Wells of Darkness... so many problems

[primemover003]

Now I see why so many people said WoD is a weak spot in the STAP.

The Well of Ahazu encounters are just completely busted. The keepers have both teleport and dimension door memorized in an area of Forbiddance. The Tactics of said encounter also instruct to throw up Walls of Force in the Well... which is pretty dumb because they can only be verticle, not horizontal as the writer intended. The Custodians are missing their damage, the Warden of the Well is missing it's save DC's and is just asking to be disintegrated (the fate of every other retriever in my STAP so far). Is it awakened I wonder???

Now most of the statblocks I can fix, but tactics I have to completely re-do. That means changing out the Keepers spell selections.... sigh. Of course I probably need to do that anyway.

Anybody else running this catch more problems?

[Laurellien]

primemover003 wrote:

Now I see why so many people said WoD is a weak spot in the STAP.

The Well of Ahazu encounters are just completely busted. The keepers have both teleport and dimension door memorized in an area of Forbiddance. The Tactics of said encounter also instruct to throw up Walls of Force in the Well... which is pretty dumb because they can only be verticle, not horizontal as the writer intended. The Custodians are missing their damage, the Warden of the Well is missing it's save DC's and is just asking to be disintegrated (the fate of every other retriever in my STAP so far). Is it awakened I wonder???

Now most of the statblocks I can fix, but tactics I have to completely re-do. That means changing out the Keepers spell selections.... sigh. Of course I probably need to do that anyway.

Anybody else running this catch more problems?

I'm thinking of putting WoD in EomE and changing a lot. Possibly by having more of the adventure placed on the Isle of Dread.

[Matthew Vincent]

primemover003 wrote:

The keepers have both teleport and dimension door memorized in an area of Forbiddance.

Not optimal for the encounter, but still useful for when they are not in their well (i.e. traveling around the dangerous plane or escaping PC's). In my campaign, the keepers are still alive precisely because of these spells, and they continued to use these spells to harass the PC's.

primemover003 wrote:

they can only be verticle, not horizontal as the writer intended.

Yes, it appears to be a mistake, but that doesn't mean horizontal walls of force cannot exist... indeed many have existed before. Also, vertical is a subjective term anyway (especially say, in the Astral plane). Just assume that the keepers have researched a variant form.

primemover003 wrote:

is just asking to be disintegrated (the fate of every other retriever in my STAP so far)

The warden is destined to be an easy kill anyway... no harm in your players speeding things up with good tactics.

primemover003 wrote:

Anybody else running this catch more problems?

The river styx is an excellent trap if the PC's are in the well (which they almost certainly would be), but this eventuality doesn't seem to be covered very well... I had to make my own rules for players fighting in a rapidly filling well, unable to teleport out (or even fly out really, as the waterwall is unavoidable).

Also, howdah roofs aren't really going to protect the bar-lgura in such an environment... I assumed they already planned to lose 8 hours of memory.

[primemover003]

Well the Retrievers and Bar-lgura are feather falling down AFTER the cascade's initial deluge so aren't really caught in it's full fury. That encounter's really not that bad... just the Keepers and the Warden.

I did just kill the groups Paladin last session... though he was revivified. I guess the encounters in EoME are hard enough, especially considering my groups tendancies to attack first and ask questions with the cleric.

[Matthew Vincent]

primemover003 wrote:

Well the Retrievers and Bar-lgura are feather falling down AFTER the cascade's initial deluge so aren't really caught in it's full fury.

In the situation I described (i.e. PC's at the bottom of the well) the bar-lgura might have to wait awhile for the PC's to emerge (as flying 100' up *through* the deluge might not be feasible)... which seems like a waste of a tense scene.

Having the Bar-lgura attack *while* the well was filling up seemed like more fun.

[psionichamster]

In my game, the well with Shami went as follows:

Figure out the way to get her out, say hello to retriever.

Set up an energy transformation field, set to shoot "Ray of Deanimation" (CL 15? or so at the time from the cohort wizard) covering the bottom 40' of the well

Set up a forbiddance field above that (or dimension lock...forget which one..the 20' burst of no teleport).

Wall of iron to seal in the Cleric, Warblade, Wizard, Pyrokineticist, and Drunken Master.

Release Shami, talk to her, grapple her, all her abilities are completely nullified (energy drain 1st turn or charm 1st turn, either way like 5 rays of deanimation go off, negating her spell like abilities.) the drunken master has his way with ANOTHER succubus, until the river comes in.

above, the psion and ardent get bored so they cut a hole in the wall of iron, to allow them to see in (and let the party out eventually). trap triggers, cascading the riverwater into the well until the cleric puts up another gate under the 1st one. bar-lguras and retrievers go whoosh through one gate into another, out of the fight, shami gets head-dunked 3 or 4 times in her fight against the drunken master, keeps coming to, using a spell like, and gets grappled some more.

all in all, they used up a bunch of resources, but the only real threat in the whole well was the river water possibly taking someone's memories.

interesting, yes.
well-designed-combat-encounter, not so much.

but then my players are a little weird anyways.

-t

[primemover003]

Ray of deanimation only works on constructs... so how did it nullify her SLA's? I can see the ETF sucking up her spells, bu the other one wouldn't do anything.

And yes your Players are weird... I would've ruled the rift open inside the wall of iron.

[psionichamster]

primemover003 wrote:

Ray of deanimation only works on constructs... so how did it nullify her SLA's? I can see the ETF sucking up her spells, bu the other one wouldn't do anything.

And yes your Players are weird... I would've ruled the rift open inside the wall of iron.

the ray was for the retriever (which i think was killed without it getting zapped) and to put a "trigger spell" that would not kill the party/help shami out.

the ETF sucked up her SLA's and stuff, triggered the Ray, and people got zapped for nothing (since the ray only works on constructs). Kinda like Shatner yelling "Set Phasers to Stun" and then going buck wild and shooting everyone.

for more weirdness, check out some of the other ST threads (including the Obits)...there were some interesting "tactical" choices made, especially at The Wreck, in Wells of Darkness, and during the downtime after Tides of Dread/Lightless Depths.

-t

[primemover003]

Well my players finished up last night with Charon appearing! All in all it didn't turn out as bad as I thought. The Keepers actually gave them a good run for their money with two escaping after the Paladin dispelled the Forbiddance with his Holy Avenger.

They were all both disgusted and laughing hysterically at the Gorallon's requests and then were scrambling when the big apes dropped huge damage on them for not indulgin them. The Warden actually lasted 3 rounds against the Sorceress's Sphere of Ultimate Destruction.

Molypente was a chump. The chokesnake went down in the first round. The Stygian Deluge was quickly dealt with as well when the Demonwrecker Cleric updrafted out of the Well and used a Miracle to place a wall of force in the rift.

I do however get ot add another entry in to the Obits though!