So yeah, I'm an assistant organizer for the Tampa Bay area DnD Meetup. Turns out we have the largest meetup in the TB area, so the St. Pete Times decided an article on us would be a good idea. Silly, silly persons. So they sent a reporter to our tues night game, and well, here's what came out :) Its a little harsh, I think, on the dork calling, but otherwise a fairly accurate transcription of our usual banter. Here's a link : Article
Yeah, I'm the DM :)
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Who you calling a dork, you orc!
Fist bumps all around for Dungeons and Dragons - and the grown men who love the fantasy game.
By CRISTINA SILVA
Published May 21, 2007
TAMPA -- The battle is nearly over. A magic pit of black tentacles is about to drag three men deep inside and smother them.
A brave, good-hearted orc named Talir picks up a nearby hyena with one hand. He uses it as a club to clobber his way through the crowd of attacking monsters.
Whoa.
"You are going to pick up a hyena with one hand?" asks Patrick McCann, the Dungeon Master, as he shoves lo mein in his mouth with chopsticks.
"Well," says Talir, otherwise known as Robert Hodgson, "I am enlarged."
Hodgson is a 25-year-old customer service representative. McCann is a 31-year-old U.S. Army sergeant. This is their weekly Dungeons and Dragons game night.
It's okay if you laugh at them. Even their wives do.
* * *
Dungeons and Dragons, the classic '80s fantasy role-playing game, is like G.I. Joes for overgrown boys, only way more elaborate.
Players create characters who embark upon imaginary journeys in which they battle monsters, gather treasure and earn points to become increasingly powerful.
The characters do all the things kids dream about, and apparently, those dreams don't die after high school.
Major blockbusters like Spider-Man, Harry Potter and Lord of the Rings have only encouraged Dungeons and Dragons fans to celebrate their alternative universes. The game is one of the most popular activities in Tampa Bay on the networking site meetup.com. Last year, DnD creators released an updated rule book.
Fans reason if Tobey Maguire can play a geeky spider boy, they can pretend to be orcs and gnolls.
McCann has been playing since he was 9. "There is always going to be this stigma of, 'Oh my god, you guys are such dorks,'" he said. "To which I say, 'How is your fantasy football game?' You are telling me that isn't equally dorky? I mean, I have a fantasy football game. It just happens to involve elves or swords."
* * *
The players spread out among a pair of joined card tables. Food is everywhere. An iTunes list loaded with Bjork, the Beatles and Jimi Hendrix provides a soundtrack to the smack talk.
"So, you just got shot at," McCann tells Phillip Spencer as he returns from the bathroom. McCann, playing the role of the monsters, had taken aim at Spencer's elf.
"Oh, wait, they didn't hit him," Hodgson points out. "You gave him a protective amulet."
"Yeah, I got that amulet on," Spencer says. "Booyah."
McCann: "You're a hooker."
Between moves, they ramble on, quoting classic flicks from the past two decades. Wayne's World is a favorite.
Henry W. Brennan commands a zombie to attack a raging barbarian ogre with a crossbow.
In DnD, he takes on the persona of a 2-foot lizard man with the ability to summon zombies. The kills excite him.
"That's right, b------."
He has never summoned a zombie before. He's giddy.
Boxes of plastic figurines of monsters, goblins and warriors crowd the living room floor. These are the game pieces.
Food containers are laid out on the table to symbolize ancient monasteries and other village buildings. An upside-down appetizer bowl stands in for a 40-foot dome.
Patrick's 22-year-old wife, Jessica, dressed in black slacks and a blouse, walks in the door after a long day at work and takes in the scene.
"Why are you using my Tupperware?"
"You know it's our temple," Phillip Morgan answers.
She rolls her eyes.
As they play, she usually hides upstairs in the family room and watches American Idol. Occasionally she taunts them as they argue over which player can use a spell to bring a monster back to life.
"You guys are dorks," she shouts.
* * *
On the weekends they go barhopping. Sometimes someone has too many Red Stripes.
Inevitably someone will mention something about an orc or a gnoll and blow their cover. Their Dungeons and Dragons personas are revealed. These are the characters they can slip into only when they are together.
Spencer, 21, plays an elf named Sebastian. Sebastian likes to transform into a bird and fly high above the battle so he can shoot arrows at the enemy.
Sebastian the elf shares little in common with Spencer, a Air Force computer technician who speaks so low that others around him may begin to wonder if they are in fact going deaf.
Morgan, 26, plays with a character that is a noble scout. In the real world he teaches high school math and prefers not to tell his students how he spends his Tuesday nights.
Brennan, 23, is a scrawny restaurant host from New Port Richey. He said he was so weird in high school "not even the goths would hang out with me."
He started playing three years ago with some friends. "I see it as a hobby, like collecting stamps," he said. "Wait a minute, what's more nerdy, stamp collecting or DnD?"
* * *
DnD's appeal to a high schooler is clear. Who wouldn't rather be a powerful sorcerer than a pimply 14-year-old?
But people don't let go of their fantasies when they grow up.
Yes, fans know orcs and elves and gnolls and evil sorcerers do not exist.
That isn't the point.
"We aren't going to get together and go play basketball," McCann said. "But whatever, we are going to explore a forgotten kingdom."
Cristina Silva can be reached at (727) 893-8846 or csilva@sptimes.com.
GEEK SPEAK:
Dungeons and Dragons glossary
A guide to embracing your inner geek:
DM: Dungeon Master, the player who controls the setting of the game and enforces the rules according to the official Dungeons and Dragons playbook.
Orc: a primitive race of barbaric humanoid, largely based upon the orcs appearing in the works of J.R.R. Tolkien.
Gnoll: a race of anthropomorphic hyenas.
Con: Slang for convention, as in, "Dude, I'm so going to the gamers' con in Indiana this summer."
RTFM: "Read the (bleepin') Manual," a command usually shouted to a fellow player who doesn't remember the rules of the game.
© 2007 • All Rights Reserved • St. Petersburg Times
Thats pretty cool.
That's too funny. RTFM, huh? Hadn't heard that one ;)
Clobbering enemies with a hyena. That's classic, man.
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I just talked to my wife by phone (I'm at work), and she read the article in SPT and is writing a letter to the editor. She took exception to the level of dorkiness ascribed to DnD players by the author. Now given, if you were really using a hyena for a melee weapon, perhaps the description was apt. It's a good thing no one was around to witness the last time my PCs tried to get all their equipment over a river, sans bridge, without getting any of it wet. Extreme dorkiness ensued...
I think what really got her was the description of your wife hiding upstairs in front of American Idol, and the implication that this behavior was somehow less dorky.
My wife needs help embracing her inner dork...boy, that sounds wrong!
That article paints D&D players as family-oriented, harmless enthusiasts exhibiting great humor and humility.
Its about time!
Well done!
Honestly, the fact that I was married is what got the reporter to even contact me :) She was trying to play up the "they aren't losers living in thier mom's basement" angle, or so she said. And yeah, the Enlarged Orc Battle SOrc/ Dragon Disciple did in fact use a handy hyena as a club against a ogre barbarian, though I think he was just showing off, as he had his sword in his other hand. PETA will be after us fer sure...
Great stuff!
I'm not sure I like the author's lack of effort to understand the game...but maybe that's just me. Or it might be the fact that she feels it's just for the guys. I dunno, but the author's style rubbed me the wrong way.
After reading it several times (ha), I agree, The writing style leaves much to be desired. It feels like a tabloid piece rather than an academic one, but hey, the writer is in her early 20's as well, and hasn;t really developed any kind of personal style. Or thats the benefit of the doubt I'm giving her.
Ha, ha.
Fantasy football is nerdy.
Call me when there is fantasy football with elves and orcs and unicorns, and stuff.
As a real life geek that lives in his mother's basement, I take exception to the depiction of dorks and D&D players as family oriented, humorous people that can take a little ribbing from friends and family with poise and humor. This kind of fraudulent stereotyping is not only demeaning, but completely false. I will have you know that both myself and my friends are home-bound myopic losers that are literally chained to our computers for days on end. My neckbeard is permanently orange from cheeto residue and I've never even kissed a girl. I will not suffer being humanized by any journalist in any way, shape or form.
I thought it the article was accepting of gamer dorkeness. It was diffinitly an outside perspective, the whole thing was shown as a little strange. But if you play D&D, you should get used to people thinnking it a little strange.
IMO, there's a helpful political move here and it's a subtle one. You don't generally succeed when you take people from A to C. You take them from A to B, and let someone down the line take them to C once B is fully understood and accepted.
This article said dork, sure, but that's a middle ground. A was D&D IS FOR DEMON WORSHIPPING DADDY RAPISTS!
What it also did was show folks that real D&D was for real people. Fallible people. Silly people. Not another D&D caused this samurai killer to strike article.
Did you expect her to say, "Hey, this is what all the cool kids are doing!"
That's C. ;) We'll get there.
I agree with Lillith. The reporters style really reminded me of some of my friends who will come over to the house on game night just to call us dorks. Which leads to a huge sidetrack and things go crazy. Mostly it's just annoying and kind of immature.
I do like that she showed how family oriented and silly players are.
And I like how you called your friend a hooker. :P
As a real life geek that lives in his mother's basement, I take exception to the depiction of dorks and D&D players as family oriented, humorous people that can take a little ribbing from friends and family with poise and humor. This kind of fraudulent stereotyping is not only demeaning, but completely false. I will have you know that both myself and my friends are home-bound myopic losers that are literally chained to our computers for days on end. My neckbeard is permanently orange from cheeto residue and I've never even kissed a girl. I will not suffer being humanized by any journalist in any way, shape or form.
I hear you. I'm planning my next samurai style killin' as we type.
I agree with Lillith. The reporters style really reminded me of some of my friends who will come over to the house on game night just to call us dorks. Which leads to a huge sidetrack and things go crazy. Mostly it's just annoying and kind of immature.
I do like that she showed how family oriented and silly players are.
And I like how you called your friend a hooker. :P
Yeux wominz hate bein' called dorks, man. I honestly never knew. :)
As a real life geek that lives in his mother's basement, I take exception to the depiction of dorks and D&D players as family oriented, humorous people that can take a little ribbing from friends and family with poise and humor. This kind of fraudulent stereotyping is not only demeaning, but completely false. I will have you know that both myself and my friends are home-bound myopic losers that are literally chained to our computers for days on end. My neckbeard is permanently orange from cheeto residue and I've never even kissed a girl. I will not suffer being humanized by any journalist in any way, shape or form.
LOL!!!!:p
As a real life geek that lives in his mother's basement, I take exception to the depiction of dorks and D&D players as family oriented, humorous people that can take a little ribbing from friends and family with poise and humor. This kind of fraudulent stereotyping is not only demeaning, but completely false. I will have you know that both myself and my friends are home-bound myopic losers that are literally chained to our computers for days on end. My neckbeard is permanently orange from cheeto residue and I've never even kissed a girl. I will not suffer being humanized by any journalist in any way, shape or form.
Dude, you got a neckbeard? Mine won't grow in, it's all patchy. Or maybe it's just PURE cheetos and not hair at all. I don't wanna wash it and find out.
I agree with Lillith. The reporters style really reminded me of some of my friends who will come over to the house on game night just to call us dorks. Which leads to a huge sidetrack and things go crazy. Mostly it's just annoying and kind of immature.
I do like that she showed how family oriented and silly players are.
And I like how you called your friend a hooker. :P
So why do you let these people in? Ugh. When I was dpeloyed last year, we played in the gym. 80% of the people ignored us, 10% made snide comments, 5% were curious, and the other 5% asked if they could play, they had dice in thier hootch!!!
And I call everyone a hooker :)
As a real life geek that lives in his mother's basement, I take exception to the depiction of dorks and D&D players as family oriented, humorous people that can take a little ribbing from friends and family with poise and humor. This kind of fraudulent stereotyping is not only demeaning, but completely false. I will have you know that both myself and my friends are home-bound myopic losers that are literally chained to our computers for days on end. My neckbeard is permanently orange from cheeto residue and I've never even kissed a girl. I will not suffer being humanized by any journalist in any way, shape or form.
Your living the dream.
Keep it real man. Keep it real. (Raise fist in air in agesture of solidarity)|
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Here's the text of my wife's letter to the author...
I must say, after reading your article, it seems that you've missed something important that I can't quite put my finger on. You made it seem like 20- to 30- year old were still living out their adolescent fantasies, when in fact, the face of D&D is changing. D&D players can be doctors, lawyers, enlisted men, adolescents, women -- the message boards at paizo.com are filled with a myriad of people! I choose to participate in the games my husband DMs. I think spending an evening gaming with friends is much more rewarding than watching the latest reality show. In addition, my two children, ages 6 and 4, play.One is an axe-wielding dwarf, the other a mace-toting cleric. This is a great way to encourage creative thinking and stretch their problem solving skills. So by day, I'm a homeschooling mommy of two, and by night, I'm Jay, a human rogue that can hide in any shadow, move silently and slit your throat before you even know someone is behind you, and slip back into the shadows like I was never there. D&D, it's not just for boys -- it's a family affair!
Now - If the DCF doesn't come and take away my children, we're all good.
RPG Superstar 2013 Top 32
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Now - If the DCF doesn't come and take away my children, we're all good.
The sad but true thing is that it's not entirely unbelievable that something along those lines WILL happen, especially with the line:
"So by day, I'm a homeschooling mommy of two, and by night, I'm Jay, a human rogue that can hide in any shadow, move silently and slit your throat before you even know someone is behind you, and slip back into the shadows like I was never there."
I can only hope your local child protective services never receive word of this or, if they do, that they are tolerant and intelligent enough to take it at face value and not twist it to make you look like evil parents.
Ha, ha.
Fantasy football is nerdy.
Call me when there is fantasy football with elves and orcs and unicorns, and stuff.
Its called Blood Bowl. It's a hell of a lot of fun. We play it on weeks when we can't get all the players together for D&D.
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And here's the author's reply...
Thanks for your imput. We were actually just trying to show that adults also have an interest in being part of this fantasy world. Most of the players we interviewed actually didn't start playing until they were older. And we couldn't find any women to interview-- sorry!
Now - If the DCF doesn't come and take away my children, we're all good.The sad but true thing is that it's not entirely unbelievable that something along those lines WILL happen, especially with the line:
"So by day, I'm a homeschooling mommy of two, and by night, I'm Jay, a human rogue that can hide in any shadow, move silently and slit your throat before you even know someone is behind you, and slip back into the shadows like I was never there."
I can only hope your local child protective services never receive word of this or, if they do, that they are tolerant and intelligent enough to take it at face value and not twist it to make you look like evil parents.
I think maybe you should be Jay the Stalwart Paladin, defender of the poor and downtrodden - for this letter at least.
And here's the author's reply...
Thanks for your imput. We were actually just trying to show that adults also have an interest in being part of this fantasy world. Most of the players we interviewed actually didn't start playing until they were older. And we couldn't find any women to interview-- sorry!
This part is correct. I am the only player in my group that has been playing for over 10 years. Most of my group started playing in college, or in the past couple years since 3rd Ed gave the game a needed resuscitation. We don't have many female players in the Tampa meetup, and that was the focus of her article. One of the guys wives plays, but she wasn't available that night. And don't worry, I won't tell DCF :) Where are ya'll in the bay area?
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Where are ya'll in the bay area?
We're in Largo. Our group consists of me, my wife, and the neighbors. It's really an ideal situation, since both families have small children, there are about 2 million reasons to cancel a game session at the last minute, but since we're neighbors, its super easy to adjust. The downside is that our game stays pretty small.
Sweet. Well, if you read the article, you "met" my group :) I'm in north west tampa, near veterans on waters. If you sign up for the meetup, theres a couple cons over the summer that we're planning big group gatherings for.
When people like my grandfather read that article they'll think of gaming as a light-hearted amusement that regular people engage in socially, rather than a Sylvia Plath reading group at the schizophrenia ward. Though poking fun at gamers, it also humanized them. A small victory say I.
+1. Good thing she left out the part about our Awakened Large Sheep getting Greased to stay away from both the Giant BLack Tentacles and the Zombies. beasti-necro-tentacle-philia?!?!
I'm in the same boat as Lilith and YeuxAndI. I took exception mostly to: "Dungeons and Dragons, the classic '80s fantasy role-playing game, is like G.I. Joes for overgrown boys, only way more elaborate." Ignoring the implication that D&D is a boys-only game, it implies that those that choose to play the game are immature.
Now, I know the reporter put that in so her artcile sounded hip and witty. Which actually bothers me more. Made the article come off more snarky than I'm sure she meant it to.
I'm not sure I like the author's lack of effort to understand the game...but maybe that's just me. Or it might be the fact that she feels it's just for the guys. I dunno, but the author's style rubbed me the wrong way.
Oh yeah, me too, but it's a reporter. They have inherent genetic and moral limitations that prevent them from becoming politicians.
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I think maybe you should be Jay the Stalwart Paladin, defender of the poor and downtrodden - for this letter at least.Now - If the DCF doesn't come and take away my children, we're all good.The sad but true thing is that it's not entirely unbelievable that something along those lines WILL happen, especially with the line:
"So by day, I'm a homeschooling mommy of two, and by night, I'm Jay, a human rogue that can hide in any shadow, move silently and slit your throat before you even know someone is behind you, and slip back into the shadows like I was never there."
I can only hope your local child protective services never receive word of this or, if they do, that they are tolerant and intelligent enough to take it at face value and not twist it to make you look like evil parents.
Exactly, easier to defend people pretending to save the world then it is defending people pretending to be homicidal killers with no remorse.
More fuel for the "D&D leads to disattachment and make people de-value life" group probably wasn't the correct path to enlightening the masses.FH
Interesting reaction from teh ladies of Paizo. So what can we do to open the game up more?
Hey, Ladies! Here's what you do. Start a girl gamer site. Now there is a girl gamer site, but it seems to be videogame players. This has got to be a SheWoman-ManHater's Club. Then, with this shiny new element in play, announce yourselves boldly to the press. Tell any reporter who will listen that D&D isn't just for boys anymore.
The press loves a controversy, even a lame one. Tell reporters that a woman's natural born ability to multitask helps out in so many ways during play or GMing... claim outright superiority to the knuckle-dragging, mouth-breathing male of the species.
"We're not those girls who failed math and science, bub."
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RPG Superstar 2013 Top 32
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Hey, Ladies! Here's what you do. Start a girl gamer site. Now there is a girl gamer site, but it seems to be videogame players. This has got to be a SheWoman-ManHater's Club. Then, with this shiny new element in play, announce yourselves boldly to the press. Tell any reporter who will listen that D&D isn't just for boys anymore.
I would donate to such a worthy cause... and I'm male.
...is there something wrong with me?
I would donate to such a worthy cause... and I'm male....is there something wrong with me?
Not at all... what's good for them is good for us. It's big picture time. :)
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I've been a proponent of female DMs forever. Every time I suggest it to my wife, she tells me where to stick my Player's Handbook.
And YeuxAndI, that's exactly the way my wife took the article, thus the email. It wasn't painting the game in a negative light, per se, but comparing it to GI Joe? That was bound to provoke a response from female uber-dorkdom. ;-)
Still, like Jade wrote, it's far better to be compared to GI Joe than 'Monsters and Mazes'. The 700 club has never crusaded against GI Joe.
Have they?
Tell reporters that a woman's natural born ability to multitask helps out in so many ways during play or GMing...
Okay, maybe I just have Starcraft on the brain, but I read that as "natural born ability to mutalisk"...
>.>
<.<
Um, yeah...
Eh, I'm not interested in going to the opposite extreme of man-hating, woman-is-superior feminazi approach. Total turn off, and not one I believe in. However, there is dearth of female RPG sites out there... :(
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Exactly, easier to defend people pretending to save the world then it is defending people pretending to be homicidal killers with no remorse.
More fuel for the "D&D leads to disattachment and make people de-value life" group probably wasn't the correct path to enlightening the masses.FH
Who's defending? Or enlightening the masses for that matter? Have you checked out the cover of the latest issue of Dungeon that's appearing on newstands? Nothing in an email sent to the author of this article is going to move any part of the 'masses', one way or another. People are either open-minded about the way other people pass their time, or they are not. Nothing anyone writes or says is going to take the edge off a broadcast by Jerry Fallwell to the true believers that DnD invites Satan into the home.
I guess I've just given up trying to hide what DnD is. Be whatever you want to be, and apologize to no one!
I wouldn't say the game itself is anti-woman. I would say the popular sterotypes concerning Dungeons and Dragons are. Push enough 'only dorks that can't get a girlfriend play D&D' sterotypes, and outsiders to the game will simply assume that is the unadulterated truth.
Personally I think the sterotype that D&D is a boys' game is total bunk. I grew up playing in games where the female to male ratio kept growing until we had only a few boys and mostly girls. Playing awesome characters that did evil things. *sighs at the happy memories*
I also balk at the suggestion that to get rid of a negative streotype, you need to fight back with an equally negative but opposite sterotype. Roleplaying is for people that enjoy roleplaying. It's no more dorky than any other hobby.
Eh, I'm not interested in going to the opposite extreme of man-hating, woman-is-superior feminazi approach. Total turn off, and not one I believe in. However, there is dearth of female RPG sites out there... :(
I only meantplayful manhating, merely tossing out a couple of infectiously entertaining barbs to get the interest of the press. If there's already a dearth of female RPG sites out there then I guess just find another angle that might appeal to the papers and give them a ring. If you don't do some sort of dance it's harder to get people to notice you.
I'm doing the old break-dance butterfly move now. Oi, my ribs.
I also balk at the suggestion that to get rid of a negative streotype, you need to fight back with an equally negative but opposite sterotype. Roleplaying is for people that enjoy roleplaying. It's no more dorky than any other hobby.
I just knew you were Balkan. It was just an idea to spark up some notice. I'm sure you all have better ideas for how to go about it more sensibly. That's the one I had right there, right then. My sincere apologies for attempting to be cute about the whole thing in the face of what seems to be communally serious indignation.
Aw, wasn't meant to be a snarling attack at what you said, Jade. Just was a response to what's been said here collectively. It was me doling out my 2 cents about D&D and how people view it, not an angry tirade about what you suggested. : D ? *smiley face now?*
Aw, wasn't meant to be a snarling attack at what you said, Jade. Just was a response to what's been said here collectively. It was me doling out my 2 cents about D&D and how people view it, not an angry tirade about what you suggested. : D ? *smiley face now?*
Thank you for not singling me out, Corey, but I wasn't put off by your upset. I was just apologizing for my lack of understanding. Paizo woman were speaking from a place where the emotional stakes were high and, not getting it at all, I was doing my typical frivolity thing. That's not like me and I was just attempting to take some responsibility for the slip and say I'm onboard now.
::salutes::
Con: Slang for convention, as in, "Dude, I'm so going to the gamers' con in Indiana this summer."
Hmm...amongst my fellow gamers, "Con" is short for Constitution, as in "Holy @SS-crackers, that fang dragon did phat Con drain!" (You can quote me on that phrase.) Therefore, I think I unfortunately can only apply as far as "sub-dork".
Here's a cool anecdotal story.
Great story, Lil. Thanks for the link.