Is the catholic thing even an issue anymore? Romney s Mormonism doesn't seem to be hurting him (except by not helping him)
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While I am pretty crusader-esque sometimes in my "spreading" of atheism, I try to do with with humour instead of vitriol.
Instead of saying "you're stupid for believing in god".
I would go "You do realize your religion is based on waiting for a cosmic Jewish lich to return to the earth and save us from a dude who's crimes include uniting the world's governments in 1000 years of peace.
You're basically waiting for an emaciated, undead carpenter to save us from Gandhi."
You don't have to do much to make religion sound humorous.
Better still can you imagain a republican candidate getting the nomination, if he publicially said he accepted the evidence of science, rather than believing in creation?
Because part of Freedom of Religion is respecting the choice of others.
I don't think I can agree. I accept freedom of speech, even (especially) when I find that speech absolutely abhorrent, but the very last thing I do is respect someone's choice to engage in such speech. Holocaust deniers, to use the most obvious example, don't deserve any respect unless the term is stretched to include things like not lobbying for them to be rounded up and put in camps.
No, freedom of religion is that they have a right to practice their religion. The bill of rights is all about preventing the GOVERNMENT from curtailing those rights of citizens.
There's nothing that says I have to respect anyone, or anything they say, or anything they believe.
They have the right to practice their religion. I have the right to call them a lunatic and an imbecile.
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Is the catholic thing even an issue anymore? Romney s Mormonism doesn't seem to be hurting him (except by not helping him)
Actually, Penn Jillette talked about this on a big think video, which I'll link HERE. He discusses the term Christian and how that changed the role of religion in politics at around the 4 minute mark.
Is the catholic thing even an issue anymore? Romney s Mormonism doesn't seem to be hurting him (except by not helping him)Actually, Penn Jillette talked about this on a big think video, which I'll link HERE. He discusses the term Christian and how that changed the role of religion in politics at around the 4 minute mark.
<3 that video.
Respect is a two way street. You can't expect to get any if you're not willing to give in equivalance.
There's nothing that says I have to respect anyone, or anything they say, or anything they believe.They have the right to practice their religion. I have the right to call them a lunatic and an imbecile.
That's as well as may be, but that has absolutely zero to do with the bill of rights and the Freedom of Religion.
As it happens I don't particularly care about the respect of people who believe in invisible sky gods, magical underpants, fairies, unicorns, etc. I'm just as like to take it as an insult, in fact.
Respect is a two way street. You can't expect to get any if you're not willing to give in equivalance.
There's nothing that says I have to respect anyone, or anything they say, or anything they believe.They have the right to practice their religion. I have the right to call them a lunatic and an imbecile.
But there are points of view in this world that are so out there as to just be unworthy of respect, right? That crazy dude who lives on the street, smells bad and can't carry on a coherent conversation for instance: I just won't let him into the restaurant I work at, no matter how much money he has in his pocket.
It's up to each individual to decide where the benchmark is, but going by the two way street doctrine, someone who won't respect your beliefs isn't worthy of your respect, yes?
(I have the feeling this would be clearer if I repeated the word "respect" a few more times. :P)
Edit: Or maybe if Meat stated it simply while I was dithering about syntax...
It has a lot to do with it. The Framers of the Constitution came from a society that while they had their knockdown dragouts and shouting matches in the halls of Congress also had high standards of etiquette and decorum, despite the fact that many of them had wildly varying beliefs when it came to the divine sphere.
So tell me how you get from
A)The first amendment prevents the government from establishing a religion, and allows for the free exercise thereof.to
B)All citizens of the US are never allowed to say anything bad about religion, ever, under any circumstances.
No actually thats Sam.
Meatrace can accept believers, he just snickers about them behind their backs.
:P
I don't have to, because I never went there. You seem to have a problem with the fact that I as an atheist can actually have a good relationship, friendship, and respect a priest who is as true a believer than can be.
You're the one who's insisting on seeing everything as one absolute or another with no middle ground.
Now you're just making things up.
I have no problem with you having good anything with an anyone. I have Christian friends, Muslim friends, a Daoist friend, some Wiccan friends. We get along fine. I have no respect for their beliefs because they are bonkers.The middle ground thing? That's the OPPOSITE of what I'm saying. You're saying you have to respect everyone's beliefs. HAVE to. I say no you don't...and you can still get along with people while telling them they're full of s!&$.
I RESPECT them too much to be dishonest about it. I tell my friends who are dumb that they're dumb, and they tell me I'm an arrogant prick. Then we roll some dice really its just fine.
TL;DR-Respect the person, not the belief.
P.S. Also some people I don't respect at all. And that's okay as well.
ZOMG hate the sin not the sinner!
No actually thats Sam.
Meatrace can accept believers, he just snickers about them behind their backs.
Samn has religious friends, albeit not many. And he's ok with that. Told me so himself.
ZOMG hate the sin not the sinner!
I prefer to love the sin and hate the sinner; I have fun, and know who I should deride.
Samn has religious friends, albeit not many. And he's ok with that. Told me so himself.No actually thats Sam.
Meatrace can accept believers, he just snickers about them behind their backs.
That's great. They must be great people if you can get past your utter contempt for religious folks.
Hate the belief not the believer.
Or both.
Or just hate everything by default.Then when there's something you don't hate, it's all the more meaningful.
It is the secret to being the hulk...oh no that was always being angry...
That's great. They must be great people if you can get past your utter contempt for religious folks.
I don't throw around the word 'friend' lightly. Only the best will do.
Fair enough.
That too but anyone involved in politics, being a hypocrite is a givenOr someone cheating on his second wife while calling for the impeachment of a president for cheating?
Not that I have anyone specific in mind.
Find me some genuine dirt on Russ Feingold and I'll swallow that.
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That crazy dude who lives on the street, smells bad and can't carry on a coherent conversation for instance:
You mean the gamers?
Is the catholic thing even an issue anymore? Romney s Mormonism doesn't seem to be hurting him (except by not helping him)Actually, Penn Jillette talked about this on a big think video, which I'll link HERE. He discusses the term Christian and how that changed the role of religion in politics at around the 4 minute mark.
Nice. According to him and/or the book he was citing it probably wouldn't be an issue anymore.
Wonder how long it would take for atheist to reach the same status.
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Find me some genuine dirt on Russ Feingold and I'll swallow that.That too but anyone involved in politics, being a hypocrite is a givenOr someone cheating on his second wife while calling for the impeachment of a president for cheating?
Not that I have anyone specific in mind.
Not going to study him for all info available, nor do i have the resources to plumb his entire life. There are exceptions for every rule, doesn't change what the vast majority are.
I have no interest in basketball.
Therefore I don't have a favorite basketball team. My "no team" is not a team itself.
I have no interest in religion, so I don't have one. See above.
Well put. I'll venture another one.
Humans have long fooled themselves with religious belief systems their made up gods and the threats to follow the religious culture or else. I do not follow these religious belief systems, any of them, so how can I be considered following a religion?
I can talk about ethics and morality, but there is no belief in a religious system and its claims, so there is no religion.
If you don't submit (Islam), pray, worship or believe in the higher powers and the beliefs raised around these ideologies and systems of cultural power, you are not within a religion. It has to me, always seemed fishy and obviously a made-up farce. Perhaps it was the early expose to D&D, religion and clerics. Perhaps I never came across a religious fellow with a high enough Bluff.
It will never happen. Religion like sex is hardwired into our genes. While some individuals may have a varying, a weaker or no sex drive, it remains present in the bulk of our species. The same goes for the urge to believe in something larger than ourselves. Many atheists actually only sublimate that urge into something else. such as a favorite computer platform, or science fiction show.
Europe seems to be pretty close to it, so i doubt the need to hate people that don't buy your religion is genetic
Which says nothing about atheists sublimating that into other obsessions.There are several studies on the matter including separated twin cases. This article in New Scientist can get you started. Separated twin cases have also pointed down other things such as our genetic happiness quotients.It will never happen. Religion like sex is hardwired into our genes. While some individuals may have a varying, a weaker or no sex drive, it remains present in the bulk of our species. The same goes for the urge to believe in something larger than ourselves. Many atheists actually only sublimate that urge into something else. such as a favorite computer platform, or science fiction show.Would that imply that religious people are less likely to be passionate about other things, like computer platforms or science fiction shows or RPGs, than atheists are? Since they don't need to sublimate their religious drive into something else?
Is there any evidence for that?
It also bears pointing out that religious inclination, which the article talks about, is not in and of itself religion. About a million posts ago in this very thread, I drew a distinction between a religion (Baptist, for example) and a religious classification (Atheist, for example). IMO religious inclination and any specific religion are two different things.
It seems to me that religion being hardwired into our genes, and the studies that have found certain areas of the brain become active when undergoing a religious experience, would suggest that religion has a biological cause rather than a divine one.
I will however concede the point that identical twins are more similar than fraternal twins. :P