Well in the previous game we left off with Vanthus making his apppearance. So this game we started with initiative. Vanthus won and started off with a Mass Suggestion to help out the burning church in town send the Cleric/Stormlord away from the fight. So far so good, until the Shadowcaster hit him with a Hold Monster. She just gets past his SR and with his pitiful Will save he couldn't beat her DC:20. That allowed the Minotaur/Barbarian with the large evil outsider bane flail, Friendkiller, to coup de grace him dealing 29 points of damage which meant Vanthus had to make a DC:39 Fort save or die. No such luck. The players were really happy so it's no big deal for me but man what a short fight.
interesting - same thing in our campaign - Vanthus showed up, made a cute remeark or two, teh warmage let go of a lesser orb of acid, struck and then the warblade charged, elder mountain hammered with a holy greatsword and crited, and after some lucky damage rolls and some dust settling, Vanthus was one smashed corpse. The warblade then added a coup-de-gace on his almost-brother-in-law (he is pretty romantic with Lavinia ) , leaving very very little for the Big D to create a deathknight from, later.
Then again, the chars had been badly ripped up by the vrocks and whatnots before, so nobody really minded Vanthus going down in a whiffy.
interesting - same thing in our campaign - Vanthus showed up, made a cute remeark or two, teh warmage let go of a lesser orb of acid, struck and then the warblade charged, elder mountain hammered with a holy greatsword and crited, and after some lucky damage rolls and some dust settling, Vanthus was one smashed corpse. The warblade then added a coup-de-gace on his almost-brother-in-law (he is pretty romantic with Lavinia ) , leaving very very little for the Big D to create a deathknight from, later.
Then again, the chars had been badly ripped up by the vrocks and whatnots before, so nobody really minded Vanthus going down in a whiffy.
Yeah my group had already been hurt by the previous fights so it was no big deal. The spelltheif had 3 negative levels, the cleric/stormlord had 4. The minotaur/barbarian had taked 72 points of damage from the dance of ruin. So yeah they fought tooth and nail getting to Vanthus so a tasty victory was ok with me.
Has anyone had a pretty strong bard, or any other character in thier party? My party has an 8th level bard, that has stacked up his perform, and frequently uses fasscinate to screw up most of my big fights. Granted, I was unsure if he had to beat the SR on some of the big guys, and decided to error on the PC side till I found out. But I am concerned that some of his and some of the other PC abilities may make the "boss" fights, (I really hate that reference, this is not a video game), too easy for the party.
An example, during the Rats End battle, after the party split up to save all the little encounters, they all converged on Slipknot and his band of merry-men. The warmage, who was at the very end of the range, casts "Phantasmal Killer" on Slipknot, he failed both saves and died. I tried to make it where they could not use "Fireball" or any other area effect spell by having townsfolk around till the party closed for hand-to-hand. Didn't work! Now the toughest encounter in the whole attack was wiped out in two dice rolles.
Should I just reward my characters for making every tough encounter a cake-walk, or should I spruce it up a little more? I don't want to kill them all, but I would like for them to know they just fought a tough fight. Any ideas as to how I can make these fights memorable?
Thanks
Has anyone had a pretty strong bard, or any other character in thier party? My party has an 8th level bard, that has stacked up his perform... Any ideas as to how I can make these fights memorable?
Same deal, one of the PCs was a bard (angling for Fochlucan Lyrist), who was great at music and sort of lacklustre at everything else. Instead of allowing his music to be a "silver bullet" in fights (fascinate requires that the victim "be able to pay attention" to the bard, so it's seemingly of little use in the midst of a pitched battle; also note that "any threat" allows a new save), I've let him get the full benefit of buffing (inspire courage, etc.), but otherwise challenged him by setting up situations where his lesser abilities were challenged more strongly--his (non-fatal) duel with Meravanchi remains one of the high points of the campaign so far. This particular PC was also a bit sweet on Lavinia, so he ended up in melee with Vanthus while everyone else was still using spells and missiles...
Overall, focus talk on the characters' motivations, rather than on their abilities. If the players get engaged in the story, the mechanics will take care of themselves. If they really want characters who are 1-dimensional "villain-killers," they'd be playing video games instead of D&D.
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I like the idea that someone posted that any Hero Points that the PC's use in a session can be used by the DM in that session. As a DM, I would keep those Hero Points to avoid just such a situation.
If the PCs have "earned" the easy kill by a tough fight with the BBEG's minions, then using the deus ex machina points wouldn't be justified.
I like the idea that someone posted that any Hero Points that the PC's use in a session can be used by the DM in that session. As a DM, I would keep those Hero Points to avoid just such a situation.
If the PCs have "earned" the easy kill by a tough fight with the BBEG's minions, then using the deus ex machina points wouldn't be justified.
Hero Points are strictly for PCs. A good DM doesn't need them, owing to his demi-divine ability to "fudge".
Hero Points are strictly for PCs. A good DM doesn't need them, owing to his demi-divine ability to "fudge".
Fudging is a crutch and a sign of a lackluster DM. Everyone plays by the same rules, and if the PCs manage to one-shot the villain, well, it happens sometimes. Roll with it. It'll make your games better.
My players love that I make all combat rolls in the open. Lets them know that I'm not letting them win or screwing them over, but running the encounter straight and above-board. All I roll in secret are their Search, Spot, etc checks, and only when it's something that the character wouldn't catch on a failed check.
Try it. You'll be surprised how much it makes you up your game as a DM.
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Hero Points are strictly for PCs. A good DM doesn't need them, owing to his demi-divine ability to "fudge".
Not everybody uses them that way: See
Fatespinner's post .
Hero Points are strictly for PCs. A good DM doesn't need them, owing to his demi-divine ability to "fudge".Fudging is a crutch and a sign of a lackluster DM. Everyone plays by the same rules, and if the PCs manage to one-shot the villain, well, it happens sometimes. Roll with it. It'll make your games better.
My players love that I make all combat rolls in the open. Lets them know that I'm not letting them win or screwing them over, but running the encounter straight and above-board. All I roll in secret are their Search, Spot, etc checks, and only when it's something that the character wouldn't catch on a failed check.
Try it. You'll be surprised how much it makes you up your game as a DM.
Well, I must disagree with you here. For my group, D&D is not just a miniatures game, it's a storytelling game. The DM is just the facilitator, the supporting cast of this story. Rolling dice is arbitrary for a DM.
In truth, the DM ALWAYS lets the players win. You control the game. If you decide it's too easy, you can make more creatures for the players to fight in the next room. You decide everything. It's not simply a matter of player versus player here, where the dice really matter.
Don't get me wrong, for the most part I just roll the dice during combat and let the chips fall where they may, but occasionally it is better to just fudge the dice and say the BBEG doesn't slay the entire party in a round, or keep the villain alive an extra round to escape and hassle the party later. The only time I let such things happen is when the party has either made really stupid moves after repeated signs/warnings to do otherwise, or if they actually work really hard on a plan to take out the BBEG.
I've actually done things your way before, and I must say the party enjoys things this way a lot more. Not to mention they can't calculate the monsters' exact ability this way. Still, everyone has their own way of DMing. It's just rude to act like changing dice rolls to add to the game is somehow a lesser way to judge.
Peace. Love. Unity. Respect.
Wyatt