Hi everybody.
We are planning to start our first Pathfinder campaign and my wife would like to play a spellcaster who doesn't need to prepare her spells in advance AND has an Animal Companion.
I guess I could talk her into accepting the Familiar from the Sorcerer's Arcane Bloodline, but I think it would be actually more fun for her (and fun is what we play for, after all) if I could have her take a Sorcerer Bloodline which indeed allowed for an Animal Companion.
(I'm thinking a Bloodline and not a Feat or something because that's a major improvement to the character and shouldn't be so cheap)
I don't think anybody has come out with such a Bloodline yet, so I'm asking you: do you have any suggestions on how I should modify an existing Bloodline (or create a new one) in order to allow this? What I'm trying to understand is exactly how much should I have her "pay for it" in terms of removing or downgrading existing Bloodline powers and bonuses in order to "make space" for this new ability.
Please note that I don't want to make her character too strong or unbalanced, anyway, and I don't want the Animal Companion to become too common in my game world either.
Thanks for your help,
--
Nekomante
Well, base it on the Arcane (but possibly with spells more suited with her theme), get her to take the Familiar and the feat Improved Familiar, for instance.
Or instead of getting a familiar, let her have an animal companion as a druid of her level -3 (like a ranger).
But it would boost her combat ability somewhat.
Well, you could always allow the feat "Obtain familiar" or whatever from complete arcane, which allows casters without a familiar (in 3.5 it was a bard feat) to get one.
One of the new classes coming out (maybe the witch?) has those features I believe.
I would take the Fey bloodline, drop the arcana and the Laughing Touch and give her the Animal Companion as a druid instead. If I felt like going through the trouble, maybe I would change the favored skill to Handle Animal and replace a few of the bonus spells with more appropriate selections (like Speak with Animals).
Depending on the level of your campaign, she could just take leadership and take an animal companion instead of a regular cohort (the bard in my campaign does that) otherwise, you could look up a feat called 'wild cohort' from WOTC that would need conversion.
There are several ways:
Take the Arcane Bloodline (or a different one, maybe Fey, and switch out the appropriate power) and get an animal companion instead of a familiar, maybe at an effective druid level equal to sorcerer level -4.
Or play a druid and make spellcasting spontaneous. Use spells/day and spells known from the sorcerer (but add summon nature's ally for free at every spell level). You can do this with Cha or Wis - either way is fine.
You could also reduce the spells known number and let the character change the selection at dawn each day.
I agree with the "animal companion at level-3 (minimum 1)" suggestion.
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BLOODLINE
Nature Bond
Your family has always had a strong tie to nature. This may have been because of a dryad being an ancestor, or perhaps some sort gift from a nature god, or perhaps a renegade druid experimented on an ancestor. No matter how, you have inherited that strong bind with nature.
Class Skill: Knowledge (Nature).
Bonus Spells: Summon Nature's Ally I (3rd), Summon Nature's Ally II (5th), Summon Nature's Ally III (7th), Summon Nature's Ally IV (9th), Summon Nature's Ally V (11th), Summon Nature's Ally VI (13th), Summon Nature's Ally VII (15th), Summon Nature's Ally VIII (17th), Summon Nature's Ally IX (19th).
Bonus Feats: Animal Affinity, Spell Focus (Conjuration), Augment Summoning, Endurance, Fleet, Toughness, Skill Focus (Knowledge(Nature)), Skill Focus (Survival), Self-Sufficent, Run
Bloodline Arcana: Whenever you use summon nature's ally add +1 to your caster level for purposes of determining how long your summoned ally remains.
Bloodline Powers: Nature magic comes easy to you, and nature is your friend and ally on your path to greater magic.
Familiar (Su): At 1st level, you gain a familiar, as a wizard who had selected one as his arcane bond, equal to your sorcerer level.
Companion (Su): At 3rd level, your familiar metamorphoses into an animal companion. You retain your familiar's familiar boon, but it now becomes an animal companion and follows all rules for animal companions. Your effective Druid level equals your sorcerer level - 2. Any levels of Druid you gain stack with your effective druid level from this bloodline ability.
Nature's Gift (Su): At 9th level, you can add any one druid spell from the druid spell list to your list of spells known. This spell must be of a level less than the maximum level you are capable of casting. It is treated as an arcane spell for you. You can also add one additional spell at 13th level and 17th level.
Nature's Power (Su): At 15th level, the DC for any spells you cast that are both druid and sorcerer/wizard spells increases by +2. This bonus stacks with the bonus granted by Spell Focus. This applies to any spells you choose via the Nature's Gift power.
Nature's Perfection : At 20th level, your body surges with natural power. You gain the Outsider (Native) template, you cease to age. You are at one with nature. You may wild-shape once per day as if a druid equal to your sorcerer level.
Bonus Spells: Summon Nature's Ally I (3rd), Summon Nature's Ally II (5th), Summon Nature's Ally III (7th), Summon Nature's Ally IV (9th), Summon Nature's Ally V (11th), Summon Nature's Ally VI (13th), Summon Nature's Ally VII (15th), Summon Nature's Ally VIII (17th), Summon Nature's Ally IX (19th).
I'd argue a different spell set(and Bloodline Arcana of course), the DM said he didn't want companions to become common... giving a sorcerer a billion castings of summon nature's ally a day is kinda just as bad.
Also, I don't know the reasoning/system behind the PF CORE spell choices in Bloodlines, but none of them are quite that well themed either. The biggest example being the 'Celestial' Bloodline for non-arcane bonus spells.
My suggestion would be something like this... or other buff spells(Bear's Endurance, Bull's Strength, etc).
3rd - Speak with Animals
5th - Barkskin
7th - Speak with Plants
9th - Freedom of Movement
11th - Stoneskin
13th - Stone Tell
…etc.
I'd argue a different spell set(and Bloodline Arcana of course), the DM said he didn't want companions to become common... giving a sorcerer a billion castings of summon nature's ally a day is kinda just as bad.
I took that as 'don't want animal companions to be common' not 'don't want summoned monsters'. The two are different.
Also, I don't know the reasoning/system behind the PF CORE spell choices in Bloodlines, but none of them are quite that well themed either. The biggest example being the 'Celestial' Bloodline for non-arcane bonus spells.
Not my fault, I swear! I had nothing to do with picking out the spells, you'd have to talk to James and Jason about that. :)
My suggestion would be something like this... or other buff spells(Bear's Endurance, Bull's Strength, etc).
3rd - Speak with Animals
5th - Barkskin
7th - Speak with Plants
9th - Freedom of Movement
11th - Stoneskin
13th - Stone Tell
…etc.
Those are perfectly acceptable too, of course. They are also in theme, as much as mine honestly.
LOL, I wasn't attacking your post so much as providing alternative suggestions with the explanations as to why.
Companions are not the same as Summons, not even close if you take duration and durability into account, my thinking behind comparing the 2 was a battlefield perspective. Think map clutter and time consumption.
A 5th level sorcerer with high CHA could have approx. 5 or so 2nd level castings... summoning(Ally II) 1d3 rabid jackalopes for 3 rds each... over and over and over, until you swear they are actually spontaeneously breeding and not fighting at all.
LOL, I wasn't attacking your post so much as providing alternative suggestions with the explanations as to why.
Companions are not the same as Summons, not even close if you take duration and durability into account, my thinking behind comparing the 2 was a battlefield perspective. Think map clutter and time consumption.
A 5th level sorcerer with high CHA could have approx. 5 or so 2nd level castings... summoning(Ally II) 1d3 rabid jackalopes for 3 rds each... over and over and over, until you swear they are actually spontaeneously breeding and not fighting at all.
LOL
I have no problem with lots of low level summons, personally. Then again, I often do that to the PC's. ;)| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Also, I don't know the reasoning/system behind the PF CORE spell choices in Bloodlines, but none of them are quite that well themed either. The biggest example being the 'Celestial' Bloodline for non-arcane bonus spells.
Elemental and Fey bloodlines have Druid spells. I don't see how non-arcane spells hurt the theme... in fact, I think they're one of the more interesting enticements to play a Sorcerer instead of a Wizard!
My take -
Some might see you as regal, others as unruly, but all agree that you radiate primal passion. Perhaps you were raised by wolves, or had a powerful druid for an ancestor; but however it came about, your animalistic demeanor is more than a personality quirk.
Class Skill: Survival.
Bonus Spells: speak with animals (3rd), animal messenger (5th), dominate animal (7th), poison (9th), animal growth (11th), mass hold animal (as mass hold person, but affects only animals) (13th), summon nature's ally VII (animals only) (15th), animal shapes (17th), summon nature's ally IX (animals only) (19th).
Bonus Feats: Endurance, Improved Initiative, Great Fortitude, Iron Will, Lightning Reflexes, Silent Spell, Skill Focus (Survival), Weapon Finesse.
Bloodline Arcana: You count as an animal for any effect related to creature type. You can suppress or resume this ability as a free action, and it is automatically suppressed whenever you are unconscious, asleep, or not in control of your own actions.
Bloodline Powers: You grow increasingly connected with wild animals, gaining their trust and emulating their nature.
Animal Affinity (Sp): With a touch, you can improve the attitude of an animal to friendly for ten minutes. Any overtly hostile act by you or your apparent allies breaks this effect. You can use this ability a number of times per day equal to 3 + your Charisma modifier.
Animal Companion: At 3rd level, you gain the service of an animal companion. Your effective druid level for this animal companion is equal to your sorcerer level.
Wildform (Su): Beginning at 9th level you can transform yourself into an animal, as if with beast form III, as a free action. You may perform or sustain this transformation for a number of rounds per day equal to your Sorcerer level. These rounds do not need to be consecutive. While using this ability, you gain the benefits of the Natural Spell feat.
Greater Animal Affinity: At 15th level, when you use your animal affinity ability, it affects all animals within 30 feet and lasts for 1 hour.
Greater Wildform: Upon gaining 20th level, your wildform ability no longer has a limit on rounds per day.
Also, I don't know the reasoning/system behind the PF CORE spell choices in Bloodlines, but none of them are quite that well themed either. The biggest example being the 'Celestial' Bloodline for non-arcane bonus spells.Elemental and Fey bloodlines have Druid spells. I don't see how non-arcane spells hurt the theme... in fact, I think they're one of the more interesting enticements to play a Sorcerer instead of a Wizard!
I never said it did. I said the bloodlines aren't that well theme'd, referring to the spell list. Meaning they don't have the same spell and all of it's successors in the same bloodline. (ex: Blah I, Blah II, Blah III, Blah IV, etc.)
I'm running a 13th level Celestial Sorcerer and its awesome.
I would take the Fey bloodline, drop the arcana and the Laughing Touch and give her the Animal Companion as a druid instead. If I felt like going through the trouble, maybe I would change the favored skill to Handle Animal and replace a few of the bonus spells with more appropriate selections (like Speak with Animals).
This, honestly, sounds like the most thematically appropriate choice if you're sticking to the bloodline = actual lineage of magical talent/ability concept. A lot of these concepts seem to be "you're so good with animals you spontaneously develop the ability to cast magic."
Otherwise, it's all gravy.
Question: Does your player simply want an animal companion & to be a spontaneous spellcaster, or does she want an animal themed spellcaster? Because, honestly, you could just replace the 1st level ability & the bloodline arcana with an animal companion (as druid -3) with a minimum druid level of 1. You'd get it from level 1 but it would lag just like a cleric or ranger.
Really, though, in the grand scheme of things, an animal companion is only a couple steps ahead of a familiar in terms of combat utility when you don't have the amazing druid buffs to back it up. Druids make their companions awesome- otherwise they're just glorified flanking bonuses that can take a couple hits.
This, honestly, sounds like the most thematically appropriate choice if you're sticking to the bloodline = actual lineage of magical talent/ability concept. A lot of these concepts seem to be "you're so good with animals you spontaneously develop the ability to cast magic."Otherwise, it's all gravy.
:(
I thought I did a good job (or as good as the ones in the book) with a background for mine. Three thematic possibilities.
:(
This, honestly, sounds like the most thematically appropriate choice if you're sticking to the bloodline = actual lineage of magical talent/ability concept. A lot of these concepts seem to be "you're so good with animals you spontaneously develop the ability to cast magic."Otherwise, it's all gravy.
:(
I thought I did a good job (or as good as the ones in the book) with a background for mine. Three thematic possibilities.
:(
Dude, I meant no offense. I really liked your write-up. Also, I missed your fluff from the start of the post.
Y'know, I started with this and then got wishy-washy about it... but I think the level 11 bonus spell on my version should be awaken (animals only). The rest of the list is about controlling or interacting with animals, not buffing them. Awaken fits.
Daniel: I agree about "every version of a spell" being a pretty bad theme, especially for bonus spells. They can't be replaced, so shouldn't become obsolete. I really wish I had found something more appropriate for 7th level on my chart, heh. Sure, it's advantageous when you want to summon multiple elephants (or a single roc?) without blowing a 9th level slot, but... yeah.
Dude, I meant no offense. I really liked your write-up. Also, I missed your fluff from the start of the post.
:) :) :)
First of all, thanks everyone for the response. Every post was appreciated.
Question: Does your player simply want an animal companion & to be a spontaneous spellcaster, or does she want an animal themed spellcaster?
The former. And it's more for RP and flavour then for anything else - she just likes the idea of hanging around with an animal pet which grows in power with her Sorcerer levels. So, she's going to be a gnome sorcerer riding a tiger as an Animal Companion.
I think I'll go with the modified Fey bloodline, as originally proposed by dthunder, because it's probably the solution with the lesser impact on the official rules. All the other solutions make sense, though. The Animal-themed bloodlines are good, and I also agree on the need for a spontaneous divine caster.
--
Nekomante
Rather than have the familiar spontaneously metamorphose into an animal companion, why not just have it grow up? Let her start with a tiger cub which coincidentally uses the same stats as the house cat familiar. At a certain point, it goes through a growth spurt to become the size and stats of a leopard, and later on goes up to full tiger stats. It's not a housecat that becomes a leopard then becomes a tiger, it's a tiger cub who becomes an adolescent that then becomes full grown, but it makes it easier to use those stat blocks.
Rather than have the familiar spontaneously metamorphose into an animal companion, why not just have it grow up? Let her start with a tiger cub which coincidentally uses the same stats as the house cat familiar. At a certain point, it goes through a growth spurt to become the size and stats of a leopard, and later on goes up to full tiger stats. It's not a housecat that becomes a leopard then becomes a tiger, it's a tiger cub who becomes an adolescent that then becomes full grown, but it makes it easier to use those stat blocks.
For my suggestion, I am assuming you mean? What I put down was that the 'familiar' spontaneously converts into a companion. In character, that means nothing. Mechanically, it means the familiar (same one you've had) begins gaining the bonuses from being an animal companion, which it wasn't before. It also follows animal companion rules for hp's, instead of the familiar rules. It's still the same animal, it just lags behind a couple of levels before it starts 'bulking up'. So, as you said, it's not a housecat that suddenly becomes a leopard, it was a leopard cub for the first two levels, then 'grew up' into a young leopard, and eventually into a big nasty leopard. Presumably you know what you want as an animal companion when it becomes one, pick a familiar that fits with that.