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I've nearly finished preparing to run a slightly extended version of "And Madness Followed" from Dungeon 134. I've added in encounters with the denizen of Leng, hound of Tindalos, and faceless stalkers from Pathfinder. Now, I've rustled up some Knowledge tables for these critters, but yesterday it struck me that a player is bound to ask "What's Leng?"...And I'm stumped!
Could anybody help me knock together some Knowledge (the planes) tables to describe this locations? At the moment I've basically got what Pathfinder 6 tells me about Leng, which I think will probably be enough. Unfortunately, I'm drawing a complete and utter blank on what I could say about the Far Realms and/or Carcosa/Hastur! Please help!
Ukos
Well, how do you want to handle it? Lovecraft himself did it very differently in different stories; Leng was once equivalent to Tibet, once it was a plateau in Antarctica, and once it was a plateau in the Dreamlands. Carcosa has a similar vagueness to it.
If it were me, I'd make Leng an actual location somewhere in the campaign setting. I'd probably make Carcosa be a city on the plateau of Leng.
Creative Director
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I've nearly finished preparing to run a slightly extended version of "And Madness Followed" from Dungeon 134. I've added in encounters with the denizen of Leng, hound of Tindalos, and faceless stalkers from Pathfinder. Now, I've rustled up some Knowledge tables for these critters, but yesterday it struck me that a player is bound to ask "What's Leng?"...And I'm stumped!
Could anybody help me knock together some Knowledge (the planes) tables to describe this locations? At the moment I've basically got what Pathfinder 6 tells me about Leng, which I think will probably be enough. Unfortunately, I'm drawing a complete and utter blank on what I could say about the Far Realms and/or Carcosa/Hastur! Please help!
Ukos
The best place to go for more info here is the source stories. But they number in the HUNDREDS. But looking just at Lovecraft, the stories that have the most about Leng are probably "Dream Quest of Unknown Kadath" and "At the Mountains of Madness."
A close second is the Call of Cthulhu roleplaying game put out by Chaosium. They've been doing stuff for this game for close to 30 years, and there's a LOT of info out there. The two best places to go to there are:
1: The Call of Cthulhu RPG book. The newest edition has a LOT of stuff about all things Lovecraftian.
2: Encyclopedia Cthulhiana: This is a trade paperback put out by Chaosium that functions as a really handy encyclopedia for all of this stuff. VERY recommended to anyone who wants to inject Lovecraftian stuff into your game, since this book not only gives encyclopedia entries for all the elements in the mythos, but also lists the stories where that information came from in the first place. Try to get the Expanded and Revised Second Edition if you're thinking of picking this up. Leng, for example, has about a page-long entry.
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1: The Call of Cthulhu RPG book. The newest edition has a LOT of stuff about all things Lovecraftian.
Just a slight threadjack, I own the hardcover 5.6 edition of the CoC main rules and was wondering if it was really worth shelling out for the latest version. Any thoughts?
Back to the topic of Leng heres some ideas:
If they actually end up exploring Leng you can add an encounter with Leng Spiders.As quoted from the main CoC rules, these spiders are intelligent,dangerous, and gigantic. Some valleys in the Plateau of Leng are almost completly webbed over. You could use advanced Dream Spiders from PF#7 page 82 as a base to stat them up.
Also in the Tcho-tcho entry of the same book it mentions that the blasted Plateau of Tsang in Tibet is one of the incursions of dread Leng into our space time. On it and in other far-removed regions dwell the tribes of the Tcho-tchos.So this also provides you with an addtional encounters full of evil alien worshiping savages but also sugests that Leng is some kind of roving plane that somtimes comes into contact with the material and other planes. When this planner junction occurs passage between the two planes becomes possible. This might affect magic in the location in strange ways.
Like I said before these are just some ideas, the Cthulhu Mythos is a shared world playground for the imagination so things really only need to make sense for your purposes, much like the authors of the Lovecraft circle.
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Creative Director
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1: The Call of Cthulhu RPG book. The newest edition has a LOT of stuff about all things Lovecraftian.Just a slight threadjack, I own the hardcover 5.6 edition of the CoC main rules and was wondering if it was really worth shelling out for the latest version. Any thoughts?
Only if you're obsessive and a completist, like me. :-)
There IS some neat new stuff in 6th edition though (I bought the fancy expensive leather edition, of course...), but the gameplay itself is more or less the same.
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Back to the topic of Leng heres some ideas:
If they actually end up exploring Leng you can add an encounter with Leng Spiders.As quoted from the main CoC rules, these spiders are intelligent,dangerous, and gigantic. Some valleys in the Plateau of Leng are almost completly webbed over. You could use advanced Dream Spiders from PF#7 page 82 as a base to stat them up.
Also in the Tcho-tcho entry of the same book it mentions that the blasted Plateau of Tsang in Tibet is one of the incursions of dread Leng into our space time. On it and in other far-removed regions dwell the tribes of the Tcho-tchos.So this also provides you with an addtional encounters full of evil alien worshiping savages but also sugests that Leng is some kind of roving plane that somtimes comes into contact with the material and other planes. When this planner junction occurs passage between the two planes becomes possible. This might affect magic in the location in strange ways.
Like I said before these are just some ideas, the Cthulhu Mythos is a shared world playground for the imagination so things really only need to make sense for your purposes, much like the authors of the Lovecraft circle.
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Back to the topic of Leng heres some ideas:
If they actually end up exploring Leng you can add an encounter with Leng Spiders.As quoted from the main CoC rules, these spiders are intelligent,dangerous, and gigantic. Some valleys in the Plateau of Leng are almost completly webbed over. You could use advanced Dream Spiders from PF#7 page 82 as a base to stat them up.
Also in the Tcho-tcho entry of the same book it mentions that the blasted Plateau of Tsang in Tibet is one of the incursions of dread Leng into our space time. On it and in other far-removed regions dwell the tribes of the Tcho-tchos.So this also provides you with an addtional encounters full of evil alien worshiping savages but also sugests that Leng is some kind of roving plane that somtimes comes into contact with the material and other planes. When this planner junction occurs passage between the two planes becomes possible. This might affect magic in the location in strange ways.
Like I said before these are just some ideas, the Cthulhu Mythos is a shared world playground for the imagination so things really only need to make sense for your purposes, much like the authors of the Lovecraft circle.
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I wish I'd thought to ask about this two months ago when I first started preparing...Unfortunately we start running the adventure next tuesday and I've just about run out of time to look up the references James suggested. I'll keep an eye out thought, the Far Realms fascinate me and all this mythos stuff seems so Far Realms-y (or should that be the other way around?). I really need to make time to dig out those stories,.
I have got one thing in my favour; the players that are most into the mythos won't be playing. Its a shame, one of the reasons I decided to run And Madness Followed was because I thought the two of them would get a big kick out of it! So at least I stand a chance of not being bowled over by the players knowing too much more than me.
I have managed to have some semi-coherent thought after reading what you guys had to say and ceasing panicking. I've decided to go with the Plateau of Leng as being part of the Material Plane crossed with the Far Realms, except with ambiguity stirred in as to whether its the Far Realms touching the Material Plane or vice versa (ambiguity seems like a big part of the cthulu mythos?). In my world I'd already decided to use the Far Realms more as an alternative universe which ties the space-time continuum of the Material Plane together in some undefined/misunderstood way. So I've decided that Carcosa becomes a pocket dimension of the Far Realms formed by the will of Hastur. The absorption of Material Plane cities then fuels the expansion of his (its?) power and thus expands Carcosa. I love the idea of a parasitic semi-sentient city, so I'm hoping that my players will be interested in the adventure enough that they'll want to come back to it at some point.
Thanks for your help, I forget how friendly the Paizo boards are, even though I read them everyday!
U
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Wow man somthin wicked screwy happend with my post! Sorry about that! Anyway if you ever get the chance you should try to check out Delta Green:Countdown it has some really cool stuff about Carcosa and the Hastur mythos (the King in Yellow). Good luck with your game, And madness followed is a pretty cool adventure.
Anyway if you ever get the chance you should try to check out Delta Green:Countdown it has some really cool stuff about Carcosa and the Hastur mythos (the King in Yellow).
[shameless self promotion]
Or you could go check out this story: Divide By Zero: A Tale of the Cthulhu Mythos by Joshua Goudreau. Hastur, The King In Yellow is featured prominently and there are several mentions of Carcosa. Whoever this author guy is he totally rocks. :P[/shameless self promotion]
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[shameless self promotion]
Or you could go check out this story: Divide By Zero: A Tale of the Cthulhu Mythos by Joshua Goudreau. Hastur, The King In Yellow is featured prominently and there are several mentions of Carcosa. Whoever this author guy is he totally rocks. :P
[/shameless self promotion]
Hey, you're right. I wonder who this guy is... :)
First real session tonight, opening in medias res amongst the slaughter at Hallowfield. Turns out that the two players I thought would be missing can make it. I'm quite pleased. Leveling up the King's Players so they'll be a threat to 6 level 9 PCs is a bit more work when I thought I'd finished, but I'm using it as an excuse to trawl through the Spell Compendium for a few little tricks (who needs good hope when a level 9 bard with Song of the Heart and inspirational boost can give everybody a +4 bonus to hit/damage!). Mostly, I think those two players will get a real kick out of hearing the entire final audience chanting "Hastur, Hastur..." in a whisper!
U
Mostly, I think those two players will get a real kick out of hearing the entire final audience chanting "Hastur, Hastur..." in a whisper!
U
I'm curious to know how the whole thing turns out for you. Sounds creepy and exciting.
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I'm curious to know how the whole thing turns out for you. Sounds creepy and exciting.Mostly, I think those two players will get a real kick out of hearing the entire final audience chanting "Hastur, Hastur..." in a whisper!
U
The first session went pretty well. Its been a while since I was on the DM's side of the screen, so it was nice to know that the skill hasn't atrophied away to nothing :) As I've seen elsewhere on the boards, the pseudo-natural villagers completely fooled everybody into thinking they were a lot more dangerous than they really are. Their ability to uneeringly hit in the first round is pretty scary, even though they aren't doing much damage. This was also the first time that most of us have played at 9th level, and I think that every player got to have a "my character's awesome!" moment. I'm having a lot of fun watching someone else play a soulknife, something I've longed to do myself for the last couple of years. I don't think the rogue player has quite got the hang of sneak attack yet, but that was the first time that she's ever played one and she's already sneak attacked more than our previous (long-term) rogue player ever did, i.e. once!
Unfortunately, I misread the two players who know about the mythos. They're both experienced roleplayers, so even though I knew they'd recognise the Yellow Sign in Hallowfield, I thought they'd keep their mouths shut...What was that? Is it a bird? Is it a plane? No, its a pig flying past!
As soon as I showed them the picture of the Sign on my laptop: "Oh, its the King in Yellow", "Who's that?" someone asks, "Part of the Cthulu mythos, just not written by the main guy..." They decided to be quiet when I glared at them and voiced that stopping meta-gaming (their word, I'd have called it "spoiling the big reveal for everybody else at the table") was a good idea.
Ho hum, no DM's plan survives contact with the PCs. Hopefully by the time we play again, the other players will have forgotten this mention of the King in Yellow and I'll still be able to freak them out with the critters I've got lined up. At least I know never to rely upon those two to hold their own water ever again! The hound of Tindalos should be suitable revenge, once I add a couple of hit die...
U
Back to the topic of Leng heres some ideas:
If they actually end up exploring Leng you can add an encounter with Leng Spiders.As quoted from the main CoC rules, these spiders are intelligent,dangerous, and gigantic. Some valleys in the Plateau of Leng are almost completly webbed over. You could use advanced Dream Spiders from PF#7 page 82 as a base to stat them up.
Actually, it occurs to me that you could use Advanced Phase Spiders for that too. They're big, intelligent, and dangerous, and they have weird space-time powers that might fit well alongside the weird otherworldliness of the Denizens of Leng from Pathfinder. Maybe toss a template on them if you think your players are jaded enough to go 'Meh, phase spiders.'
Me, I think Phase Spiders are made of awesome and cool and could stand a bit more shine-time.
I've nearly finished preparing to run a slightly extended version of "And Madness Followed" from Dungeon 134. I've added in encounters with the denizen of Leng, hound of Tindalos, and faceless stalkers from Pathfinder. Now, I've rustled up some Knowledge tables for these critters, but yesterday it struck me that a player is bound to ask "What's Leng?"...And I'm stumped!
Could anybody help me knock together some Knowledge (the planes) tables to describe this locations? At the moment I've basically got what Pathfinder 6 tells me about Leng, which I think will probably be enough. Unfortunately, I'm drawing a complete and utter blank on what I could say about the Far Realms and/or Carcosa/Hastur! Please help!
Ukos
The best place to go for more info here is the source stories. But they number in the HUNDREDS. But looking just at Lovecraft, the stories that have the most about Leng are probably "Dream Quest of Unknown Kadath" and "At the Mountains of Madness."
A close second is the Call of Cthulhu roleplaying game put out by Chaosium. They've been doing stuff for this game for close to 30 years, and there's a LOT of info out there. The two best places to go to there are:
1: The Call of Cthulhu RPG book. The newest edition has a LOT of stuff about all things Lovecraftian.
2: Encyclopedia Cthulhiana: This is a trade paperback put out by Chaosium that functions as a really handy encyclopedia for all of this stuff. VERY recommended to anyone who wants to inject Lovecraftian stuff into your game, since this book not only gives encyclopedia entries for all the elements in the mythos, but also lists the stories where that information came from in the first place. Try to get the Expanded and Revised Second Edition if you're thinking of picking this up. Leng, for example, has about a page-long entry.
There current, in-print edition of the second book here is the Cthulhu Mythos Encyclopedia. I have it and the two earlier Chaosium editions. Note, however, that the 3rd edition excises some gaming related info and the timeline, though it is far more comprehensive in the way of literary entries.
Tatters of the King is a great resource for mixing Hastur and Leng.
Carcosa is usually located in the Hyades or orbiting Aldebaran, but it physically merges with locations where the King in Yellow play is staged.
I'm been working - coincidentally - a section in my A Thousand Gods PF supplement for mythic India on Pulp aspects to the setting, including the Plateau of Leng/Tsang (Tsang is the name for Tibet west of Lhasa), the Tcho-tchos, etc.
Leng appears to be a Dreamlands location that overlaps into our world in multiple places - Antarctica, Tibet, etc. It's a development of the mysterious nature of Tibet - which was only explored by Europeans in the 20th century - and beliefs like Shambhalla, Roerich's vision of Central Asia, the cannibalism reported for the region in Mandeville and Polo, Mount Meru, etc.
I would link it physically in Golarion to - well - Xin-Shalast, the mountains of Tian Xia, and to Vudra - and possibly to the Crown of the World.
Carcosa, however, is closely related to the decadent and surrealist period (late 19th c. and early 20th) in Paris, and the name appears to be borrowed from Carcassone. It seems like it fits in a predominantly urban area like Absalom, Isarn in Galt, or somesuch. But the link to Hastur in both places might lead to an interesting overlap - imagine a renaissance/crenelated city stuck in the Himalayas or Antarctica where the people are blissfully unaware of their isolation and the improbability of the setting. But there needs to be a mist-covered, unfrozen lake as well...