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Anyone else have problems with this little 1st level Psionic Power?
It basically entangles one target for five rounds, allows no save and requires a ranged touch attack to get off. Worse, if the target is against a wall or other solid object, he is immobilized instead of merely entangled for those 5 rounds. This means coup de gras city for 5 rounds. And at a cost of 1 Power Point (plus 2 for every size category above medium), the psion can spam it every 4 rounds or so to keep the beastie locked down.
This ability is causing me all kinds of headaches, so I am instituting a save allowed every round after the 1st (with an increasing +1 to the save starting on the 3rd round). Still it is at least as powerful as hold monster at the cost of a 1st level slot.
Thoughts? Ideas? Comments?
Okay, I'm looking at the spell now. If it's been changed beyond the version printed in EPH, then I can't comment (my copy of Complete Psionics is being used by someone at the moment).
I see no mention of increased restriction if the target is up against a wall, for one thing. It simply says "if you hit with a ranged touch attack the target is entangled". So I don't know where you or your player is getting that extra bit from.
Why are your monsters not making Escape Artist checks? And heck, the stronger ones should be able to break free with a STR check as well.
Also remember (or remind your player) that a Psion cannot spend more power points per round than equal to their level, and a Wilder cannot spend more than that either (though they can boost themselves beyond that restriction with Wild Surge, they risk Enervation if they do so). So at level 1, they CANNOT bind anything larger than Medium; level 3 would be the earliest they could bind something Large (base cost 1 + augment cost 2).
Hope that helps.
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Okay, I'm looking at the spell now. If it's been changed beyond the version printed in EPH, then I can't comment (my copy of Complete Psionics is being used by someone at the moment).
I see no mention of increased restriction if the target is up against a wall, for one thing. It simply says "if you hit with a ranged touch attack the target is entangled". So I don't know where you or your player is getting that extra bit from.
Why are your monsters not making Escape Artist checks? And heck, the stronger ones should be able to break free with a STR check as well.
Also remember (or remind your player) that a Psion cannot spend more power points per round than equal to their level, and a Wilder cannot spend more than that either (though they can boost themselves beyond that restriction with Wild Surge, they risk Enervation if they do so). So at level 1, they CANNOT bind anything larger than Medium; level 3 would be the earliest they could bind something Large (base cost 1 + augment cost 2).
Hope that helps.
I got my info from the DMG (at the back, in the Condition Summary section). Per the DMG:
Entangled: The character is ensnared. Being entangled impedes
movement, but does not entirely prevent it unless the bonds are
anchored to an immobile object or tethered by an opposing force.
An entangled creature moves at half speed, cannot run or charge,
and takes a –2 penalty on all attack rolls and a –4 penalty to Dexterity.
An entangled character who attempts to cast a spell must make a
Concentration check (DC 15 + the spell’s level) or lose the spell.
So if a person is next to an immobile object, according to the DMG, they are held fast, unable to move. Granted, this is not totally explicit; but as the power describes it, Entangling Ectoplasm entangles its target.
Anyone else have problems with this little 1st level Psionic Power?
It basically entangles one target for five rounds, allows no save and requires a ranged touch attack to get off. Worse, if the target is against a wall or other solid object, he is immobilized instead of merely entangled for those 5 rounds. This means coup de gras city for 5 rounds. And at a cost of 1 Power Point (plus 2 for every size category above medium), the psion can spam it every 4 rounds or so to keep the beastie locked down.
This ability is causing me all kinds of headaches, so I am instituting a save allowed every round after the 1st (with an increasing +1 to the save starting on the 3rd round). Still it is at least as powerful as hold monster at the cost of a 1st level slot.
Thoughts? Ideas? Comments?
It sounds like it's in the ballpark to me. Just looking at it, I see that its limitation is that(does it target multiple opponents? Is it effective against creatures larger than M, also?)it requires a ranged touch attack (from the psion, whose attack progression is really poor, which means low chance and high risk because a low-hp character without heavy armor has to get pretty close). It sounds as if you have ideas about limiting its power, but saving throws + attack roll from weak attacker might render it powerless. Regarding your coup de grace concern, compare to sleep, a 1st level spell: obviously there is a HD limitation, but if Will doesn't negate you're dead.
I got my info from the DMG (at the back, in the Condition Summary section). Per the DMG:Entangled: The character is ensnared. Being entangled impedes
movement, but does not entirely prevent it unless the bonds are
anchored to an immobile object or tethered by an opposing force.
An entangled creature moves at half speed, cannot run or charge,
and takes a –2 penalty on all attack rolls and a –4 penalty to Dexterity.
An entangled character who attempts to cast a spell must make a
Concentration check (DC 15 + the spell’s level) or lose the spell.So if a person is next to an immobile object, according to the DMG, they are held fast, unable to move. Granted, this is not totally explicit; but as the power describes it, Entangling Ectoplasm entangles its target.
Looking at the online SRD for both the power and the entangled condition I can see how you are reading it this way, but the power description says nothing about the ectoplasm anchoring against anything. Think of it more like a psionic tanglefoot bag minus the "stuck to floor" option.
I got my info from the DMG (at the back, in the Condition Summary section). Per the DMG:
Entangled: The character is ensnared. Being entangled impedes movement, but does not entirely prevent it unless the bonds are anchored to an immobile object or tethered by an opposing force. An entangled creature moves at half speed, cannot run or charge, and takes a –2 penalty on all attack rolls and a –4 penalty to Dexterity. An entangled character who attempts to cast a spell must make a Concentration check (DC 15 + the spell’s level) or lose the spell.
So if a person is next to an immobile object, according to the DMG, they are held fast, unable to move. Granted, this is not totally explicit; but as the power describes it, Entangling Ectoplasm entangles its target.
Nowhere in the spell description does it say that the Ectoplasm binds them to anything. It simply says it entangles them. Emphasis on them: the entangling does not, anywhere in the spell description, say it binds the target to any surrounding structures. The goo just surrounds its target.
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Nowhere in the spell description does it say that the Ectoplasm binds them to anything. It simply says it entangles them. Emphasis on them: the entangling does not, anywhere in the spell description, say it binds the target to any surrounding structures. The goo just surrounds its target.I got my info from the DMG (at the back, in the Condition Summary section). Per the DMG:
Entangled: The character is ensnared. Being entangled impedes movement, but does not entirely prevent it unless the bonds are anchored to an immobile object or tethered by an opposing force. An entangled creature moves at half speed, cannot run or charge, and takes a –2 penalty on all attack rolls and a –4 penalty to Dexterity. An entangled character who attempts to cast a spell must make a Concentration check (DC 15 + the spell’s level) or lose the spell.
So if a person is next to an immobile object, according to the DMG, they are held fast, unable to move. Granted, this is not totally explicit; but as the power describes it, Entangling Ectoplasm entangles its target.
Ah, this makes sense. I think I will go with this, as it would solve all my problems. I still think the power is poorly worded, as it begs you to look up the entangled condition, which then leads to further adjudication.
Thanks for the advice.
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Looking at the online SRD for both the power and the entangled condition I can see how you are reading it this way, but the power description says nothing about the ectoplasm anchoring against anything. Think of it more like a psionic tanglefoot bag minus the "stuck to floor" option.
I got my info from the DMG (at the back, in the Condition Summary section). Per the DMG:Entangled: The character is ensnared. Being entangled impedes
movement, but does not entirely prevent it unless the bonds are
anchored to an immobile object or tethered by an opposing force.
An entangled creature moves at half speed, cannot run or charge,
and takes a –2 penalty on all attack rolls and a –4 penalty to Dexterity.
An entangled character who attempts to cast a spell must make a
Concentration check (DC 15 + the spell’s level) or lose the spell.So if a person is next to an immobile object, according to the DMG, they are held fast, unable to move. Granted, this is not totally explicit; but as the power describes it, Entangling Ectoplasm entangles its target.
Thank you as well.
Thanks for the advice.
Glad to help. That's one of my favorite powers for a low-level Shaper and I was wondering if I was missing out on some big advantage I'd never noticed before. :D
Just for the record, even if it did immobilize them against a wall they still couldn't be coup de graced. That requires the target to be helpless, not just immobilized.
A psion my brother plays uses this power sometimes, I think it's balanced.