "every other language".
There are plenty of languages that don't have PIE roots except for words borrowed from modern IE languages.
As for Fallujah, the whole area was pretty flat.
The name comes from Pallgutha though, which I think you were getting at, But that is a Syriac language, which is in the Semitic language family and not in the Indo-European family.You say that like its true - Semitic has protoindoeuropean roots just like every other language. Denying it ain't gonna a make it otherwise.
Semitic is not descended from PIE.
Sorry?
I can't tell if you are a crazy person or not...
The name comes from Pallgutha though, which I think you were getting at, But that is a Syriac language, which is in the Semitic language family and not in the Indo-European family.You say that like its true - Semitic has protoindoeuropean roots just like every other language. Denying it ain't gonna a make it otherwise.Semitic is not descended from PIE.
Sorry?
I can't tell if you are a crazy person or not...
... seriously, you're going to call someone crazy for holding a contrary position on an obscure point of linguistics without even offering an argument for your position.
The name comes from Pallgutha though, which I think you were getting at, But that is a Syriac language, which is in the Semitic language family and not in the Indo-European family.You say that like its true - Semitic has protoindoeuropean roots just like every other language. Denying it ain't gonna a make it otherwise.Semitic is not descended from PIE.
Sorry?
I can't tell if you are a crazy person or not...
... seriously, you're going to call someone crazy for holding a contrary position on an obscure point of linguistics without even offering an argument for your position.
I am going to ponder his craziness openly yes.
... seriously, you're going to call someone crazy for holding a contrary position on an obscure point of linguistics without even offering an argument for your position.The name comes from Pallgutha though, which I think you were getting at, But that is a Syriac language, which is in the Semitic language family and not in the Indo-European family.You say that like its true - Semitic has protoindoeuropean roots just like every other language. Denying it ain't gonna a make it otherwise.Semitic is not descended from PIE.
Sorry?
I can't tell if you are a crazy person or not...
.
Who cares about the name? I vote we summon a few geology nerds.
And then run some computer simulations. (That's what they always do in
the movies, just before winning the game.)
.
Admittedly I might be being rash, but the words he mentioned don't refer to what he said they refer to, and they aren't even from the same language family.
Yes summon the nerds!
.
We need to score one if those Gibson's too, baby.
You know the ones they use to do physics and look for oil and stuff.
.
|
|
The name comes from Pallgutha though, which I think you were getting at, But that is a Syriac language, which is in the Semitic language family and not in the Indo-European family.You say that like its true - Semitic has protoindoeuropean roots just like every other language. Denying it ain't gonna a make it otherwise.Semitic is not descended from PIE.
Sorry?
I can't tell if you are a crazy person or not...
Yes it is...and the stronger the culture - the closer it is to the original protoindoeuropean roots.
Even fifty thousand year old Australian Aboriginal Languages has Protoindoeuropean Roots in it - Many of the Words are now fixed group objects and the language is working from a 'reduced instruction set' but they are closer to Protoindoeuropean roots than languages in which peoples mingled and civilizations collapsed and built anew.
Semitic word for'water' is 'may', and in Protoindoeuropean 'meigh' is 'to urinate' and 'mezg' is to dip/plunge' so don't give me that ploop about not having protoindoeuropean roots.
All languages have inter-connectivity to the Protoindoeuropean origin - even if the word for water is now 'pee' on account of living in a desert and having to drink ones own...
Not all languages are related to PIE.
PIE is believed to be as old as 7000 BC, but humans were probably able to talk before that and probably even had a language. From what I've just been reading, it looks like Sino-Tibetian comparisons with PIE have not been particularly fruitful in revealing a strong relationship.
.
Is there an experimentalist in the house?
.
|
|
I am going to ponder his craziness openly yes.The name comes from Pallgutha though, which I think you were getting at, But that is a Syriac language, which is in the Semitic language family and not in the Indo-European family.You say that like its true - Semitic has protoindoeuropean roots just like every other language. Denying it ain't gonna a make it otherwise.Semitic is not descended from PIE.
Sorry?
I can't tell if you are a crazy person or not...
... seriously, you're going to call someone crazy for holding a contrary position on an obscure point of linguistics without even offering an argument for your position.
Why cover old ground? Yellowdingo is our resident crazy uncle. We know this, he knows this, we accept it because sometimes he's funny, sometimes he's bizarre, but he's almost always entertaining.
|
|
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Why cover old ground? Yellowdingo is our resident crazy uncle. We know this, he knows this, we accept it because sometimes he's funny, sometimes he's bizarre, but he's almost always entertaining.I am going to ponder his craziness openly yes.The name comes from Pallgutha though, which I think you were getting at, But that is a Syriac language, which is in the Semitic language family and not in the Indo-European family.You say that like its true - Semitic has protoindoeuropean roots just like every other language. Denying it ain't gonna a make it otherwise.Semitic is not descended from PIE.
Sorry?
I can't tell if you are a crazy person or not...
... seriously, you're going to call someone crazy for holding a contrary position on an obscure point of linguistics without even offering an argument for your position.
That's why Hustonderek is my favourite internephew - he knows I will think of him fondly. Either that or he is sucking up - "Hustonderek! There is no inheritance! I am melting down my 1895 threepence."