question: Does a Hexcrafter magus qualify for the extra hex feat?
I don't have the book on me but...
Unless a specific rule somewhere states otherwise...If the feat state it specifically requires the Witch class, no, Hexcrafters are Magi
If the feat only states requirements the Hexcrafters has, then yes, take away
question: Does a Hexcrafter magus qualify for the extra hex feat?
It would at my table, but if you're looking for RAW...
Relevant:
"Prerequisite: Hex class feature."
Hexcrafter
Relevant:
"Hex Magus (Su)"
A Hexcrafter Magi does not get the hex class feature, but instead gets the 'Hex Magus' class feature. If you're looking for a strict RAW reason to not allow it than the fact that it isn't exactly the hex class feature and in both function and name is valid.
question: Does a Hexcrafter magus qualify for the extra hex feat?
No, but he does qualify for the Extra Arcana feat. As a Hexcrafter "may select any witch hex in place of a magus arcana" (at least once he's 4th level), then it works out the same: Take Extra Arcana, and then choose a hex.
Quick question: it seems everybody favors the dervish dancer build over the STR build, so as to avoid a serious case of MAD.
It looks well on paper (very well indeed), but going elf instead of human AND taking weapon finesse + dervish dance puts us three feats lower than our STR brethen.
Since the magus seems a bit feat-starved (what with all these metamagical feats they have to take, and the combat ones, and the odd iron will), is it really a fair trade ? It basically boils down to losing 2 or 3 AC (depending on how many points you can invest) for the cost of 3 feats.
Also, very few builds seem to take Combat Casting. I guess it's a waste of a feat at higher levels, but it looks like a lifesaver at the beginning of the game.
Quick question: it seems everybody favors the dervish dancer build over the STR build, so as to avoid a serious case of MAD.
It looks well on paper (very well indeed), but going elf instead of human AND taking weapon finesse + dervish dance puts us three feats lower than our STR brethen.
Since the magus seems a bit feat-starved (what with all these metamagical feats they have to take, and the combat ones, and the odd iron will), is it really a fair trade ? It basically boils down to losing 2 or 3 AC (depending on how many points you can invest) for the cost of 3 feats.
Also, very few builds seem to take Combat Casting. I guess it's a waste of a feat at higher levels, but it looks like a lifesaver at the beginning of the game.
I'm going to have to chime-in in defense of the Dervish build. Your looking primarily at the AC difference, and not mentioning the other benefits: higher reflex save, higher initiative, higher dex based skill checks, attribute consolidation. Each of the previous benefits can compensate for a feat. You can also get a weapon with the agile weapon quality to compensate for one of those feats.
I can agree with some of ShadowcatX's points. Spell penetration built in is nice, and with higher point buys the benefit of going dex based is diminished. As for the initiative thing.....agreed.
After reading this topic I got the impression that this is the right place to ask this. I'm playing a Magus in our current campaign. It's the first time I play PF in an adventure that lasts longer than one or two sessions. I am quite an experienced GM, but building an evolving character is that much different.
My character is level 3 by now and my question is whether or not to take the path of an Hexcrafter. My GM is fine with either decision.
My Magus Randir is an elven-dervish-built. Our party started out with three elves from Evermeet, but one of us died in a battle against some bandit goblins. Now we have an elven Fighter with focus on AC and maneuvers, a Summoner and my Magus.
Here is a more detailed built.
Https://www.evernote.com/pub/wgut/magus
"oops... page not found" for that url
https://www.Verbote.com/pub/wgut/magus
I'm very sorry for the inconvenience this typo may have caused. I am not able to copy-paste in this editor with my phone.
the arcana is wand wielder, and the spell weaponwand would be a cool addition to your arsenal.
the arcana is wand wielder, and the spell weaponwand would be a cool addition to your arsenal.Where is that spell? I can't find it. Also, from the ISWG,Wand Dancer looks good to a Dervish magus.
The spell is in the OGC, - It is a 1st level Magus spell and the OGC says it comes from the Pathfinder Campaign Setting: Inner Sea Magic. http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/w/weaponwand. Hope that helps
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The spell is in the OGC, - It is a 1st level Magus spell and the OGC says it comes from the Pathfinder Campaign Setting: Inner Sea Magic. http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/w/weaponwand. Hope that helpsthe arcana is wand wielder, and the spell weaponwand would be a cool addition to your arsenal.Where is that spell? I can't find it. Also, from the ISWG,Wand Dancer looks good to a Dervish magus.
Thanks, though it looks like a bad version of Spellstrike. Also, Wand Dance would not work with Dervish Dance, so this Magus's theme music could not be "Dance, magus, dance..."
WalterGM has been adding material to the guide. I am glad to see hime back.
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Thought this should go here. The numbers are pretty awesome for a 1 level dip:
#Walter if you think this works it would be great for the multiclassing section.
didn't know about Wayang Spell hunter. That's Awesome.
So:
Traits:[b] Magical Lineage (Shocking Grasp), Wayang Spellhunter (Shocking Grasp)[b]If they can stack then you can Empower Shocking Grasp in a 1st level slot
1Magus1 Spell Combat Spell Focus: Evoc, Spell special
2 Magus2 Spellstrike
3 Sorcerer1 Crossblooded Orc/Blue DragonIntensify Spell
4 Magus3 Arcana- Familiar
5 Magus4 Hex- Slumber, Extra Arcana: Arcane Accuracy
6 Magus5 Empower Spell or Echoing Spell
7 Magus6 Hex Arcana- Flight Hex, Improved Familiar (Nosoi)
8 Magus7 Medium Armor
9 Magus8 Empower or Echo spell
10 Magus9 Hex Arcana-Evil Eye
11 Magus10 Extra Hex: Hex Arcana- Ice Tomb
12 Magus11 Weapon Focus: Scimitar
13 Magus12 Hex Arcana- Ice Tomb, Quicken Spell
14 Magus 13 Heavy Armor
15 Magus 14 Spell Perfection (Shocking Grasp)
16 Magus 15 Bane Blade
So up till level 5 you best is Intensified SG 6d6+12=30 from a
At level 6 you can cast Intensified, Empowerd SG (7d6+14)x 1.5= 52 with a 2nd level slot. or an Echoing 5d6+10 with a second level slot for 25+25. #Empower seems the better deal (only by Average +2) but remember you're spell striking your SG so adding Weapon damage with the extra casting as well. It's also another chance
At level 9 you can cast a Intensified Echoing SG with a 3rd level slot for 10d6+20= 50+Weapon Damage and you get 2 castings.
Intensified, Empowerd SG (10d6+20)x 1.5= 75 with a 2nd level
*At level 11 Spell Specialisation doesn't do anything to Intensified SG anymore as you hit the 10d6 CL max.Swap it to
At [b]level 15 you can cast Intensified, Empowerd, Echoing SG (10d6+20)x 1.5= 75 with a 2nd level slot, getting big damage+Weapon attack and 2 uses per slot. Then In the same round you can cast a Quickend Intensified, Empowerd, for a swift action Spellstrike for 75 with a 2nd level
The main reason this is Awesome is 1. You getting BIG damage out of your first and second level
2. Echoing is Increasing your endurance. EG rd1 move up and cast an echoing Intensified SG. RD2 Full attack and deliver your second casting
That was 2 spells for the price of 1.
3. At 16 with Spell Perfection and Bane Blade comes online you
to make a Spell combat full attack 3 attacks with your Bane weapon.(Cast your Echo,INtense,Empowerd SG) 4th attack to Deliver SG 5th Attack to cast and deliver a Quickend Empowerd, Intense
That's 5 weapon attacks plus combined spell damage of 150 AND your first SG was echoing so you have 1 cast left for next
All that costed 2x 2nd level slots.
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I am curious regarding the Magus, I recently played one up to 7th level in a Pathfinder game, am I doing this right? I was using a Scimitar that was made Keen via Arcane Pool, 15-20 threat, does that mean when I confirm a critical hit with the scimitar spell strike, that it doubles the damage of the Shocking grasp? or just the weapon damage?
Or in clearer terms, the DM rounded up. I was 6th level Magus with Magical Lineage SG, with a magical scimitar, made keen via Arcane pool. Base Damage was 1D6 (weapon) + (DM rounded up) 5D6 Shocking Grasp + 1D6 (Instensified) + 3D6 (Empowered) = 10D6 + Str/Magic damage on a single strike, now If I threat on that spell strike, being keen at a range of 15-20 AND confirm, does that mean that I am double weapon AND spell? and then it becomes 20D6?
Yep. It's yet another reason the Sorc dip build is awesome.
Using a Intensifed Empowerd( 10d6+20)x1.5 Spellstrike Scimitar.Crit is about 150damage of the spell alone. Add doubled weapon damage and.your doing nearly 200 damage of a Single strike.
WalterGM, I think you rated both Bane Blade and Devoted Blade too low. With Bane Blade, the magus has a way to overcome DR:Epic/? which many other character, paladins excepted, will just have to punch through. Even at 15th level, an extra 2d6 points of damage is helpful. The same applies to Devoted Blade with DR: Good/?. Part of the appeal of a magus is being situationally versatile. Whether facing a terrasque or a balor a magus has an answer.
I agree the rest of the ratings and have an upgraded appreciation for Arcane Edge. I also agree with your assessment of the UC archetypes. A kensai can be an awesome character.
Great guide! Hope to see it soon with Ultimate Combat added!
Great guide! Hope to see it soon with Ultimate Combat added!
WalterGM has added the arcana and archetypes from UC so it is partially updated.
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WalterGM, I think you rated both Bane Blade and Devoted Blade too low. With Bane Blade, the magus has a way to overcome DR:Epic/? which many other character, paladins excepted, will just have to punch through. Even at 15th level, an extra 2d6 points of damage is helpful. The same applies to Devoted Blade with DR: Good/?. Part of the appeal of a magus is being situationally versatile. Whether facing a terrasque or a balor a magus has an answer.
I agree the rest of the ratings and have an upgraded appreciation for Arcane Edge. I also agree with your assessment of the UC archetypes. A kensai can be an awesome character.
For sure. I agree with your statements about DR -- for me it just feels a little lackluster that you're getting it that late. I'll reevaluate the other options available at that level and see if my opinions change.
Great guide! Hope to see it soon with Ultimate Combat added!
Added the UC arcanas/archetypes! Just need to take a weekend and look at the feats/spells. Maybe... this weekend?
About Multiclassing:
I know everyone discourages it. I did it and I don't regret it yet.
For the magus I took the hexcrafter archetype. I didn't miss spell recall as I tend to use all my pool to enhance my weapon. And when I'm running low on spells I fill up with the brand cantrip (gained via hexcrafter)
What I did was a dip into Dawnflower dervish bard.
That way I got Dervish dance for free without having to take weapon finesse first (so I saved two feats).
I got additional spells including cure light wounds and some cantrips as well as battle dance.
As my GM doesn't want us to do single level dips I'll be taking a second level of bard at 7th character level, when I use my feat for additional traits compensating the CL loss with magical knack.
It may not be a super optimized build but it nets a lot for the dip and has some style if one wants to play a Scimitar wielding follower of the dawnflower.
Another intriguing option I just found.
If you were to take the 1 level dip into Sorcerer and took the Crossblooded Archetype, a combination of Dragon (Blue Dragon) and Primal would give you a +20 dmg (+40 on a crit) to your Shocking Grasps at level 10. The Drawback of one less spell per level isn't going to hurt and the -2 to Will saves can be offset by a Headband of Inspired Wisdom +4 or adding the Mind Armor property from MIC to your armor.
Ummm, yeah look up about 13-15 posts. I already did that one.
;)
What I'd like to see is a Kick ass Kensai build that's worth what you give up.
I like the feel of both it and the Myrmadyrch but am having a hard time finding the awesome.
I think Kensai with 1 level dip to monk (classic or maneuver master or many styles) could work out fine.
You get dex + wis + int (after some levels) to ac, get a bonus feat and depending on which you took can flurry if you don't want to waste spells. On Mooks for example.
Just take the temple sword a weapon and you are fine.
the normal flurry will most likely not work with spellcombat, as it is a seperate full round action. But the flurry of maneuvers can be used as part of a full round action. So you could cast a spell, deliver it with your weapon, attack normally and make a combat maneuver all in one round.
@STR Ranger - I was specifically combining PRIMAL and Blue Dragon. You used ORC and Blue Dragon. Blue Dragon alone would give +10 but combining it with PRIMAL would make it +20 (+2 per die rolled - Though I do see where Orc would do the same thing ultimately). To be a little more specific, you would have to take both the CROSSBLOODED and WILDBLOODED Archetypes and PRIMAL would be a offshoot of ELEMENTAL.
You could also just go ELEMENTAL and choose Cold as your element and combine that with Rime Spell and/or Sickening Spell feats at the cost of the extra +10 damage on your Shocking Grasps.
Ok
- I didn't any of the post (so if it's been said before -sorry) - just had a look at the guide and saw that ring of wizardy was "blue"...
It should be red IMO.
Let's do the math Ring of wizardy (RoW) compared to pearls of power (PoP)
ROW I - gives max 5 spells, cost 20.000. I could get 20!() PoP I for that- so PoP much better. Even if I found a RoW I would still be better of selling it and buying PoP.
ROW II max 5 spell cost 40.000. Thats 10 PoP II - so still better - and selling it? Gives the same amount of spellslots and frees a ring slot.
RoW III 70.000 I could get 7 PoP III for that - so I wouldn't buy one - but if I looted one selling it wouldn't be a good Idea.
RoW IV 100.000 I could get 6 PoP IV for that, so same as RoW III.
But if there any diffence between preparing extra spells og gaining more of the same? Yes - but your a magus - You pretty much want to spam the same damage spell over and over again. - after combat refill...
Okay - I would even consider NOT selling a RoW I or II if i didn't have anything else to put on my finger. But green tops.. IMO.
You are comparing apples and oranges. The ring doubles up your spells for immediate use, the pearl has action costs associated. In the midst of combat, having twice as many spells available at no cost is much better than having to use a rounds worth of actions to get out and use a pearl so you can do something the next round.
Just a quick (random) advice: you can't use Power Attack with touch attacks, so do not PA while you are using Accurate Strike arcana...
@Skylancer4 - how many spell do you cast in one encounter? All of them?
Not many encounters last for extended periods of time. Once you can afford a ring of Wizardry I you'll have plenty (enough anyway) of level 1 spellslots - for ONE encounter. After combat while the cleric is using his wand of cure light wounds the magus can use his pearls of power.
Action out of combat have no cost.
Let's assume you can't afford a RoW I before level 12 - when it's about ½ your WBL. A standard magus will have 5 +int 1 lvl spells. let's be modest and assume 6 spells.
Now how long will combat last? 5 rounds? maybe more - but lets just assume 5 rounds in which the magus casts an offesive spell. He has 4 lvl spells by now - will all of them be 1 lvl spells? - Well shocking grasp with a trait+intensified is a nice combo, but would you cast 5 of them?
Surely a vam touch could be nice at some point.
And what other lvl 1 spellslots are you so keen to have memorised?
RoW II - lvl 14 - now you have even more spellslots - but would every spell you cast be lvl 2?
Again - I'm just saying ring of wizardy is good but compared to Pearl of power it's just not as cost effective. - but still good, don't overlook that part :-)
Again - I'm just saying ring of wizardy is good but compared to Pearl of power it's just not as cost effective. - but still good, don't overlook that part :-)
Its not cost effective for what YOU'RE trying to make it do. And you did say it was bad by recommending it be a red item. Obviously, if you're interested in spamming the same spell over and over you're better off with pearls of power.
The RoW adds to your versatility. A lot. You can now memorize many different situationally powerful and utility or defensive spells. This works especially well if you also invest in heighten/preferred spell (or SF/SS/GSF) so you can always spam your shocking grasps without actually memorizing any (a combo/tactic I'd heavily recommend to virtually ANY prepared caster).
Nothing's stopping you from having a RoW AND some pearls of power. In fact, they can work quite well together.
Optimizers have a troubling tendency to downgrade versatility in favor of making their schtick better. Don't underestimate the value of having OPTIONS both in and out of combat.
The magus is typically a "one trick pony" as you pointed out. The RoW gives options which is always a good thing for that type of character. Having twice as many spells available is never a bad thing. You have fewer tough choices, aka not having to forgo memorizing a spell for something else, which is always nice. I mean unless your GM never throws a curveball your way and it is always a hack'n'slash game. That is what makes RoW "blue" worthy.
@ MTCityHunter: Just re-read my first post - I do start by saying "red" but I can se I do change my mind and end up with a "gren" rating. - My first post doesn't reflext this as well as i had intended...
At low to midtlevels the cost is just to high. At High level you might afford a Ring of Wizardry - and it's not a bad option - and YES it gives the magus more option (I love options) for what spells he'll have memorised - but the COST. Sure at lvl 20 you should have one - but before you buy one you should have a collection of Pearls of Power. Simply because they are cheap compared to Rings and help with a basic problem with the magus - the few spells pr day.
As again IMHO (H= humble) ring of wizardy - good, but I wouldn't hoard my gold to get one. Sure at high level when money is less of a problem I would get around to buy one. But I see a "blue" option as a must-have, Ring of Wizardry is an item I'll buy at some point - but no rush - that would make it "green" to me.
First, sorry for poor spelling, cause English isn´t my first language, but this discussion is exactly what i´m looking for.
I´m playing a hexcrafter bladebound Magus (Strengthbuild) in Carrion Crown.
After we solved the "Trial of the beast" our group was shopping for new items and the GM rolled for an RoW I in the shopping-list of Lepidstadt. So my 7th to 8th level Magus had to chose between an very early RoW or a handful pearls of power. By the way, our bard rolled critical on diplomacy, so i could buy it just for 3/4.
After I read the posts of you guys, I chose the Ring, because of the versatility that it gives.
I have preferred spell (shocking grasp), Magical Lineage and intensified.
So like MTCityHunter says, I can spam it like there is no tomorrow.
Preparing 9 different spells is in a campaign like CC, were are so many different types of enemies, not just awesome it´s necessary.
And my GM wouldn´t allow to recall a spell with a pearl, which I sacrificed for an shocking grasp.
P.S. @Walter: Thanks for your awesome Guide. The Magus I build with your Guide´s help made my GM envious. He plays also an Magus in another group. ^^
So my 7th to 8th level Magus had to chose between an very early RoW or a handful pearls of power. After I read the posts of you guys, I chose the Ring, because of the versatility that it gives. Preparing 9 different spells is in a campaign like CC, were are so many different types of enemies, not just awesome it´s necessary.
Even at 3/4 cost, that's a pretty big chunk of your WBL at that stage. Ordinarily, I probably wouldn't horde wealth specifically to save for one quite that early, but given that you obviously had the means, and got it at a discount, its a wonderful thing to have (as you've experienced). It also helps that you're a BB, and so have likely managed to save a hefty sum of gold via the blackblade.
And my GM wouldn´t allow to recall a spell with a pearl, which I sacrificed for an shocking grasp.
Not sure why anyone would disallow that kind of thing, as the two are inherently unrelated, and its perfectly legitimate.
You recall any memorized spell which has been expended with a PoP. You lose memorized spells to spontaneously cast SG via PS. You should certainly be able to regain any of your already cast spells via the PoP, whether they were cast normally or converted to SG, then expended. At the very least, you should be able to use the PoP to re-memorize SG (if the house-ruled interpretation is that the memorized spell is converted to a memorized SG, which is then cast; that's incidentally not the case because it allows spontaneous casting using prepared spell slots, not conversion of memorized spells into other memorized spells).
Its obviously any GM's prerogative to rule any way they choose on any given issue, but yours is stretching that pretty far in this particular case IMO, considering their ruling goes against pretty clear rules. Personally, I'd have fought for that one, but c'est la vie, I suppose its not really a deal breaker. It IS more of an important issue for Hexcrafters than vanilla Magi though, due to delaying access to spell recall for so long.