I had a read of my ad&d elves book last night, and the bladesinger was indeed a fighter/mage class. It implied that it wasn't aheard off for a blade singer to use a two handed weapon, and said once the bladesinger rang out of spells would start using two-hands on their weapon anyway.
from the origins of the Complete book for elves in 2ed AD&D the bladesinger was an elven champion of the elven lands, they sing and dance in their off times an fought hard for the elven cause. It was a kit designed for fighter wizard multiclassing, so to imply that you have to take a level of bard to be a bladesinger takes away from the original intent of the kit. I have a few ideas on how to rework this class, but nothing substantial, I use it as is or not at all, I do agree with those that asked about the duskblade replacing this prestige class, cause it follows the original intent to a degree.
I knew people that played bladesingers in the heyday of 2ed AD&D and they would just burst to know that you want to turn this prestige class form the champion of the elves to a stacker for bards.
I am all for that take the existing and rename it to what you want, if it needs something else then tweak it....
I agree my bladesinger would have never been a bard!!!!!
I am presenting a rough draft of a PF bladesinger base class
I would like any feed-back
Bladesinger
Bladesinger represent up close combat and spell casting. Bladesingers are often scouts, trackers, and search for lost persons and items. The Bladesinger has unique mastery of a single specialized weapon, to the exclusion of all others, skill in combat and spell casting.
Bladesingers gain some specific benefits but at the cost of versatility in both combat and spellcasting.
Role: Bladesingers are deft skirmishers, either in melee or through spells at range, they are capable of skillfully dancing in and out of battle. Their abilities allow them to deal with foes.
Alignment: Any Good or N.
Hit Die: d10.
Class Skills
The Bladesinger's class skills are Acrobatics (Dex), Appraise (Int), Bluff (Cha), Climb (Str), Craft (Int), Diplomacy (Cha), Disguise (Cha), Escape Artist (Dex), Intimidate (Cha), Knowledge (all) (Int), Linguistics (Int), Perception (Wis), Perform (Cha), Profession (Wis), Sense Motive (Wis), Sleight of Hand (Dex), Spellcraft (Int), Stealth (Dex), and Use Magic Device (Cha).
BAB fighter
Fort good
reflex poor
Will good
Class Features
All of the following are class features of the Bladesinger.
Weapon and Armor Proficiency: A bladesinger selects a single bladed one-handed melee weapon from the following list (the choice is made at first level and can never be changed): dagger, sickle, shortspear, hand axe, rapier, kukri, shortsword, longsword, scimitar, bastard sword, and the elven curved blade. The Bladesinger is proficient in the selected weapon. The bladesinger gains a 5 point penalty to use any other weapon, and loses any racial weapon bonuses.
The Bladesinger is proficient with both light armor and medium armor. The Bladesinger can never learn to utilize a shield and suffers a penalty to armor class equivalent to the shields bonus. A bladesinger wearing heavy armor loses all bladesinger abilities while wearing the armor.
Spells: A bladesinger casts arcane spells drawn primarily from the sorcerer/wizard spell list. She can cast any spell she knows without preparing it ahead of time. To learn or cast a spell, a bladesinger must have a Charisma score equal to at least 10 + the spell level. The Difficulty Class for a saving throw against a Bladesinger's spell is 10 + the spell level + the Bladesinger's Charisma modifier.
Spell progression as Bard
Spells known as Bard
Upon reaching 4th level, and at every even-numbered level after that (6th, 8th, and so on), a bladesinger can choose to learn a new spell in place of one she already knows. In effect, the bladesinger loses the old spell in exchange for the new one. The new spell's level must be the same as that of the spell being exchanged. A bladesinger may swap only a single spell at any given level, and must choose whether or not to swap the spell at the same time that she gains new spells known for the level.
At second level the Bladesinger gains quicken spell (EX) as the feat of the same name except the quickening of the spell costs a slot 3 levels higher rather than 4. The bladesinger style of combat prevents the character from ever gaining or they lose the use of the following meta-magic feats:Still spell, silent spell. The bladesinger style of movement and vocalizations during combat prevents the character from ever casting without both movement and noise…..
I wanted to work in both evasion and uncanny dodge....
Any ideas?
BYC wrote: I just re-read my version, and there's lots of minor errors, like Concentration as a pre-req. I'll do some rewriting again.
I'm going to read Unearthed Arcana again, plus PF paladin's bonded weapon ability to determine which one is more appropriate to this theme.
I'll change the pre-req feats to Weapon Focus longsword/rapier instead of Finesse, and then add Finesse to Bladesong Oath and allow it to apply to longswords. I'll do a bit more tweaking. My posted is the first draft, and I didn't really notice all the errors in it.
Hi BYC, i really like your conversion, seems nicely balanced - not too powerful, but i don't see any "new version" with the longsword focus and stuff, anything upcoming :)?
I changed my version of bladesinger.
"Have at thee!"
Bladesinger
Bladesinger represent up close combat and spell casting. Bladesingers are often scouts, trackers, and search for lost persons and items. The Bladesinger has unique mastery of a single specialized weapon, to the exclusion of all others, skill in combat and spell casting.
Bladesingers gain some specific benefits but at the cost of versatility in both combat and spellcasting.
Role: Bladesingers are deft skirmishers, either in melee or through spells at range, they are capable of skillfully dancing in and out of battle. Their abilities allow them to deal with foes.
Alignment: Lawful.
Hit Die: d10.
Class Skills
The Bladesinger's class skills are Acrobatics (Dex), Appraise (Int), Bluff (Cha), Climb (Str), Craft (Int), Diplomacy (Cha), Disguise (Cha), Escape Artist (Dex), Intimidate (Cha), Knowledge (all) (Int), Linguistics (Int), Perception (Wis), Perform (Cha), Profession (Wis), Sense Motive (Wis), Sleight of Hand (Dex), Spellcraft (Int), Stealth (Dex), and Use Magic Device (Cha).
Table: Bladsinger
Level BAB Fort Ref Will Special
1st +1 +2 +0 +2 Weapon of choice, eschew materials 2nd +2 +3 +0 +3 Innate quicken 1/Day
3rd +3 +3 +1 +3
4th +4 +4 +1 +4
5th +4 +4 +1 +4 Clarity of might/magic +1
6th +6/+1 +5 +2 +5 Innate quicken 2/Day
7th +7/+2 +5 +2 +5
8th +8/+3 +6 +2 +6 Clarity of might/magic +2
9th +9/+4 +6 +3 +6
10th+10/+5 +7 +3 +7 Innate quicken 3/Day
11th+11/+6/+1 +7 +3 +7 Clarity of might/magic +3
12th+12/+7/+2 +8 +4 +8
13th+13/+8/+3 +8 +4 +8
14th+14/+9/+4 +9 +4 +9 IQ 4/Day,Clarity of M/M+4
15th+15/+10/+5 +9 +5 +9
16th+16/+11/+6/+1 +10 +5 +10
17th+17/+12/+7/+2 +10 +5 +10 Clarity of might/magic +5
18th+18/+13/+8/+3 +11 +6 +11 Innate quicken 5/Day
19th+19/+14/+9/+4 +11 +6 +11
20th+20/+15/+10/+5+12 +6 +12
Class Features
All of the following are class features of the Bladesinger.
Weapon and Armor Proficiency: A bladesinger selects a single bladed one-handed melee weapon from the following list (the choice is made at first level and can never be changed): dagger, sickle, shortspear, hand axe, rapier, kukri, shortsword, longsword, scimitar, bastard sword, and the elven curved blade. The Bladesinger is proficient in the selected weapon. The bladesinger gains a 5 point penalty to use any other weapon, and loses any racial weapon bonuses.
The Bladesinger is proficient with both light armor and medium armor. The Bladesinger can never learn to utilize a shield and suffers a penalty to armor class equivalent to the shields bonus. A bladesinger wearing heavy armor loses all bladesinger abilities while wearing the armor.
Spells: A bladesinger casts arcane spells drawn primarily from the sorcerer/wizard spell list. She can cast any spell she knows without preparing it ahead of time. To learn or cast a spell, a bladesinger must have a Charisma score equal to at least 10 + the spell level. The Difficulty Class for a saving throw against a Bladesinger's spell is 10 + the spell level + the Bladesinger's Charisma modifier.
Table: Bladesinger Spells Known
Level Spells Known
0 1st 2nd 3rd 4th 5th 6th
1st 4 2 — — — — —
2nd 5 2 — — — — —
3rd 5 3 — — — — —
4th 6 3 1 — — — —
5th 6 4 2 — — — —
6th 7 4 2 1 — — —
7th 7 5 3 2 — — —
8th 8 5 3 2 1 — —
9th 8 5 4 3 2 — —
10th 9 5 4 3 2 1 —
11th 9 5 5 4 3 2 —
12th 9 5 5 4 3 2 1
13th 9 5 5 4 4 3 2
14th 9 5 5 4 4 3 2
15th 9 5 5 4 4 4 3
16th 9 5 5 4 4 4 3
17th 9 5 5 4 4 4 3
18th 9 5 5 4 4 4 3
19th 9 5 5 4 4 4 3
20th 9 5 5 4 4 4 3
Like other spellcasters, a Bladesinger can cast only a certain number of spells of each spell level per day. Her base daily spell allotment is given on Table: Bladesinger. In addition, she receives bonus spells per day if she has a high Charisma score (see Table: Ability Modifiers and Bonus Spells).
A bladesinger's selection of spells is extremely limited. A bladesinger begins play knowing four 0-level spells and two 1st-level spells of her choice. At each new level, she gains one or more new spells, as indicated on Table: Bladesinger Spells Known. (Unlike spells per day, the number of spells a bladesinger knows is not affected by her Charisma score; the numbers on Table: Bladesinger Spells Known are fixed.) These new spells can be common spells chosen from the sorcerer/wizard spell list, or they can be unusual spells that the bladesinger has gained some understanding of through study.
Upon reaching 4th level, and at every even-numbered level after that (6th, 8th, and so on), a bladesinger can choose to learn a new spell in place of one she already knows. In effect, the bladesinger loses the old spell in exchange for the new one. The new spell's level must be the same as that of the spell being exchanged. A bladesingger may swap only a single spell at any given level, and must choose whether or not to swap the spell at the same time that she gains new spells known for the level. When exchanging for a new spell that spell can be taken from either the wizard/sorcerer or the bard spell list.
At second level the Bladesinger gains Innate metamagic quicken (EX) as if he possessed a lesser rod of metamagic quicken but only usable on 1 spell/day. Every four levels after second the Bladesinger gains an additional use of quicken per day.
The bladesinger style of combat prevents the character from ever gaining or they lose the use of the following meta-magic feats:
Still spell, silent spell.
The bladesinger style of movement and vocalizations during combat prevents the character from ever casting without both movement and noise.
Beginning at fifth level the bladesinger gains Clarity of might/magic, magical abilities become bonuses that he can apply when using his chosen weapon. Enhancing her weapon as a standard action by focusing on clearing his mind this clarity lasts for 1 minute per bladesinger level. At 5th level, the weapon gains a +1 enhancement bonus. For every three levels beyond 5th, the weapon gains another +1 enhancement bonus, to a maximum of +6 at 20th level. These bonuses can be added to the weapon, stacking with existing weapon bonuses to a maximum of +5, or they can be used to add any of the following weapon properties: axiomatic, brilliant energy, defending, disruption, flaming, flaming burst, holy, keen, merciful, and speed. Adding these properties consumes an amount of bonus equal to the property's cost (see Table: Melee Weapon Special Abilities). These bonuses are added to any properties the weapon already has, but duplicate abilities do not stack. If the weapon is not magical, at least a +1 enhancement bonus must be added before any other properties can be added. The bonus and properties granted during the focusing period and cannot be changed until the next time this ability is used. This clarity of might/magic imparts no bonuses if the weapon is held by anyone other than the bladesinger but resumes giving bonuses if returned to the bladesinger. These bonuses apply to only one end of a double weapon. A bladesinger can use this ability once per day at 5th level, and one additional time per day for every four levels beyond 5th, to a total of four times per day at 17th level.
I still need a capstone for this base class....
Any feedback?
So how does the Magus work as Bladesinger? Anyone tried it yet?
Erm, I dunno if anyone suggested it yet, but the Arcane Duelist in the APG seems like a pretty obvious way to make a Bladesinger. I mean, if I was running an FR game, that's what I'd use.
If you really wanted to, you could houserule the spell list a bit to make it somewhat more Wizard-y, but I don't think you'd really need to.
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