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I was converting my PFS character, a Fighter/Cleric of Iomedae and Eagle Knight of Andoran. It's a very MAD (multi ability dependant) concept, and when you're in heavy armor (as most shield users tend to use) dex is not an important stat.
Yet to shield bash effectively, you need TWF, which requires DEX 15! WotC fixed this in PHB2 (the 3.5 one) with Agile Shield Fighter. Honestly I was hoping Paizo would do something similar, or just reduce TWF to Dex 13 or BAB 1 or something!
It's a bit frustrating.
I was converting my PFS character, a Fighter/Cleric of Iomedae and Eagle Knight of Andoran. It's a very MAD (multi ability dependant) concept, and when you're in heavy armor (as most shield users tend to use) dex is not an important stat.
Yet to shield bash effectively, you need TWF, which requires DEX 15! WotC fixed this in PHB2 (the 3.5 one) with Agile Shield Fighter. Honestly I was hoping Paizo would do something similar, or just reduce TWF to Dex 13 or BAB 1 or something!
It's a bit frustrating.
I'm a little sad, because this was mentioned and we were told it would be addressed. At least it's an easy houserule (I ignore ALL pre-reqs myself, and go with GM approval).
Do you still need TWF for ALL the shield bash feats?
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I was converting my PFS character, a Fighter/Cleric of Iomedae and Eagle Knight of Andoran. It's a very MAD (multi ability dependant) concept, and when you're in heavy armor (as most shield users tend to use) dex is not an important stat.
Yet to shield bash effectively, you need TWF, which requires DEX 15! WotC fixed this in PHB2 (the 3.5 one) with Agile Shield Fighter. Honestly I was hoping Paizo would do something similar, or just reduce TWF to Dex 13 or BAB 1 or something!
It's a bit frustrating.
Umm if your concept is to use two weapons to fight with, then even heavily armed, Dex is an important stat.
If you want to use the shield defensively, no problem, don't invest in Dex. You want to use a shield as a second weapon invest in Dex and TWF. No problem.
I am curious, do you allow other TWF combos to have a low Dex and no TWF?
Just houserule you don't need high stats for any thing, and allow anyone to do anything they want. Problem fixed, and no pesky logic to get in the way.
I'm not sure how MAD that character concept really is.
DEX 15 sure, but you don't ever need to take it higher, unless you want to go for Weapon Finesse and neglect STR. Starting at 13/14 DEX and raising thru inherent increases seems a pretty reasonable way to go, depending on when you want to get Shield Bash Feats.
Otherwise, good STR is the staple choice of melee builds, of course.
CON isn't particularly crucial to this build, any more than it's benefit to every character.
INT like-wise.
WIS is only necessary if you want to target Enemies with spells that call for Saves, and it's nice to get the bonus spell but you're not talking higher than 12-14 at 1st level to already qualify for 1st and 2nd level spells.
CHA gives you more Channel Energy & increases the DC, but it's hardly necessary.
As a Cleric you have plenty of spells to buff your own stats, and multi-classing with Fighter gives you good melee ability such that maxing out WIS and CHA can't be seen as 'crucial' as they might for an offensive spell-casting & channeling focused build, without melee heft and heavy AC to rely on.
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I think the best fix would've just been to drop the TWF requirement down to Dex 13, which would also have put it in line with Power Attack and Combat Expertise.
15 is a pretty high stat when you're working with the regular pointbuy. In my own house games it's never really been an issue because we allow Agile Shield Fighter from PHB2.
Also yes, the new shield bashing feat added in requires TWF.