I'm looking for a way to change my campaigns to satisfy my players a bit more (and thus myself!). The issue comes from one player who would like to see some court intrigue and diplomacy thrown into the game, politics and power struggles and the mysteries which accompany that. I've never had a player actualy want that before, and as a storyteller and DM, I very much want to develop my ability to run that kind of adventure. He also likes combat and the other aspects of the game, but I believe his connection to both the game world and D&D would be enhanced with a little court intrigue.
However, I know at least two other people are in it for the hack-n'-slash. They both like roleplaying, though one is more confident in his character and speaks more than the other, but their true bliss in the game comes from kicking in the door and laying the smackdown on the monsters. They won't object to have more complex plots by any means, though I'm not sure they'll always follow them. What I'd be worried about is overdoing the roleplaying encounters to the detriment of the fighting, which would cause boredom in these two.
So, I'm looking for advice on plot structure and adventure design, pacing, recommendations of published materials to peruse (I've got every Dungeon back as far as 117, and all the APs sans Shackled City), etc. For reference, the major influences on my mindset and world design are Tolkien and George Martin's Song of Ice and Fire; for further reference, the player who wants this intrigue also loves Martin's series and is really holding that up as the standard of what interests him, I believe.
Thanks!
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The trick isn't designing the NPCs' plots; that's easy. The trick is designing encounters and scenes that can simultaneously juggle all players' needs.
How 'bout this: Design encounters with various role-playing elements as well as combat:
So, at Initiative Count 26 your trouble-shooting wizard decides which spell he can cast to slow down the approaching swarm.
At Initiative Count 23 your Hack-n-slash fighter swings at the golem.
At Initiative Count 19 your Rogue tries to disable the trap that will send the ceiling crashing down at any second. (Describe what the trap is, mechanically, so the Player has to come up with a solution, not just roll a die.)
At Initiative Count 13 your court intrigue paladin role-plays, with more difficulty each round, a conversation with Cersei Lannister trying to convince her that "nothing is going on" in the room down the hall and that his friends aren't really trying to get solid evidence that she's nailing her brother.
. . .
This can work really, really, well if you can split up the PCs a little. So long as they're not so far apart that one group of PCs & NPCs are unable to hear and respond within a round or so.
-W. E. Ray
Honestly, there are some players and playstyles that don't mix.
I'm very much a court intrigue player and DM. Goes with being a writer. Hack and slash? I like a good battle occasionally, but if a game goes by without a single combat, that can be fine too.
The type of player who only wakes up when there's a combat and always talks about their character in the third person is someone who I don't invite to game. Not because they're a bad person, but because it's a playstyle I don't enjoy running, and they wouldn't enjoy my game either, so better not to bother.
That said, you're also a group of friends and trying to make a game work isn't a bad thing either. My suggestion for the court intrigue is to put it in a tournament or dueling scenario, where people can be having court intrigues behind the scenes and in the stands, but there's still going to be jousting or dueling or gladiatorial combat or something. And if your hack-and-slasher fails at the roleplaying and offends the queen, she decides his fate will be decided as trial by combat, so he'll get to have a fight regardless and the courtiers will have a spectacle and everyone will be happy.
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It's great if all the players and DM share the same tastes in genre and tone, But sometimes a DM just has to take whatever players he can get.
The group should be tolerant of it, if it's broken into bite-size chunks, a few minutes at a time, just like any other PC having his spotlight time (scouting, trap-disabling, scrying, etc).
Make the aims of the 'role-player' relevant to the other PCs, and the goals of the main adventure. Conning their way into someone's office to steal maps of the troop movements on the border is a good result. Intimidating someone into revealing the name of a traitor, who's filling the sewers with monsters, for a coup, is a good result.
They both result in the roleplayer coming back to the group, and giving them a hook to move the adventure forward, and get the others into the next combat encounter, where, presumably, their PCs will shine.
What everyone has said thus far is great advice. I'll add this: you can use a lot of movies to help you develop plot lines and scenarios. I'm thinking of movies like Braveheart, Gladiator, James Bond, Underworld, Brotherhood of the Wolf, Mission Impossible, Excalibur, etc. These movies do a very good job in utilizing intrigue, diplomacy, intimacy, betrayal, and bloody combat!
Books to peruse (other than the masterful Song of Ice and Fire series) are Dune by Frank Herbert (and all of the sequels and prequels), Tyrants and Kings trilogy by John Marco (awesome!), The Lies of Locke Lamora by Scott Lynch, Wizard's First Rule by Terry Goodkind (and a few others in the series), Wheel of Time series by Robert Jordan, etc.
Through the years in my games, I've had all types of players and I try to juggle them all, giving them a taste of what they like. Personally, I prefer 25% intrigue and such, to 75% combat and action (which could be an chase, a sneak in and get out with the treasure/captive, rescue, or bar fight!).
Good luck!
-g-
Contributor
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What everyone has said thus far is great advice. I'll add this: you can use a lot of movies to help you develop plot lines and scenarios. I'm thinking of movies like Braveheart, Gladiator, James Bond, Underworld, Brotherhood of the Wolf, Mission Impossible, Excalibur, etc. These movies do a very good job in utilizing intrigue, diplomacy, intimacy, betrayal, and bloody combat!
Books to peruse (other than the masterful Song of Ice and Fire series) are Dune by Frank Herbert (and all of the sequels and prequels), Tyrants and Kings trilogy by John Marco (awesome!), The Lies of Locke Lamora by Scott Lynch, Wizard's First Rule by Terry Goodkind (and a few others in the series), Wheel of Time series by Robert Jordan, etc.Through the years in my games, I've had all types of players and I try to juggle them all, giving them a taste of what they like. Personally, I prefer 25% intrigue and such, to 75% combat and action (which could be an chase, a sneak in and get out with the treasure/captive, rescue, or bar fight!).
Good luck!
-g-
Love Lies of Locke Lamora! Logue and I have kicked around writing a capers-style game set in that world. Not happening for a variety of reasons that would be a thread-jack to discuss; however, for game material to peruse I (ahem) humbly suggest The Great City Campaign Setting, The Bloody Fix, and Pound of Flesh.
This is the kind of setting and the kind of adventures that really balance intrigue, mystery and combat in an urban setting beautifully. Ok, I'm biased, 'cause I'm an author on these (excepting Pound of Flesh -- that's Tim Hitchcock alone); but I honestly, honestly believe you won't be disappointed and that these materials will help you reach your stated goal. The Bloody Fix, especially is, I sincerely believe, a top-quality design example illustrating the integration of combat encounters into a mystery/urban setting. It's got smackdowns, ambushes, fight clubs and mega-battles integrated with insult contests, poetry slams, and a supernatural murder mystery. If you do check it, let me know what you think.
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I was always wondering if a bit of pbem action could handle the intriguey stuff; then when the whole crew's together (i.e. the two hack-n-slashers are there) the intriguist tells them what he found out and they go off to throttle whomever(?) Just an idear.
That way the two hackers don't sit there looking at their watches while the other guy schmoozes up the courtiers or what have you.
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I was always wondering if a bit of pbem action could handle the intriguey stuff; then when the whole crew's together (i.e. the two hack-n-slashers are there) the intriguist tells them what he found out and they go off to throttle whomever(?) Just an idear.
That way the two hackers don't sit there looking at their watches while the other guy schmoozes up the courtiers or what have you.
Thats what we do in our group.... We have a yahoo group page that helps take care of some needs on intrigue play so that people dont get bored, but we also take care of that need at the table, usually taking about 5 minutes per person. The long winded stuff is much easier on the group site or email than in person, especially if you have someone taking notes at the table and you have to kinda go slow for them. With the email-group page everyone can understand whats going on without having to take time to bore everyone. If a player wants it done in personal email then great. Takes a little time away from others, but it makes a nice roleplaying moment when a PC says "Look at all the great info I found while you guys were at the bar."
Thanks for all the responses!
Re: Molech- Your reply really hit the nail on the head. Coming up with the plot is very easy; now that the request has actually been made, I just mulled over it in my head during my snatches of free time yesterday and feel I came up with something good. I'd love to bring roleplaying and action encounters together, however. The problem I see with weaving roleplaying elements into combat is Diplomacy. I very much like having a mechanic to determine the success or failure of dialogue and interaction with NPCs of a non-murderous manner; but Diplomacy seems so bare bones. There's just one roll, that's it, success or failure, end of story. I typically insist on players describing what it is they are saying with their roll (mainly because I couldn't stand it if they didn't, but also so I can apply siuational modifiers). That doesn't really solve the problem, however. I've tried coming up with innovative ways to bend the rules and develop more robust social encounters revolving around the use of D&D 3.5's social skills, but I always run into a mental wall and then run out of time prepping the adventure.
That's really unfortunate, especially considering this party. Every character has one of the social skills. The paladin-like cleric has Diplomacy, the red-dragon blooded sorcerer has Bluff, the TWF elf fighter has Intimidate, and the stoic dwarf ranger has Sense Motive. All of them have the componenets to get in on a social encounter rather than leaving it to just one PC.
I suppose part of the problem have been the out-of-game factors of the last few months; we're all college students and this semester has been insane for everyone, starting with those Midwestern ice storms (which knocked out our power) this past winter and sent all our classes and schedules into catch-up mode. I haven't had the time to prep adventures like I desire. When I have, however, I've tried being innovative and creative with other rules, particularly chase scenes (inspired laregly by Paizo's recent innovations, such as in CotCT). Those met with great enthusiasm. The party doesn't mind my tinkering with rules when it enhances the story and the experience. I just need more practise with in the game's social arena.
Louis Agresta- Thanks for the recommendations! In addition to those, I'll go back and look over some of the RotR, CotCT, and particularly the social adventure from AoW, and scour them for ideas about synthesizing roleplaying scenes with mechanics. The hack-n-slashers like roleplaying, but one is the quiet type and the other isn't as quick on his feat when it comes to making up good dialogue. Incorporating rolls with the social skills will help them stay engaged and, I do believe, get that same sense of satisfaction that comes from roll the dice to slaughter goblins.
Heathy and DmRrostarr- That does sound like a good idea. We've all got facebook accounts, and even have a private page set up for our D&D group. The problem is, no one ever used it, so it kind of fell by the wayside. The players truly love getting together for D&D (and not just as a social venue, since we get together for other things as well and they keep pining for more D&D), but getting most of them to spend time on it away from the table can be like pulling teeth.
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Diplomacy seems so bare bones. There's just one roll, that's it, success or failure, end of story.
This is SO easy to fix.
I still recommend some roleplaying for each step of the round-by-round conversation but also at each step there can be a different roll.
-Certainly a Sense Motive when it's appropriate during the dialog.
-Then maybe a straight INT check for when the PC is trying to think of outsmarting the NPC.
-In round 3 maybe the conversation turns sour and an Intimidate is required.
-And don't forget the bare bones Diplomacy.
However, think of the different mechanics already established and then build. Create either a subset of Diplomacy skills (like Knowledge or Language): Diplomacy, Court-Speech; Diplomacy, Street-Talk; Diplomacy, Innuendo (remember 3.0?) or create a step-by-step process of when the PCs and NPCs spar.
Perchance do you remember about a year ago on another Thread I listed a PC Gadgeteer/Alchemist that I helped one of my Players create for my game? Whenever he wanted to make a Gizmo he had several steps he had to roll for, WIS check, INT check, Craft "Gizmo" check, Alchemy check & Use Magic Device check. With your Player, you can come up with a similar step-by-step mechanic. One or wo of the steps he may end up being very good at, like ole Fizbat's INT check. Another the PC my always dread rolling, like ole Fizbat's WIS check (poor little gnome).
-W. E. Ray
The problem I see with weaving roleplaying elements into combat is Diplomacy. I very much like having a mechanic to determine the success or failure of dialogue and interaction with NPCs of a non-murderous manner; but Diplomacy seems so bare bones. There's just one roll, that's it, success or failure, end of story.
Just make Diplomacy an opposed roll instead of a simple one (sort of like bargaining in real life) or make the situation more than just a single roll (requiring just a single skill); add in modifiers for player presentation (the DM-standby +2 always works for this), supporting arguments, and other actions. See "Diplomacy" in Dungeon #144 for a good example of expanding the situation to more than a single skill check.