Does Anybody have or know where I can find stats for a BALROG?
Yup . . . in fact way back when D&D supplements were first published, it was even called a balrog (back when halflings were hobbits). That having been said, I believe if you read some of the more exhaustive Tolkien references, balrogs actually can't fly, although that's not apparent from the Fellowship of the Ring.
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Yup . . . in fact way back when D&D supplements were first published, it was even called a balrog (back when halflings were hobbits). That having been said, I believe if you read some of the more exhaustive Tolkien references, balrogs actually can't fly, although that's not apparent from the Fellowship of the Ring.
The whole "balrogs: wings or no wings?" argument has been ongoing among Tolkien fans for decades. Literally. There's no clear-cut answer to this issue. Some will interpret the shape of wings drawn by the darkness surrounding the Balrog of the Moria as artistic licence on the author's part, other will interpret it as meaning Balrogs have wings. It's highly probable Tolkien would have confirmed the former, but he never did, IIRC.
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The controversy was sowed by Tolkien himself. He describes the Balrogs flying over the mountains to come to Melkor's aid after his alliance with Ungoliant turns sour, yet he has a couple of them fall to their death as well. My personal interpretation is that they take many forms. They're Maiar after all, just like Sauron, Gandalf, etc. Who ever said they all had to look alike?
I always assumed the Balor was the D&D attempt at Balrog stats. I'm sure I have Rolemaster/MERP stats for the Balrog in one of my supplements at home. If you're interested in that version, I can look through them and see what I can find. Might not help much though.
The controversy was sowed by Tolkien himself. He describes the Balrogs flying over the mountains to come to Melkor's aid after his alliance with Ungoliant turns sour, yet he has a couple of them fall to their death as well. My personal interpretation is that they take many forms. They're Maiar after all, just like Sauron, Gandalf, etc. Who ever said they all had to look alike?
I always assumed the Balor was the D&D attempt at Balrog stats. I'm sure I have Rolemaster/MERP stats for the Balrog in one of my supplements at home. If you're interested in that version, I can look through them and see what I can find. Might not help much though.
Well, just because they fell to their deaths doesn't really mean that they couldn't fly. I've always supported the 'winged' camp, but with with such a huge, heavy creature, if you were to disrupt that flying pattern (or confine them to, say, falling down a dark chasm without room to fly, as in the movie) then they wouldn't have the room to take off or regain control of their flight. I think the movie got it more right than wrong, personally...
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Well, just because they fell to their deaths doesn't really mean that they couldn't fly. I've always supported the 'winged' camp, but with with such a huge, heavy creature, if you were to disrupt that flying pattern (or confine them to, say, falling down a dark chasm without room to fly, as in the movie) then they wouldn't have the room to take off or regain control of their flight. I think the movie got it more right than wrong, personally...
I completely agree - I was just trying to give some voice to the other side of the argument. The movie Balrog was the coolest thing since sliced bread. It was completely true to the little balrog image I had in my head. When it first appears, you really can't tell if it has wings, or if it's just shadow and smoke. I know Jackson was up on his Tolkien lore, and I saw that depiction as him making reference to the argument. He really did an amazing job!
EDIT: That said, I still think they could be unique creatures - no more alike than Saruman is to Melian (sp?).
Does Anybody have or know where I can find stats for a BALROG?
Agreed - Balors have most of the common features associated with Balrogs. If that's not strong enough add any of the following:
+1 CR: Elite array stats (15, 14, 13,12, 10, 8)+? CR: Additional Hit-Dice (+1 CR per 2 HD). 12 HD increase would also increase to Huge size - total CR increase +7. Could probably be adjusted to qualify for Devastating Critical (Longsword) (epic feat).
+2? CR: A nice artifact level "flame sword", like Sword of Kas equivalent - blows up when the Balrog dies of course.
+15 CR: Paragon template (Epic Level Handbook) - careful with this one, it's cruel.
Be sure to adjust the Balrog's SR up with the CR increases.
Wings are not the only controversy, the creature's size is too.
Pulled from Wikipedia.
The size of Balrogs is also a matter of dispute. For example, in his notes, Tolkien states:
"[the Balrog] strode to the fissure, no more than man-high yet terror seemed to go before it."'
The History of Middle-earth Volume VII (The Treason of Isengard), X The Mines of Moria II: The Bridge
Yeesh. I wish Tolkien would make up his mind...
Wings are not the only controversy, the creature's size is too.
Pulled from Wikipedia.
The size of Balrogs is also a matter of dispute. For example, in his notes, Tolkien states:
"[the Balrog] strode to the fissure, no more than man-high yet terror seemed to go before it."'
The History of Middle-earth Volume VII (The Treason of Isengard), X The Mines of Moria II: The Bridge
Yes, but wouldn't this also apply if the balrog simply bowed down to pass through these halls?
Anyway, the whole description of a balrog perfectly matches that of the balors of D&D, at least in the current edition.
Wings are not the only controversy, the creature's size is too.
Pulled from Wikipedia.
The size of Balrogs is also a matter of dispute. For example, in his notes, Tolkien states:
"[the Balrog] strode to the fissure, no more than man-high yet terror seemed to go before it."'
The History of Middle-earth Volume VII (The Treason of Isengard), X The Mines of Moria II: The Bridge
It's been a while since I read Tolkien's notes, but in the end, do you go with the notes for the balrog's size or with the actual written material? You get the idea in the Silmarillion they were pretty big, but I don't remember any specific quotes from there to justify that.
I found this mentalness at the homebrew creature catalouge index.
The Balrog
Fiery shadow doom of epic fierceness. (Paragon Balor Shadow Elemental 39HD)
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Huge Outsider (Chaotic Evil Shadow)
Hit Dice: 39d8+468 plus 468 (1,248 hp)
Initiative: +13 (+9 Dex, +4 improved initiative)
Speed: 120 ft., Fly 180 ft. (good)
AC: 61 (-2 size, +9 dex, +20 natural, +12 insight, +12 luck)
Base Attack/Grapple: +59/+84
Attack: +4 vorpal, fiery blast huge greatsword +83 (2d8+41+3d6 fire damage) or +4 fiery blast whip +73 (1d4+32+3d6 fire)
Full Attack: +4 vorpal, fiery blast huge greatsword +83/+78/+73/+68 and +4 fiery blast whip +73/+68/+63/+58
Space/Reach: 10 ft./15 ft. reach (20 ft. with whip)
Special Attacks: Spell-like abilities, fear, entangle, body flames, summon tanar’ri
Special Qualities: DR -/epic, SR 45, tanar’ri qualities, death throes, shadow wreathe
Saves: Fort:+46 Will:+40 Ref:+46
Abilities: Str:45 Dex:29 Con:34 Int:35 Wis:35 Chr:31
Skills: Bluff+40, Concentration +45, Diplomacy +39, Hide +34, Knowledge (any one) +39, Listen +44, Move Silently +34, Scry +37, Search +41, Sense Motive +39, Spellcraft +42, Spot +55
Feats: Ambidexterity, Cleave, Combat Reflexes, Expertise, Great Cleave, Greater Two-Weapon Fighting, Improved Disarm, Improved Initiative, Improved Trip, Improved Two-Weapon Fighting, Iron Will, Power Attack, Quicken Spell-like Ability, Improved Sunder, Two-Weapon Fighting, Weapon Focus (huge greatsword) Epic: Devastating Critical (huge greatsword), Perfect Two-Weapon Fighting
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Environment: Any land or underground
Orgranisation: Solitary (Unique)
CR: 43
Treasure: Standard coins; double goods; standard items; plus +4 vorpal, fiery blast huge greatsword and +4 fie
Alignment: Always Chaotic Evil
Advancement: By character class
Level Adjustment: +50ish
Balors, being among the most feared and terrible of demons, one could only imagine the magnificence and ferocity of this paragon being, who is constantly wreathed in shadow and flame.
The dwarf lords delved to greedily and unearthed this ancient terror, who comes from the transverse plane of the Shadow. It is a 30 foot tall humanoid creature with ebony skin that glows red hot in its cracks. The entire body is wrapped in lurid flames and thick, smoldering shadow.
Combat
The Balrog is fleet of foot and loves to join battle with sword and whip unsheathed. Due to its rediculous cunningness and god-like power, it has never had to flee from a battle.
Spell-Like Abilities: At will - blasphemy, deeper darkness, desecrate, detect good, detect law, fear, greater dispelling, pyrotechnics, read magic, suggestion, symbol (any), telekinesis, teleport without error (self plus 500 pounds of objects only), tongues (self only), unhallow, unholy aura, unholy blight, and wall of fire; 1/day - fire storm and implosion. These abilities are as the spells cast by a 35th-level sorcerer (save DC 33+ spell level).
Fear (Su): A creature hit by the Balrog’s slam attack must succeed at a Will save (DC 37) or flee in terror for 1d6 rounds.
Entangle (Ex): The Balrog’s whip entangles foes much like an attack with a net. The whip has a maximum range of 60 feet and has a range increment of 20 feet. If it hits, the target and the Balrog must immediatly make opposed strength checks; if the Balrog wins, it drags the target against its flaming body until it escapes the whip.
Body Flames (Su): The Balrog can wreathe its body in roaring flame and shadow cinders as a free action. The Balrog suffers no harm, but anyone grappling with it takes 10d6 fire and 10d6 unholy damage with each successful whip attack.
Vorpal Sword (Su): The Balrog carries a +4 vorpal, fiery blast huge greatsword that appears to be constructed of a vermillion crackle of flame. The sword also has the ability to detect good as cast by a 38th level sorcerer.
Flame Whip (Su): It also carries a +4 fiery blast whip that is designed for its huge size.
Detect Magic (Su): The Balrog continuously detects magic as a 45th level sorcerer.
See Invisibility (Su): It also continuously sees invisible as a 45th level sorcerer.
Summon Tanar’ri (Sp): Once per day, the Balrog can automatically summon 4d10 nalfeshnee, 3d6 glabrezu, 2d4 marilith, and 2d4 balor.
Death Throes (Ex): When killed, the Balrog explodes in a blinding flash of lava and flame that deals 50 points of damage to everything within 100 feet (Reflex half DC 41).
Shadow Wreath (Su): Shadows constantly surround the Balrogs body granting him 20% concealment, which cannot be seen through with anything short of a wish.
Skills: The Balrog receives a +18 racial bonus to Listen and Spot checks.
Special Weakness (Ex): Gandalf can kill him like so easily.
TANAR’RI QUALITIES
Immunities (Ex): Tanar’ri are immune to poison and electricity.
Resistances (Ex): Tanar’ri have cold, fire, and acid resistance 20.
Telepathy (Su): Tanar’ri can communicate telepathically with any creature within 100 feet that has a language.
