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So, I have an idea for a religion system in this campaign setting. Under this setting there is no hard evidence of the existence of deities. There are, however, millions of spirits, and there are everywhere in the world (Think Japanese Kami). These spirits exist to provide humans with magical power in the same manner as deities, but unlike deities they can only do this if the individual is nearby. Furthermore, different spirits offer different types of magic. In game terms, each spirit has a general focus, like healing, divination, smiting, and the like. When a divine spellcaster prepares or learns a spell, a spirit of the appropriate focus provides the power instead of a deity. This requires prayer to the spirit in the same manner as one would pray to a deity. Spirits exist specifically for this purpose, so they do not refuse to give the power. Since there are millions of spirits, it is always assumed that there is an appropriate spirit close enough to give the power.
Under this system, Cleric domains show a preference for certains kinds of spirit, as divine spellcasters focus on types of magic that fit their moral beliefs or interests, and gain power from those types of spirit more often than from other types of spirit.
Since Clerics do not gain power from deities under this system, they cannot lose their spells and class features for misbehaving. This also applies to Paladins, and for the same reasons: there simply isn't a god to get mad at them for violating the code of conduct. However, there is an organization of Paladins that trains all Paladins and shows them which prayers to make to which types of spirit, and this organization keeps an eye on it's members. As a result, any Paladin who violates the code of conduct will have agents of this organization sent to either reform, or, if it should prove absolutely necessary, execute him or her. Paladins may not be able to lose their abilities for violating the code of conduct, but any such violations will be dealt with appropriately. It'll just be done in RP terms instead of through loss of power.
Now, just because there is no hard evidence of deities does not mean there is no belief in deities. Religion and the belief in higher powers still plays a large role in this campaign, and the lack of hard evidence of the existence of deities just serves to intensify religious tension and, at times, violence and prosecution. Spirit warship is also highly common, often alongside deity worship.
Now, just because there is no hard evidence of deities does not mean there is no belief in deities. Religion and the belief in higher powers still plays a large role in this campaign, and the lack of hard evidence of the existence of deities just serves to intensify religious tension and, at times, violence and prosecution.
So it's the real world?
Sorry, couldn't resist. Sounds cool.
You might look into Ebberon campaign setting to flesh certain religions out, ofcourse clerics are more like mysticists in this setting and virtually everyone could be a priest of a religion. I think a duality of Gods like the Creator and the Keeper would serve well in a setting like this, with most other people worshiping patron spirits. Holy symbols might allow clerics to reach their patron spirit from virtually anywhere, it might even be interesting to have multiple holy symbols / relics for various spells because every spirit has a very limited dominion. With some particulary hard to come by, bones of a particular saint or the like.
I have a take on this in my homebrew campaign setting. Very nice.
Not sure if I would agree with the Paladin part. Though I have trouble writing it out. Just a basic concept, if they are not LG then they are not going to be a Paladin.
Also you might consider adding some sort of ancestor worship as well.
Ancestor worship could work, especially if in some cultures they were thought to be the spirits.
As for Paladins, if they cease to be good aligned, they will be dealt with. It's just that the structure of this divine magic system makes me feel a storyline resolution (having other Paladins and agents of the Paladin organization sent after them) works better here than a simple taking of their powers would, what with the lack of deities to take their powers away.
Now, just because there is no hard evidence of deities does not mean there is no belief in deities. Religion and the belief in higher powers still plays a large role in this campaign, and the lack of hard evidence of the existence of deities just serves to intensify religious tension and, at times, violence and prosecution.So it's the real world?
Sorry, couldn't resist. Sounds cool.
That's what I was aiming for: religious strife intensified by the fact that neither religion can prove itself to be correct.
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Not sure if I would agree with the Paladin part. Though I have trouble writing it out. Just a basic concept, if they are not LG then they are not going to be a Paladin.
Also you might consider adding some sort of ancestor worship as well.
Ancestor worship could work, especially if in some cultures they were thought to be the spirits.
As for Paladins, if they cease to be good aligned, they will be dealt with. It's just that the structure of this divine magic system makes me feel a storyline resolution (having other Paladins and agents of the Paladin organization sent after them) works better here than a simple taking of their powers would, what with the lack of deities to take their powers away.
:) your world, your rules :)
It just does not fit my my idea of paladins, or much of my understanding of the history of them in the game. That being said, you could always choose to opt out of the class in its entirety. I am of the opinion that you do not have to include every class or option. There being no beings to give the Divine power or to enforce the rules. Of course keeping it the way you are gives you a great excuse to make use of Inquisitors. So 6 of 1; 1/2 a dozen of the other.
EDIT: of course it could be the the Good Spirits choosing not to help or provide abilities to someone with say, an evil aura.
Not sure if I would agree with the Paladin part. Though I have trouble writing it out. Just a basic concept, if they are not LG then they are not going to be a Paladin.
Also you might consider adding some sort of ancestor worship as well.
Ancestor worship could work, especially if in some cultures they were thought to be the spirits.
As for Paladins, if they cease to be good aligned, they will be dealt with. It's just that the structure of this divine magic system makes me feel a storyline resolution (having other Paladins and agents of the Paladin organization sent after them) works better here than a simple taking of their powers would, what with the lack of deities to take their powers away.
:) your world, your rules :)
It just does not fit my my idea of paladins, or much of my understanding of the history of them in the game. That being said, you could always choose to opt out of the class in its entirety. I am of the opinion that you do not have to include every class or option. There being no beings to give the power or to enforce the rules. Of course keeping it the way you are gives you a great excuse to make use of Inquisitors. So 6 of 1; 1/2 a dozen of the other.
I didn't think of the Inquisitor thing. Thanks. Inquisitors could be useful in this campaign. If the lack of evidence of God didn't get rid of Inquisitors in the real world, it won't here.
EDIT: of course it could be the the Good Spirits choosing not to help or provide abilities to someone with say, an evil aura.
The issue with that is that it's pretty easy to just go to a neutral or evil spirit.
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I didn't think of the Inquisitor thing. Thanks. Inquisitors could be useful in this campaign. If the lack of evidence of God didn't get rid of Inquisitors in the real world, it won't here.Not sure if I would agree with the Paladin part. Though I have trouble writing it out. Just a basic concept, if they are not LG then they are not going to be a Paladin.
Also you might consider adding some sort of ancestor worship as well.
Ancestor worship could work, especially if in some cultures they were thought to be the spirits.
As for Paladins, if they cease to be good aligned, they will be dealt with. It's just that the structure of this divine magic system makes me feel a storyline resolution (having other Paladins and agents of the Paladin organization sent after them) works better here than a simple taking of their powers would, what with the lack of deities to take their powers away.
:) your world, your rules :)
It just does not fit my my idea of paladins, or much of my understanding of the history of them in the game. That being said, you could always choose to opt out of the class in its entirety. I am of the opinion that you do not have to include every class or option. There being no beings to give the power or to enforce the rules. Of course keeping it the way you are gives you a great excuse to make use of Inquisitors. So 6 of 1; 1/2 a dozen of the other.
Well that depends on where you look for evidence and what you consider evidence. ;) however this is not a great thread for that.
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EDIT: of course it could be the the Good Spirits choosing not to help or provide abilities to someone with say, an evil aura.The issue with that is that it's pretty easy to just go to a neutral or evil spirit.
Maybe. If say for a Paladin it takes some sort of good aligned Patron, or group of Patron spirits. Then just going to a Neutral spirit wont work because, they just don't care.
Evil on the other hand might care a lot. Which would be a darn good excuse for Anti-Paladins/Black Guards ect...
EDIT: of course it could be the the Good Spirits choosing not to help or provide abilities to someone with say, an evil aura.The issue with that is that it's pretty easy to just go to a neutral or evil spirit.Maybe. If say for a Paladin it takes some sort of good aligned Patron, or group of Patron spirits. Then just going to a Neutral spirit wont work because, they just don't care.
Evil on the other hand might care a lot. Which would be a darn good excuse for Anti-Paladins/Black Guards ect...
Yes, Anti-Paladins would work.
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Yes, Anti-Paladins would work.EDIT: of course it could be the the Good Spirits choosing not to help or provide abilities to someone with say, an evil aura.The issue with that is that it's pretty easy to just go to a neutral or evil spirit.Maybe. If say for a Paladin it takes some sort of good aligned Patron, or group of Patron spirits. Then just going to a Neutral spirit wont work because, they just don't care.
Evil on the other hand might care a lot. Which would be a darn good excuse for Anti-Paladins/Black Guards ect...
The best part of a game like this, is that potentially an ally Paladin who fell, could always pretend for a short time at least, that he is still a Paladin.
The best part of a game like this, is that potentially an ally Paladin who fell, could always pretend for a short time at least, that he is still a Paladin.Yes, Anti-Paladins would work.EDIT: of course it could be the the Good Spirits choosing not to help or provide abilities to someone with say, an evil aura.The issue with that is that it's pretty easy to just go to a neutral or evil spirit.Maybe. If say for a Paladin it takes some sort of good aligned Patron, or group of Patron spirits. Then just going to a Neutral spirit wont work because, they just don't care.
Evil on the other hand might care a lot. Which would be a darn good excuse for Anti-Paladins/Black Guards ect...
Correct. It usually takes time for a Paladin's fall from grace to become obvious under this system.