What can affect a Haunt?

[Kalraan]

Hello All,

In the rules, a Haunt can only be affected by Positive Energy either through the use of spells that inflict that energy type (i.e. Cure Light Wounds, Disrupt Undead, etc) or through Channel Positive Energy such as that used by Clerics and Paladins.

I have a few questions:

1) What affect does Holy Water have on a haunt?
2) If it has an affect, how is it used against the haunt (i.e. missile splash weapon, needing an attack roll, just poured on, etc)?
3) Also, if it does, is it a requirement that it has to be used in the area of the haunt or on a specific place within the haunt?
4) What affected does a Cure potion (any type) have on the haunt?
5) If it has an affect, how is it used against the haunt (i.e. missile splash weapon, needing an attack roll, just poured on, etc)?

I'm not sure if I have my head around how a haunt can be affected by anyone other than a spell caster (using the spells mentioned above) or a Cleric/Paladin.

Any assistance would be greatly appreciated.

[archmagi1]

I allowed any positive energy effect to work on it. Once the paladin could see a haunt in detect evil, the rest of the group could start tossing holy waters or cure light wounding the haunt itself.

Its not really a good mechanic to be in there if you have nobody who can burst channel.

[Ullapool]

Kalraan wrote:

I have a few questions: . . .

I have (had?) a lot of the same questions. I resolved them enough to play the adventure but found each encounter with a haunt really cumbersome. I realize what Brandon was going for with the haunts and I really appreciate the atmosphere but I just wasn't able to pull them off effectively.

Spoiler:

I am disappointed to see a return of haunts in (at least) the last module as I'm not really looking forward to playing them again.

More to the point, I also ended up allowing Holy Water to be used and I used it as a splash weapon with a roll to hit - which I found really silly in the moment. So, what, we're rolling to hit on pouring holy water on a window that's slammed itself shut?
If you play it where only channel position can damage it I think you'll find that your party runs out of channels very fast. Furthermore, since knowing how to actually DESTROY a haunt is additionally really unwieldy (though I wrote some DM aids to help with that here) it means that if the PCs simply go home to rest they'll find the haunt is back next time they come back.

Spoiler:

Not to even mention the really obscure ways some of these haunts are finally put to rest - requiring spells that PCs might not have (odd druid spells a druid probably wouldn't prepare anyway for instance, not to mention what happens if no druids) and things like capturing the Cold Spot in a metal weapon, tossing it in a flowing stream, etc.... just weird. Again, I get the amazing amount of research that went into "real life" haunted lore and transferring that to game mechanics. I just didn't feel like it worked at the table.

I let cure spells (but not potions, though I see the flaw in not allowing them both equally) affect the haunts but since the cure damage is so much higher than channel positive energy I made them roll to hit with the cure spells offensively. Then, again, you get into a situation with what are they hitting?

Spoiler:

Against the Piper, the Marauder, Old Ember Maw - those are manifestations that have a specific target - but what do they target vs. a Cold Spot, Slamming Portal, Rapping Spirit - or again, in the last module, they'll fight haunting "whispers"

I really want to like haunts. They look good on paper, so thematic, so well researched, so fitting for the adventure path. But I really dislike them at the table. I think the intention is to view them as like the Trap mechanic but the trap assumes a thief's general knowledge of trappy-things allows him to fiddle with and figure out the workings of a trap and disarm it. Without the cards I linked above, and really even with them to some extent, that mechanic just doesn't transfer (imo) to haunts. I sometimes think the right thing for the players to do would be to run through the haunted areas, but (at least my) players aren't really built for that. It's not really in the list of things they know how to do. If they encounter a room they cannot deal with the last thing they usually want to do is dive through it into the unknwon beyond it. Several times my PCs would just go back to town and go "eff this. We can't touch that crap. Tell the priest to deal with it himself, we're going to sit here and protect Kendra instead of going to that spooky prison where we can't affect things."

/soapbox.

[Pan]

My table experience was quite different Ullapool. My group thought haunts were intriguing. They spent some time researching them and even managed to release a few tormented spirits. After some time they realized it was very time consuming and dangerous and decided that the haunts are not the real threat and they should avoid them for the time being. They are now about to enter the lower level.

I would say the fact that I no longer use XP has a lot to do with it. My players do not feel as though they have to disable every trap or kill every monsters any longer. They recognized the haunts for what they are and its pretty much a distraction. They are getting to the heart of the matter ever so carefully now. They have enjoyed haunts very much. I look forward to using them again in the future.