I need help. for the life of me I can not figure out the 4e treasure allotment system. I've read and re-read the area of the books when it lists how to handled passing out loot, but it makes no sense.
How does one determine the parcels. I can't comprehend it.
I was in the processes of working on a first level dungeon (with enough encounters to get a party of five pc's from 0XP to level 2), and things broke down when I tried to figure loot. At this point, I have written that after two of the nine encounters that each PC's receive a Level 1 magic item. If that's all the loot, is it not enough, is it too much? I can't even figure out how it compares to what suggested in the rules.
Anyone able to help?
I need help. for the life of me I can not figure out the 4e treasure allotment system. I've read and re-read the area of the books when it lists how to handled passing out loot, but it makes no sense.
How does one determine the parcels. I can't comprehend it.
I was in the processes of working on a first level dungeon (with enough encounters to get a party of five pc's from 0XP to level 2), and things broke down when I tried to figure loot. At this point, I have written that after two of the nine encounters that each PC's receive a Level 1 magic item. If that's all the loot, is it not enough, is it too much? I can't even figure out how it compares to what suggested in the rules.
Anyone able to help?
Take a look at page 126 of the Dungeon Master's Guide. You'll refer to this often. Your party is made up of 1st-level characters, so you're going to use the box labeled "Party Level 1" on that page. The box contains ten treasure parcels, labeled 1 through 10. Over the course of level 1 (in other words, ideally before the party reaches level 2), they should come across all ten of those treasure parcels listed in that box. That means that the party should discover a level 2 magic item, a level 3 magic item, a level 4 magic item, a level 5 magic item and a combined amount of non-equipment valuables worth 720 gold pieces. You can space these parcels out between encounters however you wish. Some encounters may contain no parcels, some may contain one parcel and some may contain more than one parcel. Have the treasure make appearances where it makes sense to do so - if you are giving out a magic weapon, have a particularly nasty monster wield it, for example.
You should not give every player in the party a 1st-level magic item after only two encounters. It lacks variety, is not worth enough to be all of the treasure you give out, and if you give out more magic items to make up for this you'll inundate the party with magic items they won't be able to use.
Let me know if you've got any more questions.
I'm just going off of memory since my notes are at home. For the dungeon thus far, I just have the list of encounters I'd want to use, at least two of those encounters are skill challenges with no monster opponents. After two of those nine encounters (I think it's encounter #4 and encounter #8) there would be five magic items per encounter (My plan was to have the magic items found be tailored to the weapons/armor of the party) so that they would each have two magic items for the final encounter of the the dungeon (which is slated to be harder). I remember that the first encounter was 20 or so minions, skeletons I think. And the last one was a Dragon.
As a little bit more background on what I'm designing, I decided that the 4e ruleset is perfect for a SmashTV/Running Man/Xcrawl type setting (at least what I've been able to determine about Xcrawl from not having an actual Xcrawl book). The setting would be a modern day world with "dungeons" designed for contestants to participate in. The first dungeon would be the "open call" for new contestants. Those who can't get through the first series of rooms/encounters would just not be able to qualify for the more difficult [i.e. higher level] competitions. I would expect that if I find out that I'm shorting the players of loot, they will be able to get the difference of their "winnings" at the end of the competition, and have access to purchase additional equipment at that time.
As they move on to the higher levle dungeons, they will find higher level items during the competition. I was thinking having enough magic items to equate to three items per character each dungeon. One item at equal level, one at level +1, and one at level -1. For the first level dungeon, there are no zero level magic items, and therefore one two items per character. Obviously, some items will be replaced and the and sold, but since I plan on tailoring the items specific to the individual characters less "vendor trash" will show up.
Okay, So now my question is, if I've granting items of varying levels to the party, but those items are tailored to individual PC's, how do I decide which PC's items I throw in first? I mean someone in the party is going to feel shafted. PC "A" gets a level 5 weapon and all PC "B" gets is a pile of gold coins? And then how can I help make sure that the prescribed PC's gets the correct item? by the time the second level dungeon is through, there could be in theory PC "A" with a level 5 item and a level 6 item, while PC "B" gets to add to his coinstack?
Like I said, I don't understand loot distribution.
Sorry, just thought of something else, and since it's slightly tangential, I'm puttung it in a seperate post.
Would it be feasible to have a Skill Challenge where the loot received is dependant on the success or failure? Say for example if they succeed they get the level 5 item, if they fail they only get sayt he level 3 item, but the difference is still made up by the end of the level (say after the boss fight at the end.) They'd still get the same over-all treasure, but one of the benefits of succeeding in the skill challenge is being better equipped for that coming boss fight?
Feasible? Yes/No?
Sorry, just thought of something else, and since it's slightly tangential, I'm puttung it in a seperate post.
Would it be feasible to have a Skill Challenge where the loot received is dependant on the success or failure? Say for example if they succeed they get the level 5 item, if they fail they only get sayt he level 3 item, but the difference is still made up by the end of the level (say after the boss fight at the end.) They'd still get the same over-all treasure, but one of the benefits of succeeding in the skill challenge is being better equipped for that coming boss fight?
Feasible? Yes/No?
Very feasible and an good idea IMO.
As for distribution, I would say that you should set the expectations accordingly and not play favorites. The guy who gets the level 2 item this time will get the level 6 item at 2nd level, the guy who gets the level 5 item this time will get the level 3 item next time, etc. You have a lot of freedom when it comes to rewarding treasure.
Okay, So now my question is, if I've granting items of varying levels to the party, but those items are tailored to individual PC's, how do I decide which PC's items I throw in first? I mean someone in the party is going to feel shafted. PC "A" gets a level 5 weapon and all PC "B" gets is a pile of gold coins? And then how can I help make sure that the prescribed PC's gets the correct item? by the time the second level dungeon is through, there could be in theory PC "A" with a level 5 item and a level 6 item, while PC "B" gets to add to his coinstack?
The short answer is that they get shafted. As a DM you're going to need to make certain that loot distribution is roughly equitable across all levels. If one player gets the last piece of loot one level, make sure to prioritize that player a little in future levels.
Okay, So now my question is, if I've granting items of varying levels to the party, but those items are tailored to individual PC's, how do I decide which PC's items I throw in first? I mean someone in the party is going to feel shafted. PC "A" gets a level 5 weapon and all PC "B" gets is a pile of gold coins? And then how can I help make sure that the prescribed PC's gets the correct item? by the time the second level dungeon is through, there could be in theory PC "A" with a level 5 item and a level 6 item, while PC "B" gets to add to his coinstack?The short answer is that they get shafted. As a DM you're going to need to make certain that loot distribution is roughly equitable across all levels. If one player gets the last piece of loot one level, make sure to prioritize that player a little in future levels.
I'd also point out that it makes some sense to, in general, hand out items from weakest to strongest. That way the guy that gets a weak item early on will still be the star of the show of a few encounters after which, presumably, an even better item is found. Handing out the 5th level item first dampens the impact of the rest of the weaker stuff.
Now one can go against this of course but, in general, I'd avoid it unless you players have twigged to it to the point where they are meta-gaming or its seeming unrealistic.
Okay, looking over my notes, and the above posts, this is what I have so far. Any more suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
Encounter 1 - EL1 - 20 Decreipt Skeletons
Encounter 2 - EL1 - 2 Stirges, 2 Stormclaw Scorpions, 1 Spiretop Drake (Magic Item L3)
Encounter 3 - EL1 - 2 Goblin Skullcleavers, 1 Goblin Sharpshooter, 3 Goblin Cutters
Encounter 4 - EL2 - Skill Challenge, Obstacle Course Room, Complexity 4 (Magic Item L4 [or L2])
Encounter 5 - EL1 - Undecided
Encounter 6 - EL1 - 5 Halfling Stouts, 2 Halfling Theives, 1 Halfling Slinger
Encounter 7 - EL1 - Skill Challenge, "The Negoiator" example from DMG (5 Healing Potions [or Magic Item 5])
Encounter 8 - EL1 - 2 Hoard Scarabs 2 Needlefang Drake Swarms (Hoard Valued at 470gp)
Encounter 9 - EL4 - Young Black Dragon (Magic Item L2 [or L4], and Magic Item 5 [or 5 Healing Potions])
The listings of treasure where there is listing of two . . . the success of the skill challenge would determine which treasure they get when.
Okay, looking over my notes, and the above posts, this is what I have so far. Any more suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
Encounter 1 - EL1 - 20 Decreipt Skeletons
Encounter 2 - EL1 - 2 Stirges, 2 Stormclaw Scorpions, 1 Spiretop Drake (Magic Item L3)
Encounter 3 - EL1 - 2 Goblin Skullcleavers, 1 Goblin Sharpshooter, 3 Goblin Cutters
Encounter 4 - EL2 - Skill Challenge, Obstacle Course Room, Complexity 4 (Magic Item L4 [or L2])
Encounter 5 - EL1 - Undecided
Encounter 6 - EL1 - 5 Halfling Stouts, 2 Halfling Theives, 1 Halfling Slinger
Encounter 7 - EL1 - Skill Challenge, "The Negoiator" example from DMG (5 Healing Potions [or Magic Item 5])
Encounter 8 - EL1 - 2 Hoard Scarabs 2 Needlefang Drake Swarms (Hoard Valued at 470gp)
Encounter 9 - EL4 - Young Black Dragon (Magic Item L2 [or L4], and Magic Item 5 [or 5 Healing Potions])The listings of treasure where there is listing of two . . . the success of the skill challenge would determine which treasure they get when.
Looks pretty good, but I'll say a few words of warning, if your players have no controller #1 is going to be tougher than it should unless they're really lucky. The treasure distribution is good, and if you basically reward whoever got the shaft this "game" the next one and just trade off, as has been mentioned, I think your players will pick up on the fact that you'll get to them. Also I would recommend the level 3 White dragon if the players are level 1... because solos are rough and I think that black could easily end up TPK. Just my opinion.
Well, I think the White Dragon was an EL3, instead of an EL4, and would there fore be just short of leveling.
Might transposed Encounters 8 and 9, let them talk their way into to the dragon's den after grabbing his hoard.
Having DMed a few homebrew games of 4e (both designed to take a characters from lvl 1-2, I found that have the APL+3 encounter as a solo encounter is a sure way of killing at least half the party. Id recommend that you swap out one of the lower lever encounters for the Solo encounter and mke the hardest encounter vs a group.
Having DMed a few homebrew games of 4e (both designed to take a characters from lvl 1-2, I found that have the APL+3 encounter as a solo encounter is a sure way of killing at least half the party. Id recommend that you swap out one of the lower lever encounters for the Solo encounter and mke the hardest encounter vs a group.
I've done the White Dragon vs. a 1st level party - its a really tough encounter but its not impossible. In our case we had held back all our dailies for the the encounter so we went completely nova on it and we won with no losses but just barely and several players were down when the Dragon Died so if we had been forced to run for it a number of players would have died.
Now we did not have any magic or healing potions. Its possible that a party with some magic items and a bunch of healing potions could take on the Black Dragon if they also had their daily's. If not I think its likely the Black Dragon wins unless there are at least 7 of them - and even then its a bit iffy. The Dragons defences will be so high that a 1st level party will have a very hard time hitting.
Our 1st level group of 4 plowed through the white dragon with nobody down, mostly thanks to good die rolls and all of us having our dailies.
At 2nd level though, the black dragon killed my paladin and the cleric during a retreating fight. The ranger and wizard finally brought it down, but way to late and too far away to save us. The darkness was our biggest problem, it made the dragon way too hard to hit. And once we decided to get out of there, my AC wasn't enough to give the others (especially the dwarf) a good enough lead away to blast it from afar.
So, I'd say the party level +3 is possible, but the players need to be smart and lucky. And as I suggested to my DM, if the PC's are having a hard time of it, have the creature retreat once bloodied. Then if they follow it, it's their own fault they died.
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Sorry, just thought of something else, and since it's slightly tangential, I'm puttung it in a seperate post.
Would it be feasible to have a Skill Challenge where the loot received is dependant on the success or failure? Say for example if they succeed they get the level 5 item, if they fail they only get sayt he level 3 item, but the difference is still made up by the end of the level (say after the boss fight at the end.) They'd still get the same over-all treasure, but one of the benefits of succeeding in the skill challenge is being better equipped for that coming boss fight?
Feasible? Yes/No?
You betcha! As a matter of fact, this is a great way to break up your encounter design and keep your characters focused on the supporting story and narrative.
Convincing the High Priest of Torag that a +2 suit of dwarven Plate is central to your ability to thwart the advances of an orc horde would make for interesting roleplay.
