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Um, I don't remember espousing agreement. I basically called one guy a liar, another an a+@*~**, and said the third was crazy. I'd still like to hear something that one of these guys said that matches accusing the President of the United States of masterminding spree shootings in order to further an agenda of gun control laws.What more can you ask for, Hit dice just gave you some and you just basically agree that they are right. You prove my point, you agree with your crazy so they are OK.Fair enough. I'd still like to see Andrew R provide me with an example he thinks meets the same level of batpoop crazy as Mustaine's ramblings though.
I won't argue with you on your judgement of their political views and/or sanity. I would, however, point out that many of my less informed brothers and sisters have looked at statements by these four people and said, "Oh, God, what a nutcase!"
I guess my point is, once you get to that level of nut-bag, political affiliation is the least of your worries.
Look at what damn near every liberal had to say about bush. Rosie O'donnal and her group, jeneane Garaphalo, etc. Kanye the jackass west.
What more can you ask for, Hit dice just gave you some and you just basically agree that they are right. You prove my point, you agree with your crazy so they are OK.Fair enough. I'd still like to see Andrew R provide me with an example he thinks meets the same level of batpoop crazy as Mustaine's ramblings though.
I won't argue with you on your judgement of their political views and/or sanity. I would, however, point out that many of my less informed brothers and sisters have looked at statements by these four people and said, "Oh, God, what a nutcase!"
I guess my point is, once you get to that level of nut-bag, political affiliation is the least of your worries.
To quote Mr. Incredible, "You're not affiliated with me!"
Cause I know those three I offered as examples frequently get called crazy, but nothing they've actually said (like, quotes) actually was ever quite so crazy as Mustaine's nonsense. Honestly? It looks like a guy who's fallen off the Top 40 trying stay in the media spotlight or something.
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What more can you ask for, Hit dice just gave you some and you just basically agree that they are right. You prove my point, you agree with your crazy so they are OK.Fair enough. I'd still like to see Andrew R provide me with an example he thinks meets the same level of batpoop crazy as Mustaine's ramblings though.
I won't argue with you on your judgement of their political views and/or sanity. I would, however, point out that many of my less informed brothers and sisters have looked at statements by these four people and said, "Oh, God, what a nutcase!"
I guess my point is, once you get to that level of nut-bag, political affiliation is the least of your worries.
To quote Mr. Incredible, "You're not affiliated with me!"
Cause I know those three I offered as examples frequently get called crazy, but nothing they've actually said (like, quotes) actually was ever quite so crazy as Mustaine's nonsense. Honestly? It looks like a guy who's fallen off the Top 40 trying stay in the media spotlight or something.
I think most celeb stupidity is just a play for attention regardless of political or religious content
Andrew, do you think "the Crazy" has an objective existence that you can identify?
Yep, they are not hard to find. It is simple, but hard to spot the crazy if you agree with it.You just typed "crazy liberal quotes" into Google and linked the first result.
If you do not see some serious mustaine level crazy in this YOU are the nut.
One of the guys quoted was Heinrich Himmler. Yes, what an upstanding liberal that guy was. o.O
And some of the comments were just anti-gun comments, I don't see how that justifies the "crazy liberal" label.Oh, there's a Mussolini quote too. Yet another well known liberal...
Dude, do some serious work instead of just doing what basically amounts to a copy-past job from any site you find. Do you even know if all the quotes are rightly attributed to the right person?
Andrew, do you think "the Crazy" has an objective existence that you can identify?Eh, crazy is relative but i see it on all sides, even in people that are sort of on the same side as me but take it far too far. But most folks just see anything but their own view as crazy, like this case.
Wait, so you agree with Mustaine? Are you saying that what he said isn't crazy?
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Wait, so you agree with Mustaine? Are you saying that what he said isn't crazy?Andrew, do you think "the Crazy" has an objective existence that you can identify?Eh, crazy is relative but i see it on all sides, even in people that are sort of on the same side as me but take it far too far. But most folks just see anything but their own view as crazy, like this case.
No i do not, i just pointed out the simple fact that i am sick of always hearing folks condemn people like him but not a peep when nutty liberal types have said such insane things. look at half of the stuff said about bush and his people for instance. Disagree with policy all you want but his critics went to nutty-land often with not a complaint here
This is exactly the line of questioning that gets threads locks, but which nutty liberal types, and what did they say? I'd really love an actual quote in answer to that question.
It's very easy to spread rumors, but actual research takes a little more effort.
Chief Creative Officer, Publisher
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This is dumb. Can we go back to talking about Megadeth?
Because of the goal here is to make sure all celebrities having boring political opinions that never rock the boat, well, that's pretty lame in general. Guess what? Not everyone agrees with you, and some of them are douches.
As I said in my original post in this thread: Not News.
I do agree with the poster who said that the last couple of Megadeth albums have backslid lyrically, even if the music is getting better. I'd actually chart the lowpoint at United Abominations, though. Some of the political songs on there are just horse-poop.
I especially like the line about how "the enemy" (i.e. "liberals") are spreading "sex and violence in the kindergartens."
Um, what?
Can we please get back to singing songs about doing deals with the devil again?
OBEY!
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http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2011/08/18/garofalo_herman_cain_bein g_paid_to_run_he_suffers_from_stockholm_syndrome.html
http://newsbusters.org/blogs/noel-sheppard/2009/04/16/garofalo-tea-partiers -are-all-racists-who-hate-black-president
When Communist U.S.S.R. was a superpower, the world was better off. The right-wing media is trying to marginalize the peace movement.
Janeane Garofalo
Read more at http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/j/janeane_garofalo.html#PLZILMbwx 0gVwRTd.99
When I see the American flag, I go, 'Oh my God, you're insulting me.'
Janeane Garofalo
Read more at http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/j/janeane_garofalo.html#PLZILMbwx 0gVwRTd.99
Well there are a few from one liberal hero that never raised an eyebrow here
This is dumb. Can we go back to talking about Megadeth?
Because of the goal here is to make sure all celebrities having boring political opinions that never rock the boat, well, that's pretty lame in general. Guess what? Not everyone agrees with you, and some of them are douches.
As I said in my original post in this thread: Not News.
I do agree with the poster who said that the last couple of Megadeth albums have backslid lyrically, even if the music is getting better. I'd actually chart the lowpoint at United Abominations, though. Some of the political songs on there are just horse-poop.
I especially like the line about how "the enemy" (i.e. "liberals") are spreading "sex and violence in the kindergartens."
Um, what?
Can we please get back to singing songs about doing deals with the devil again?
OBEY!
If Megadeath ("Megadeath?" What are they, 12?) wants to do political songs, they should start by listening to some Dead Kennedys. Only they can't, because their heads would explode from the awesome.
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look at half of the stuff said about bush and his people for instance.
Like what?
That Bush isn't a particularly smart guy and doesn't really have a talent for political nuance, especially in foreign policy? He's said so himself. Heck that was practically his campaign platform.That he went to war on less than compelling evidence and had decided to do so before 9/11 even happened? It's the truth. Bush called himself a war president before 9/11, which seemed bonkers at the time. They were drawing up plans for an invasion of Iraq by mid 2001.
These aren't crazy things. Or rather, they are crazy things in that it's astonishing that these things happen, but they're factual.
NO ONE listens to 9/11 truthers (who tend to be right-wingers as much as left-wingers IME) or Kanye West.
Crazy is crazy and I'm happy to point it out on either side, and I do. And I honestly see SOOO much more coming from the conservative side. Which is why I've slid so far left politically.
I was a card carrying member of the Libertarian Party for many years.
Well there are a few from one liberal hero that never raised an eyebrow here
Janeane Garofalo is a liberal hero?
No, she really isn't.
Hey, Bugleyman, it's MegaDETH, not Mega"death".
Geez, man.
;)
The sad part is...I knew that. They were pretty popular when I was in high school. My brain just autocorrects "deth" to "death." In fact, I actually had to go back and correct *this* post...
I never cared too much if the person who produced something has different beliefs then I do. Sure, it would be great if everyone came around to my way of thinking, but that doesn't affect the quality of their music or the truth of their science. As long as they aren't trying to make some law against what I do, they can believe what ever they want.
You want to see what happens when Metal and politics collide:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8FbBpvoYKpc&feature=related
And of course, Frank Zappa:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lxB-ZePpS7E
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Chief Creative Officer, Publisher
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I saw Garofalo in concert last year, and I'm sorry to say she was absolutely terrible. Unprepared would have been an understatement. It was cringeworthy.
So really, I think A Man in Black's "third-rate" comment is pretty spot on.
Anyway, it's not a crime to say political stuff. It may be bad business, but it's not a crime. If you don't like Janeane Garofalo's comments and it bugs you so much, don't buy her stuff (same as you did with the Dixie Chicks). ;)
If you don't like Dave Mustaine's paranoia and insanity, well, you probably haven't been paying too much attention to him since he was kicked out of Metallica, and it's probably safe to continue ignoring him just as you have for the last 25 years.
"Shut up and sing" is a pretty lame approach, in my opinion, no matter which side of the aisle you fall on. People are people, and some of them believe dumb stuff. In fact, some of them probably think that YOU believe some dumb stuff.
If you don't like it, don't buy it.
Whatever. Best to just listen to Hangar 18 and not worry too much about it.
I just never dug Megadeth. Maybe it is his voice, I dunno. I dig all the NWOBHM stuff, and Metallica, and Sepultura, lots of industrial metal, and some early black metal (Samael, Tiamat) but somehow my education in metal just skipped right over Megadeth.
I think the level of craziness or asshattery has to be seen in the light of the amount of actual political clout someone has.
People actually listen to someone like Glenn Beck or Mike Huckabee or Michael Savage, they have huge followings and the power to influence a lot of people.
Dave Mustaine? Ted Nugent? Jeanine Garofalo? Kanye West? Everyone, on both sides, should just shake their head and walk away.
What Mustaine said, though, is pretty outrageously wackadoo.
Thinking that all republicans are racists is absurd hyperbole, thinking that the black president arranged for a white supremacist to shoot up a Sikh temple to drum up support for gun control is freaking tinfoil hat.
It's one thing to have polarized political viewpoints. It's another thing entirely to accuse someone of orchestrating mass murder. I'm used to hearing celebrities say stupid stuff, just not usually of that order of magnitude.
I got to see Megadeth perform in a small club called the Pink Cadillac in Hawaii, during their Rust in Peace tour. It was great. They barely had enough room on stage for the equipment, instruments, and band. I was surprised they were in a small venue and not the arena, but it was worth it. Great show.
This is why you don't tell musicians to shut up and sing.
Yes, I am aware that Tom Morello is a guitarist.
Was wondering when someone would bring that up.
<3 Tom Morello.
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Chief Creative Officer, Publisher
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Mustaine has been in tinfoil hat territory for years and years and years. It's just that his post-heroin evangelical Christian turn has added a right-wing template to what had previously been a sort of incoherent anti-establishmentarianism. I find it boring and ill-informed and a bit destructive to the Megadeth "brand," but it's a free country and the guy is entitled to say whatever dumb stuff leaks out of his melty brain.
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Ugh, all you metalheads, /shudder.
Some of us prefer Bad Religion, their songs are very short, but literate.
Runk Pock 4eva!!
Meat: It's ok that you are so, so, wrong about this, but hey, if you make products I won't hold it against you. ;)
I'm wrong about not liking Megadeth? Or...?
Ugh, all you metalheads, /shudder.
Some of us prefer Bad Religion, their songs are very short, but literate.
Runk Pock 4eva!!
By and large american hardcore punk bored the snot out of me.
I like the artsier fringe of the punk/new-wave movement. Wire. PiL. Suicide. Post-punk.And then there's some cool stuff that grew out of the hardcore scene, too, like Dinosaur Jr. and Husker Du. Arguably Big Black.
Yes, naturally.
I don't really have an opinion, honestly. Like I said I was never really exposed to their stuff the way I was to NWOBHM bands and industrial like Godflesh and Ministry and Fear Factory.
Like me some Slayer though.
I knew Mustaine wasn't playing with a full deck when he got up in the business of Mike Muir from Suicidal Tendencies during the Clash of the Titans tour. That's not a guy you want to mess with. At least he didn't accept the challenge to an onstage fight...
Ugh, all you metalheads, /shudder.
Some of us prefer Bad Religion, their songs are very short, but literate.
Runk Pock 4eva!!
By and large american hardcore punk bored the snot out of me.
I like the artsier fringe of the punk/new-wave movement. Wire. PiL. Suicide. Post-punk.And then there's some cool stuff that grew out of the hardcore scene, too, like Dinosaur Jr. and Husker Du. Arguably Big Black.
Honestly, Meat, we should probably start another thread for this but Punk is a very interesting art/design conceptual movement, but a lot of the music is really, really crappy. Across the pond, in the UK, it's a political movement, which is an entirely different thing.
When all the american punk rockers screamed, "Anarchy!" they were talking about getting high and knocking things over; when all the british punk rockers screamed, "Anarchy!" it was a political argument against the Monarchy. Just a completely different mindset.
(This has nothing to do with Mustaine's nonsense.)
I always went in for New Wave.
Maybe this belongs in the "Did you know?" thread but here goes:
Did you know that Devo were discovered by David Bowie and Iggy Pop in 1977 when their student film "The Truth About Devolution" premiered at the Ann Arbor film festival? Ann Arbor is Iggy Pop's hometown.
They got their friend Brian Eno to produce their first album, the same year he collaborated with Bowie on his Berlin albums (Low, Heroes).
No way I can prove it on the interwebz, but yeah, I did know that, I swear.
Honestly, Meat, we should probably start another thread for this but Punk is a very interesting art/design conceptual movement, but a lot of the music is really, really crappy. Across the pond, in the UK, it's a political movement, which is an entirely different thing.
When all the american punk rockers screamed, "Anarchy!" they were talking about getting high and knocking things overs; when all the british punk rockers screamed, "Anarchy!" it was a political argument against the Monarchy. Just a completely different mindset.
(This has nothing to do with Mustaine's nonsense.)
I see no reason to start a new thread.
I get what you're saying, but what I'm saying is that punk is a mindset as well as a style. The people that kept making 3 chord headbangers into the mid-80s were largely boring. Even DK, whom I love, produced a lot of repetitive drek past Fresh Fruit.
I'm far more into the different music that sprung from the AESTHETIC and IDEALS of DIY punk than actual "punk" music.
You ever listen to Wire? They are the absolute best. Wire has a 29 second long song.
What did it mean when the American punks said "With just a touch of my burning hand, I send my astro zombies to rape the land, prime directive: exterminate the whole human race"?
I have no idea.
I don't generally listen to the lyrics either.
I'm far more into the different music that sprung from the AESTHETIC and IDEALS of DIY punk than actual "punk" music.
You ever listen to Wire? They are the absolute best. Wire has a 29 second long song.
Yeah I hear you on that one, I started with The Talking Heads and worked backwards, if you see what I mean.
I hadn't heard Wire before, just that was a great little song; if only it hadn't been so long, I got bored during the chorus :P
You know The DBs? They just put out a new album a few months ago.
Oh cripes. You need to just buy Pink Flag, Chairs Missing and 154.
They really evolve from being this sort of oblique, artsy punk band to making these amazing soundscapes over the course of 3 albums.
And I hadn't before, but I do now. DB's seem cool. Dinosaur Jr. reunited and released an album a couple years back. Their one single from the album absolutely makes me weep.
Yeah, I know (and enjoy) DJ; have you heard Can? They're from the last millennium and have never, so far as I know, produced an album since. Swear to god, the first time I heard them I thought they were much more recent.
Can? Aren't they an early 70s Krautrock outfit, like Faust and Neu!?
I think they're often namechecked as proto-industrial, thanks to bands like Einsturzende Neubauten drawing obvious inspiration from them.
Well, this is the first time I've seen "Krautrock" as a genre name. I'm keeping that one for my novel! :P
I guess you call them proto-industrial, but their music is more about the harmony than the percussion. (Don't quote me, I have no musical education whatsoever.)
Krautrock is basically just a term for German rock music from that era, specifically music that was heavily influenced by psychedelic and experimental styles, and often included electronic instrumentation. Kraftwerk is nominally considered krautrock.
And industrial isn't about the percussion any more than similar genres (rock, dance) but I can't expect everyone to know about Cabaret Voltaire and Throbbing Gristle and Chrome and awesome true industrial bands.