Continuing a discussion from previous thread, found here. Though I don't think the thread warranted being closed, there isn't a whole lot I can do about it I imagine.
Here's my question to Ravingdork:
Before the deadly encounter, your PC had decided to hold on to the cursed magical handaxe. Your PC put it in his pack. At that point, did you specifically alert the GM and explain that your PC would want to be able to grab it quickly?
Actually, I stated my intent to draw out the axe and attack the axe's former owner. The GM specifically asked me where I had put it at that time (leaving me to now believe he had a motive for asking, as he had never asked me any similar question in the past). Since it was a cursed item I wasn't certain I'd be using in the near future, I told him it was in my backpack. Only then did he rule it was a standard action.
Up to that point, the group knew my character was carrying 245 lbs. of gear (I had brought it up earlier in the game when I voiced concerns about following the party over a rickety metal grate over a pit with my cumulative weight being almost 450 lbs.), but I had never said anything about my backpack being stuffed too tightly (I just figured everything was dispersed as well as it could be since I'm well within my medium load). The stuffed backpack approach appears to have been the assumption of the GM, even though that clearly isn't how I saw it.
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This isn't really what I meant by starting a new thread to talk about how to disagree with the GM. I'm not convinced the "I-said-he-said-she-said-GM-said" approach to talking things out is super helpful. If this thread turns into a Ravingdork vs. the world pileon I'll close this one, too.
Wait one effin minute! When did backpacks in an RPG start being governed by physics? Adventuring backpacks should never NEVER be held to silly things such as reality. ~*shiver*~ Adventuring backpacks cannot be ‘overstuffed’. What is wrong with you people?!?
(Note: I am being completely serious here. Please don’t mistake the above for sarcasm.)
No wonder you reacted the way you did RD. I mean, I’ve played under some nitpicky GMs. I have filled out diagrams illustrating exactly where every item I carry is stored on my character. I’ve handled on the spot rulings like heavy rain halving fire damage and darkvision requiring minutes for your eyes to adjust with grace, but suddenly declaring a PCs backpack overstuffed?!? Unless you were is carrying a family of live mules in there or something... It’d take me a minute and a half to just recover from the shock.
Action to get an item out of a backpack? Standard and that's if you're lucky. Let's get real here. Retrieve a stored item on the table of actions in combat doesn't differentiate between anything stored in anything else. Belt pouch? Desk drawer of a study? Foot locker in a barracks? Backpack? Hidden compartment of a boot heel? Pocket? Corset? Body cavity?
The action, taken literally, could be all of those things. Hence, a referee's judgment is warranted and why the Manipulate an Item section in the text gives the DM wiggle room. I'd allow a move action to get something out of a pouch or a pocket easily. Out of a desk drawer or foot locker? Sure. A sack held in one hand? No problem. Backpack? I'm going to be a bit more of a stickler, though I might allow it to be done in two move actions - one to remove the pack so you can properly manipulate it and one to retrieve the item once that's done. Frankly, you'd be better off accepting it as a standard action.
HAha. I'm now imagining players being given a printed sheet with an inventory grid ala Diablo or other such games, and having every item drawn on a sticky note cut into a Tetris-like shape.
Inventory puzzle! :D
Hehe Umbral Reaver. Except 2 dimensions is just not going to cut it and a grid is waaaay to simplistic. Those sticky notes better be folded into scale models of each item. :P
I would say it is a move action unless the backpack is over its weight limit already. Then, I would agree a standard action is reasonable.
What is your carrying capacity from your strength score?
If you don't have it in the backpack, where did you put it?
If you are wearing armor, the backpack would be the most logical place for you to keep your items.
I guess by posting it, you want to see if others agree if you were being treated unfairly?
In the end, its up to the GM, however, whether or not I would rule the same would depend on a combination of factors. In some situations, I think it is justified to rule it would take a little longer.
Contributor, RPG Superstar 2010 Top 16
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I would say it is a move action unless the backpack is over its weight limit already. Then, I would agree a standard action is reasonable.
Backpacks in PFRPG don't have a weight capacity, they have a volume, which is 2 cubic feet, so conceivably 12"x12"x24" (a sort of tall pack). Look at his gear list from the other thread. It's easily characterized as "overstuffed".
Just an example: 2 sets of block and tackle - Listed as 10 lbs each pulley in APG, (pictures) Easily 1-2 cubic feet by themselves.