Tonberries

[VikingIrishman]

Didn't know whether to post this under Conversions or Homebrew. Admins, feel free to remove the one that's in the wrong forum.

At any rate, I've been working on some stuff, and I just whipped up what I think is a passable first go at a Tonberry.

Stats can be found HERE.

Any feedback would be greatly appreciated.

[Sphen86]

I hate doing it this way, but I have no fix what the only thing I see that is "wrong" with the Tonberry you've created. While it is very well done and extrememly similiar to the FF original, it would be childs play to avoid. Even a Small creature in Full Plate can outrun this thing. I guess I do have some advice. Make a part of thier curse that anyone trying to run from it have to make a will save or be unable to do so.

[VikingIrishman]

Well that was kind of the Tonberry's schtick anyway. Do you have a long fight or just be on your merry? I rather like the idea of making it hard to avoid though. Maybe some kind of reverse sanctuary could be implemented for the Tonberry King.

[Sphen86]

And of course, for added challenge, he would have regular Tonberries for minions.

[Kane Blaise]

Tonberries are all about risk vs reward. Offer enough reward and you won't need a reason for the players to stick around mechanically.

[VikingIrishman]

Kane Blaise wrote:

Tonberries are all about risk vs reward. Offer enough reward and you won't need a reason for the players to stick around mechanically.

Well put.

[MordredofFairy]

hm.
i like that, great idea and good work. BUT: i'd like to see something like the following(inverted repulsion) as a spelllike-ability for tonberries:

Attraction:

School abjuration; Level cleric 7, sorcerer/wizard 6
Casting Time 1 standard action
Components V, S, F/DF (a pair of canine statuettes worth 50 gp)
Range up to 10 ft./level
Area up to 10-ft.-radius/level emanation centered on you
Duration 1 round/level (D)
Saving Throw Will negates; Spell Resistance yes

An invisible, mobile field surrounds you and prevents creatures from moving away from you. You decide how big the field is at the time of casting (to the limit your level allows). Any creature within or entering the field must attempt a save. If it fails, it becomes unable to move away from you for the duration of the spell. Attracted creatures' actions are not otherwise restricted. They can fight other creatures and can cast spells and attack you with ranged weapons. If you move closer to an affected creature, nothing happens. The creature is not forced back. The creature is free to make melee attacks against you if you come within reach. If a attracted creature moves closer to you and then tries to turn back away from you, it cannot move any further awayif it is within the spell's area.

I think that could really add to the original feel. Tonberries slowly and steadily closed in. Being unable to move away from them would represent that pretty fantastically...(otherwise, despite risk/reward, you can just evade them perpetually and pepper them with arrows/magic/spring/rideby attacks...)

I think with that added, they'd be even better. Also, since there is plenty of non-damaging spells that may end the encounter without triggering karma, i'd add something like

"Backlash: If a Tonberry is affected(fails it's save against) by a spell that is not dealing hit point damage, the caster of the spell is affected by confusion for 1 round/3 levels of the spell(minimum 1).(Duration stacks for multiple backlashes)"

(Something minor, really, in the grand context of things, but still something to think about for people before spamming charm person on a group of tonberries)

[VikingIrishman]

MordredofFairy wrote:

hm.

i like that, great idea and good work. BUT: i'd like to see something like the following(inverted repulsion) as a spelllike-ability for tonberries:

** spoiler omitted **

I think that could really add to the original feel. Tonberries slowly and steadily closed in. Being unable to move away from them would represent that pretty fantastically...(otherwise, despite risk/reward, you can just evade them perpetually and pepper them with arrows/magic/spring/rideby attacks...)

I think with that added, they'd be even better. Also, since there is plenty of non-damaging spells that may end the encounter without triggering karma, i'd add something like

"Backlash: If a Tonberry is affected(fails it's save against) by a spell that is not dealing hit point damage, the caster of the spell is affected by confusion for 1 round/3 levels of the spell(minimum 1).(Duration...

That's a great idea. I like the sickened condition a lot better than confused, though.

I'm strongly considering giving them something akin to the paladin spell knight's calling. Any ideas on how to implement it? Maybe just tie it to the lantern?

[TriOmegaZero]

I'm not sure this concept can work. You're adding a lot of abilities to force characters to deal with this creature in a specific way. It feels very metagamey. A monster with a speed of 10ft that can SoD a character in melee is NOT a 12th level challenge.

Seriously, you are jumping through hoops trying to make it so the PCs can't overcome this encounter by walking away. You're trying to enforce the video game concept of 'kill the enemy get the experience' where it shouldn't be.

[VikingIrishman]

TriOmegaZero wrote:

I'm not sure this concept can work. You're adding a lot of abilities to force characters to deal with this creature in a specific way. It feels very metagamey. A monster with a speed of 10ft that can SoD a character in melee is NOT a 12th level challenge.

Seriously, you are jumping through hoops trying to make it so the PCs can't overcome this encounter by walking away. You're trying to enforce the video game concept of 'kill the enemy get the experience' where it shouldn't be.

It wasn't my original intention, but it seemed that the general consensus was that it needed some way of keeping things near it in order to present an appropriate challenge.

At any rate, I've grown fond of the "inescapable doom" these little bastards represent. As for the CR, its not set in stone. I've got to playtest them to see where they should actually lie.

[Sphen86]

Where are Tonberries found? In duengons, right? Make them the Keepers. They guard the treasure, the exits, the main corridors. I know it was my idea originally, but maybe it wasn't the best one. Instead of an ability to keep the players near them, how about just making it so that the Tonberries are in a risk vs. reward situation. Would it be better to fight the Tonberry to get the awesome loot he's guarding, or to avoid it entirely and miss out on the loot?

Alternately, what if instead of keeping the PC's close, the Tonberry slowed them. They're already cursed with a permenate slow effect, so just make it a small AoE. Maybe 10 or 15 feet.

[TriOmegaZero]

The slow aura is a good idea, as is the guardian idea. Higher level abilities like teleport and etherealness need to be considered in that case however. And a dimensional lock field would feel cheesy to me.

[Alexander Kilcoyne]

Won't post much but its well below CR12 IMHO.