Nonassociated / associated classes


Dragon Magazine General Discussion


As nobody made any comments, I'll repeat the following here:

One of the things I like about the MM IV is that someone actually made the effort to list the associated classes for three/four of the creatures. The creatures are:
Justice Archon (MM IV 80)- paladin levels improves SR
Redspawn Arcaniss (MM IV 152)- sorcerer levels associated (& stack with existing ability); “levels of other classes are nonassociated”.
Verdant Prince (MM IV 172)- “Rogue and scout are associated classes for the purpose of advancement”
Wizened Elder (MM IV 180)- “Druid levels stack with a wizened elder’s HD for the purpose of its entangle and speak with plants abilities. Racial HD do not stack with druid levels for spellcasting.” Druid levels associated or not then?

I can’t remember if I’ve requested it before or not, but I (and many others, I’m sure) would love to see an article about exactly which classes are associated or not (for all the creatures in MM I, II, III, IV, FF, etc). The definition is very weak, so an official update is greatly needed.
To get the ball rolling, here are some of my thoughts:

Anything with Sneak Attack: associated class is rogue or PrCs that improve sneak attack.
Anything with Hide and Move Silently (as racial skills): associated class is any class or PrCs with those two skills on their class skill lists.
Anything casting spells as a bard (eg. lillend): associated class is bard or PrCs that improve (bard) spellcasting
Anything casting spells as a cleric (eg. trumpet archon, banelar): associated class is cleric or PrCs that improve (cleric) spellcasting
Anything casting spells as a druid (eg. nymph): associated class is druid or PrCs that improve (druid) spellcasting
Anything casting spells as a sorcerer (eg. couatl, older dragons, rakshasa , protean scourge): associated class is sorcerer or PrCs that improve (sorcerer) spellcasting
Anything casting spells as a wizard (eg. banelar): associated class is wizard or PrCs that improve (wizard) spellcasting
Anything with a specific psionic class (using psionic variant from Expanded Psionics Handbook): associated class is that specific class or PrCs that improve (psionic) spellcasting
Few or no special abilities, uses natural weapons or heavy weapons*: Any warrior-type class is associated (ie. anything with good BAB progression). This line only applies if none of the above 8 lines do.
If a creature DOES have an associated class, then all others are non-associated.

Some questions:
1) If the creature matches “few or no special…” line, what about monk levels? I think it should be nonassociated.
2) What about some of the new classes that have aura abilities (divine mind, dragon shaman, incarnate, marshal)? Strictly speaking, a cleric’s bless and righteous wrath of the faithful aid allies, and cleric isn’t associated for most creatures. Therefore, the “aura classes” probably should be nonassociated for most creatures.
3) What about the incarnum classes (incarnate, soulborn, totemist)? These classes’ abilities can easily buff a creature, but then so can a cleric’s spells, so they should probably be non-associated for any creature that doesn’t have racial incarnum abilities. In particular, incarnates have poor BAB gain (and totemist moderate BAB), but soulborns use good BAB, so perhaps soulborns count as a “warrior-type” class.
4) What about creatures that don’t have any apparent special abilities (sneak attack, stealth, spellcasting)? In particular, probably everything is non-associated for fey (excluding nymphs, which have druid spellcasting, and red caps, which are clearly warriors).

Any thoughts/comments would be greatly appreciated, as would an official article in Dragon. Pretty please, Jason?


It's basically a matter of "if it helps the monster do what it does best".


What're associated and non-associated classes?


Razz,
When you add class levels to a monster, you have to know if the class is associated or non-associated to find the new CR.
e.g: Hill Giant barbarian, much more difficult than normal Hill Giant, associated. Hill Giant Wizard, not that much better, non-associated.

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