Pathfinder Campaign Setting: Cheliax, The Infernal Empire (PFRPG)

Chris Lambertz wrote:

Updated with final cover image and description!

Yay for Striges!

I think that's an erinyes... unless I've misunderstood your post. ^_^

Rather interested in seeing Cheliax expanded. Hope it's more in the format of Osirion's and Irrisen's books; both of them broke down the regions and the settlements in good detail.

Also, elaborate hierarchies and redacted histories sound like a fun read.

Cool.

Ruyan.

How much overlap is there with the old* "Cheliax: Empire of Devils" splatbook?

Doug M.

*I think that came out in... what, 2009? But it seems a lot longer.

Will any of the feats in Cheliax: Empire of Devils be reprinted with altered rules? For example, Belier's Bite is quite powerful for the investment compared with say the Boar Style chain.

Actually this may be a Mark Moreland trivia question.

When was the first time Cheliax was coined the "Infernal Empire" in print?

I have a post from June 5, 2008 using that exact term, I may have very well been one of the first to use that turn of phrase.

Actually this may be a Mark Moreland trivia question.

When was the first time Cheliax was coined the "Infernal Empire" in print?

I have a post from June 5, 2008 using that exact term, I may have very well been one of the first to use that turn of phrase.

You my very well be....early references to Cheliax seemed to to be 'Diabolical Empire in Decline' in the Pathfinder Chronicles: Gazetteer and Pathfinder Chronicles: Campaign Setting both being published in 2008.

My favorite area in Golarion!!

what is the difference between this book and "Cheliax, Empire of Devils" ?

The blurb doesn't really say why I'd need *both*

Well given the Andoran and Osirion books, there well be more information on each region in the Cheliax, more detail on a handful of cities, more up to date information, information/tips/suggestions on running adventures or campaigns there and details on adventure sites, and a small bestiary.

Not to mention the original book was 32 pages and this one will be 64. So thats a possible 32 pages of new information devoted to the Andoran Reconquista....

I'd say two important differences are:

1) It's 64 pages, which means double the size of Cheliax: Empire of Devils.

2) It's written for the primarily GM-focused Pathfinder Campaign Setting line, which typically means more focus on fluff than crunch.

As a result, this book is going to feature a lot more lore concerning Cheliax. It'll most likely be the go-to book for Cheliax lore.

If previous regional sourcebooks are anything to go by, this book will feature very little crunch beyond what's in the book's bestiary section, and as such the crunch in the 32-page Player Companion book might still be relevant to you.

Awesome cover!

Will any of the devil based martial arts be updated or added to?

So angry.

Paizo, you were making me happy by not putting out Campaign Setting books that I was interested in for a while. There was one here, one there, but now you are going for 5 in a row (if you don't count Inner Sea Races).

Fortunately, your next two offerings aren't so tasty for me personally, but then what are you doing? Oh, that's right. Heaven Unleashed. What are you doing to me?

SICK AND TIRED. SICK AND TIRED Paizo. I expect, nay, I DEMAND that the remainder of 2016 be "Revisited" titles for the Campaign Setting line.

Does anyone know what new Devils are featured in this manual's bestiary?

Someone has got to inform me on the noble titles for Cheliax as soon as possible!

I need to use the correct title, you see.

Does anyone have the PDF of this book yet? PDFs for other products did get out to at least some subscribers today.

I'm heading to bed, but to answer one of the floating questions: The para-x titles are ranked slightly lower than their non-para versions, are granted titles, and are non-hereditary.

Edit: I decided to briefly look through the rest before bed. The lure of the product was too great. The 'Master' line for the adventure area descriptions is back! Yay!

Haven't read through it yet, but the location-info parts of this seem especially meaty size-wise. I'm not immediately sure if it's just because of the formatting shift (which sub-divides the location info less, which seems to have given at least some of the added text-room), or if there's something else that got cut for more location space (The PC-race NPCs that usually end up with the monster section, maybe?).

The new devil is the Pataraavex (Sire Devil), which can shape-shift, seduce, and bargain, offering pleasure and a variety of rewards in exchange for bearing devil-tainted young. There's also a template for fiend-infused golems.

Thank you.

I see that I was right to avoid the "para-" titles for members of the noble family my Chelaxian PC was born into.

I am really looking forward to seeing the stats for that new devil.

Cool, I was thinking the para- titles were more of an appointment.

Are the 'meaty' bits similar to Irrisen and Osirion's?

I'm heading to bed, but to answer one of the floating questions: The para-x titles are ranked slightly lower than their non-para versions, are granted titles, and are non-hereditary.

Edit: I decided to briefly look through the rest before bed. The lure of the product was too great. The 'Master' line for the adventure area descriptions is back! Yay!

Haven't read through it yet, but the location-info parts of this seem especially meaty size-wise. I'm not immediately sure if it's just because of the formatting shift (which sub-divides the location info less, which seems to have given at least some of the added text-room), or if there's something else that got cut for more location space (The PC-race NPCs that usually end up with the monster section, maybe?).

The new devil is the Pataraavex (Sire Devil), which can shape-shift, seduce, and bargain, offering pleasure and a variety of rewards in exchange for bearing devil-tainted young. There's also a template for fiend-infused golems.

What, pray tell, are the titles a proper Cheliaxian noble should refer to themselves as?

I believe that we upper class have been deprived of our proper titles for far too long!

(Will likely be getting this Campaign Setting for sure.)

What are the "six hellish new monsters"?

I think referring to the sire devil as "new" is as good a reason as any to go back and reread Hell's Pawns. ^_^

Thank you, Kalindlara.
About this Sire devil, it's a greater one (CR 13 or higher) or a lesser one?

It's CR 7.

Are the 'meaty' bits similar to Irrisen and Osirion's?

Are the 'meaty' bits similar to Irrisen and Osirion's?

Less subdivided-by-area, but otherwise yes. There's 30 pages of gazetteer without divisions into areas like 'The Brazen Fronteer', 'Footprints of Rovagug', etc. This length actually appears to be less than what Osirion and Irrisent had, but it feels like formatting changes managed to get more on to those pages on average. There's some town maps, town stat blocks, and pictures in there, but there's less half-page maps and heading-formatting. After the gazetteer, there's 11 one-page dungeon/encounter-area-info sections.

For comparison:
Osirion has 36 pages worth of gazetteer and 9 partial-page adventure sites. Irrisen has 36 pages of gazetteer and 8 partial-page adventure sites.

What, pray tell, are the titles a proper Cheliaxian noble should refer to themselves as?

Infernal Majestor/Majestrix ('Infernal' being an optional prefix that doesn't change rank, Ruler of Cheliax)

There's nine ranks (excluding the top two royal ones) to mirror the nine layers of Hell, which go in the general Duke/Count/Baron sub-groups, each of which has three ranks within it. The top two royal ranks are formally considered outside and above the nobility. Archduchies are made of duchies which are made of counties, which are made of baronies, though there's a few regions that are exceptions. The Heartlands have House Thrune ruling directly instead of an Archduke. Ravounel is an Archduchy without an Archduke. Hellcoast is currently being run by a Paraduke instead of an Archduke; the wording there suggests that Archduke and other traditionally hereditary titles *can* be granted (with Hellcoast's current Paraduke possibly hoping to someday obtain one but being more-actively concerned with other problems, like the state of Pezzack), it is just rarer.

Then there's other titles that have authority on some level in the bureaucracy, but aren't formal noble titles. Visbaron is one of these and is noted as being below all of the above.

Valignatir wrote:

What, pray tell, are the titles a proper Cheliaxian noble should refer to themselves as?

Infernal Majestor/Majestrix ('Infernal' being an optional prefix that doesn't change rank, Ruler of Cheliax)

Infernal Prince/Princess ('Infernal' again being an optional prefix that doesn't change rank, Must be a direct descendant of an individual who was Majestor/Majestrix)
Archduke/Archduchess (Six at one time presently, hereditary rulers of archduchies)
Duke/Duchess (Landed, hereditary)
Paraduke/Paraduchess (Granted, unlanded, non-hereditary)
Archcount/Archcountess (Landed, hereditary, rules a 'county' just like a Count/Countess but higher-ranking)
Count/Countess (Landed, hereditary)
Paracount/Paracountess (Granted, unlanded, non-hereditary)
Archbaron/Archbaroness (Landed, hereditary, rules a 'barony' just like a Baron/Baroness but higher-ranking)
Baron/Baroness (Landed, hereditary)
Demibaron/Demibaroness (Granted, unlanded, non-hereditary, lowest noble rank)

There's nine ranks (excluding the top two royal ones) to mirror the nine layers of Hell, which go in the general Duke/Count/Baron sub-groups, each of which has three ranks within it. The top two royal...

While reading that, I'm trying to think of what levels and CRs each rank would be...I'd imagine a Demibaron at 3-4th level and a Baron at 5-7th level. And an Infernal Prince/ess could easily be BBEG material.

I'm a little bit confused as to why anyone would want to be a Demibaron, since it just seems to place you one step above a peasant. I guess that's...something?

Also, what are the NPCs in this book? A heaping helping of Hellknights, I assume?

Also, what are the NPCs in this book? A heaping helping of Hellknights, I assume?

Do you mean NPCs who receive a short statline (LE female human fighter 4/slayer 1), or those with an actual statblock?

Statblock.

Statblock.

Zero. They reference the NPC Codex here and there, but that's as close as they get.

Orly? The past setting books always had finished NPCs.

Orly? The past setting books always had finished NPCs.

There are no NPC stat blocks with accompanying fluff in the Bestiary for this book.

Which was a wee bit disappointing for me. I quite enjoy those NPC writeups, and if there's a place that features interesting NPCs, I reckon Cheliax would be such a place.

Oh well, it's still another sweet offering of regional lore. The parts I've read have me longing to run a Cheliax-based campaign.

Sounds spiffy!

They're probably banking on the Inner Sea NPC Codex, which has seven Chelaxian NPCs.

More are always useful, of course, but between that and various other sources, they probably felt it was well-covered enough to use the space for other content.

More are always useful, of course, but between that and various other sources, they probably felt it was well-covered enough to use the space for other content.

Makes perfect sense. :)

I'm a little bit confused as to why anyone would want to be a Demibaron, since it just seems to place you one step above a peasant. I guess that's...something?

In a place like Cheliax, I assume that you would take whatever status you can get. Being one step above a peasant is a heck of a lot better than being a peasant.

Axial wrote:

I'm a little bit confused as to why anyone would want to be a Demibaron, since it just seems to place you one step above a peasant. I guess that's...something?

In a place like Cheliax, I assume that you would take whatever status you can get. Being one step above a peasant is a heck of a lot better than being a peasant.

Ambition! It is but the first step in your glorious ascension to power!

So, knights aren't low ranking nobility?

I am pretty sure that the whole "one step above a peasant" thing was a rash misinterpretation. I would guess that a knight is the next step below a noble, and that there are many fine gradations between a knight and a common peasant. I picked that much up from the earlier player's book for Cheliax.

Axial wrote:

Orly? The past setting books always had finished NPCs.

There are no NPC stat blocks with accompanying fluff in the Bestiary for this book.

Which was a wee bit disappointing for me. I quite enjoy those NPC writeups, and if there's a place that features interesting NPCs, I reckon Cheliax would be such a place.

Oh well, it's still another sweet offering of regional lore. The parts I've read have me longing to run a Cheliax-based campaign.

We decided to not include NPC stats for 2 reasons—

1) There are PLENTY of NPC stats out there for Chelaxian stuff, what with 3 APs set there, numerous books with NPC support, and so on...

2) Because of customer feedback and in-house preference that preferred there being actual monsters rather than just NPCs. It doesn't take much to build a 4th level cleric of Asmodeus—anyone can do that—but official monsters and creatures native to Cheliax? That's something only Paizo can provide, so it makes sense that in a book where we can do both, we'd focus on the one other people can't do.

We decided to not include NPC stats for 2 reasons—

1) There are PLENTY of NPC stats out there for Chelaxian stuff, what with 3 APs set there, numerous books with NPC support, and so on...

2) Because of customer feedback and in-house preference that preferred there being actual monsters rather than just NPCs. It doesn't take much to build a 4th level cleric of Asmodeus—anyone can do that—but official monsters and creatures native to Cheliax? That's something only Paizo can provide, so it makes sense that in a book where we can do both, we'd focus on the one other people can't do.

Perfect sense is made.

My "disappointment" is merely due to my own enjoyment of the NPC writeups. I have no problem with them not being present (like you mentioned, there are plenty of Cheliax-themed stat blocks available) because of the reasons you mentioned. :)

Anyone care to give some spoiler info on the Ash Hag, the associated changeling racial trait....and the Changeling focused feats ?

Anyone care to give some spoiler info on the Ash Hag, the associated changeling racial trait....and the Changeling focused feats ?

No feats.

nighttree wrote:

Anyone care to give some spoiler info on the Ash Hag, the associated changeling racial trait....and the Changeling focused feats ?

No feats.

** spoiler omitted **

** spoiler omitted **

Excellent....many thanks ;)

Info on the cerberus worm and the Hellfire Iginis would be appreciated.

Info on the cerberus worm and the Hellfire Iginis would be appreciated.

Thank you Kal.

Ignis sounds pretty neat! I have a weakness for fiery casters so I might consider him as a familiar next chance I get to be a player.

I just hope I'm not alone in apreciating that the title of archduke holds any worth in a fantasy setting. history can be so silly sometimes.

Are Ash Hags Lawful Evil?

Are Hellfire Ignises Lawful Evil?

What CR is the Sire Devil and what does it look like?