I am working on converting Chadranthar's Bane from the old Dungeon mag.
My problem is with the first encounter with the goblins. I have decided to use kobolds instead of goblins because they have already encountered goblins and I use the Paizo goblins so I do not think they will mix well.
The basis of the encounter is the party has just been shrunk and have been split up, some possibly on chairs others on benches with quite some distance between them. Now the kobolds have 4 groups of 10 kobolds each that lower themselves down to areas to get the players. There is also a reserve of 10 and the leader and his bodyguards along with the witchdoctor.
Now if these was one mass group attacking, even if in waves then it would be easy to balance against the entire party. But with this setup it becomes difficult because the party will be split up, each member alone and not much chance of help right away.
My idea is to make each group seperately but not sure what XP to use for the group. Each player is level 5, and I want the fight to be tough but not a slaughter. I am thinking 7 minions and 3 other types. I guess my question boils down to, what level should I balance the kobold group to be a challenge for a single level 5 PC.
I am still getting my feet under me with 4th Ed, and normally if I make an encounter too tough fudging is easy, but with this setup I have very little chance to tweak things on the fly.
Holy...!
I'll admit that I have nothing useful to contribute to this discussion, since I know next to nothing about 4E. But I can't help but speak up. You're running Chadranther's Bane?! Wow! The whole premise of that one reeled me in:
I ran part of that in 3rd Edition, but found the opening encounter problematic. How could goblins who are only 1st-level warriors have sufficient Climb skill to lower themselves down the ropes so reliably? I fudged it by saying that they practiced for hours every day, allowing them to take 10, which is NOT what was intended by the "Take 10" rule, but ah well.
I downloaded the DCC "The Dragonfiend Pact" hoping that it would do Chadranther's Bane in a way better for 3rd Edition. But it didn't. Instead of coming up with new stats for monsters that seem larger (relative to the PCs), it expected you to change the stats for the PCs, in accordance with 3rd edition rules. Unfortunately, those rules were a bit wonky and inaccurate, and changing the PCs' stats is more trouble than it's worth, IMO.
<Clears throat.> Okay, sorry about that little outburst. I hope you get helpful replies.
I am working on converting Chadranthar's Bane from the old Dungeon mag.
My problem is with the first encounter with the goblins. I have decided to use kobolds instead of goblins because they have already encountered goblins and I use the Paizo goblins so I do not think they will mix well.
The basis of the encounter is the party has just been shrunk and have been split up, some possibly on chairs others on benches with quite some distance between them. Now the kobolds have 4 groups of 10 kobolds each that lower themselves down to areas to get the players. There is also a reserve of 10 and the leader and his bodyguards along with the witchdoctor.
Now if these was one mass group attacking, even if in waves then it would be easy to balance against the entire party. But with this setup it becomes difficult because the party will be split up, each member alone and not much chance of help right away.
My idea is to make each group seperately but not sure what XP to use for the group. Each player is level 5, and I want the fight to be tough but not a slaughter. I am thinking 7 minions and 3 other types. I guess my question boils down to, what level should I balance the kobold group to be a challenge for a single level 5 PC.
I am still getting my feet under me with 4th Ed, and normally if I make an encounter too tough fudging is easy, but with this setup I have very little chance to tweak things on the fly.
The straight up math would presumably be 5 1st level monsters is = to 1 5th level PC. The extremes here a bit large however. Maybe make them 2nd level considering that most are minions. Excellent choice of adventure btw, I ran it in 1st or 2nd and it turned into a spectacular adventure arc.
Chadranther's Bane was probably my favorite adventure thoughout Dungeon's entire run. Some of that likely comes from the great campaign it inspired. My group at the time didn't want to get big again so they spent about ten levels building a tiny little empire.
Wow! I didn't realize so many people ran this adventure!
Chadranther's Bane was probably my favorite adventure thoughout Dungeon's entire run. Some of that likely comes from the great campaign it inspired. My group at the time didn't want to get big again so they spent about ten levels building a tiny little empire.
That's funny. This adventure ENDED my campaign in the same way. I was running an "evil monster" campaign, including 2 goblinoid PCs, and they conquered the goblins and ruled them. I wanted to move on to another campaign idea at that time, and this seemed a satisfying ending.
I was running an "evil monster" campaign, including 2 goblinoid PCs...
Correction: 3 goblinoid PCs.
Well the encounter was a success. I went with 6 minions and 2 skirmishers. It was a little underpowered but the party was off balance a bit with the shrinking and being seperated. The wizard did the best with Thunderwave being used to push alot of the kobolds off his chair. The cleric and ranger had the most problems as they were on benches but were able to group up. That meant they had 2 assault groups to deal with. The fighter did not have any worries but took the longest. I decided not to have the chief and his bodyguards enter the fight. The party needs to head up to the lair to get the paladin's gear (he was a prisoner when the encounter started)so the fight will happen.
The evening ended with the party bunking down in a corner for a rest. The cleric on watch duty when she heard some large scratching and two LARGE red eyes peering at her through the darkness.
One thing I really liked about the encounter was the fact that since the paladin was a prisoner he encountered Tanin, the illusionist. Since I did not have any stats for her, I was able to use her illusion powers as I wanted. She did a basic one of the cage door being fine after it had been busted open, a simple illusion of the paladin as a kobold to get him close to an assualt groups ropes so they could climb down. The best was when the party on the floor (they had the rope) was trying to convince the wizard and fighter stuck on the chairs to jump as they were sure (well mostly) that the fall would not hurt as much. The illusionist cast a 'spell' of feather landing. The wizard fell for it. The dwarf fighter simply replied 'B!$!%$!s to that Boys!'. He eventually jumped.
Overall fun fight. Now to figure out the stats for the 'normal-sized' rats. I used the monster builder to upgrade the Dire Rat but they seem mundane, no powers, nothing special about them really just the disease.
Interesting. I'll be sure check this thread again someday to hear what happens next.
I ran part of that in 3rd Edition, but found the opening encounter problematic. How could goblins who are only 1st-level warriors have sufficient Climb skill to lower themselves down the ropes so reliably? I fudged it by saying that they practiced for hours every day, allowing them to take 10, which is NOT what was intended by the "Take 10" rule, but ah well.
Some time ago, I saw WotC's preview of the Shining South, including the stats for Tasloi. Today, I happened to look at those stats, and saw that Tasloi can always choose to take 10 on Climb checks, even if rushed or threatened. And they even use rats as mounts! Man! Maybe I should run it again, some day, replacing the goblins with Tasloi.