Peasant Bloodline PDF

Greetings to all! This is Dave Woodrum (aka hallucitor) of Mossy Mountain Gathering. As stated in the product description of Peasant Bloodline, we are looking for any and all input from gamers regarding future installments of the Bloodline character family trees. Comments, compliments, complaints, insults, groveling, and boasts all welcome and appreciated! The first one is a bit on the bare side, yes, but we want to see what the customers would like from the future Bloodline products before we go really deep into detail (or not... should less detail actually be desired).

So please, feel free to openly discuss your thoughts and opinions... and encourage others to download and look over this free product!

Thanks!
Dave

Free's always the magic word to this canny scot :)

Dutifully downloaded and about to be looked over...

Cheers

Interesting. I have a player who has been looking for something like this but with random tables to roll up a background for his PC's.

Free's always the magic word to this canny scot :)

Dutifully downloaded and about to be looked over...

Cheers

Thanks for grabbing a copy. On the note of free... we will try to release many more free products down the road. Granted, in order to upgrade software and buy more gaming products we will be pricing products from time to time.... but we will try to add a great deal of free stuff when we can.

Interesting. I have a player who has been looking for something like this but with random tables to roll up a background for his PC's.

Thanks for the input. I checked this board earlier today but did not have time to reply. I gave your idea of the random tables some thought and an addition of this might be possible... though at the time it would be more of an option to allow the fleshing out of the rest of the distant family members not covered.

In regards to wealthier bloodtypes, I'm wondering if notable servants should be detailed... any thoughts on this?

Sorry I am a bit late to the thread... I just went through the PDF.

First impressions, and this will be uncensored.

This is a product that just gives you a complete family background.
This is a product that just gives you one complete family background.
The only built in variability is the family name is left blank (with some suggestions) and your character name.
This works as a freebie, but I would expect more from a paid for product - more family backgrounds or more randomness.

Okay, that was what went through my mind as I was looking through it.

It is very good quality work. Layout is good, and the chart at the end is really a nice touch. Although, a bit weird for a peasant bloodline... I won't call you on that because it is still really neat. :-)

It took me a moment to realise that the Father and Mother listing weren't an example, but the start of the actual product. It might be that I just didn't understand what this really was. But it could be that it wasn't clear. Wait until you hear from others to decide.

It seems like a ton of work for a freebie, so I would hope that you would make tomes available with multiple bloodlines in there - even if they follow the same theme (Tome of Peasant Bloodlines, for example). Some built in variableness or randomness could help the longevity of the product after purchase. As it stands, it is pretty much single use. Yes, the user can modify it. But once you do the chart in back becomes less useful, and you have to weight the time taken versus changing it enough to make a difference. It might be seen as the same amount of work to make up one completely, than modify one presented.

That is my opinion. I hope it didn't come across as too harsh.

I suggest using a term other than "bloodline" if you want your supplements to be used by players of Pathfinder RPG, since it is a game term that applies to sorcerers. Try lineage, heritage, ancestry, roots, whatever.

I was also confused when the expectations set up by the "How To Use This Product" section did not match what I subsequently read. The product ought to work for multiple players with different results.

The family tree symbols were intriguing: "Male (Undead)", "Female (Undead)". A probability table for the "Transformed" category would be fun. I felt that the family tree diagrammed on the last page had more detail than I would care to record for my character. A less complete diagram with one third the names would be plenty for me, but doubtless others will appreciate this kind of detail. It made me think of the family tree on the wall in the home of Sirius Black in Harry Potter Order of the Phoenix. I liked the sample names; a large catalog of names like these would fit well and add a lot of value to the product.

I think the descriptions of each relative would work better if they were separated from the names and given labels that could be rolled in a table. You might try breaking up the descriptions into parts so that you can get more combinations in less space. Then names could be applied later. No matter how you do it, I think it will take a lot of space to provide enough possibilities to make the product reusable.

Thanks, and best wishes!

Dark_Mistress wrote:

Interesting. I have a player who has been looking for something like this but with random tables to roll up a background for his PC's.

Thanks for the input. I checked this board earlier today but did not have time to reply. I gave your idea of the random tables some thought and an addition of this might be possible... though at the time it would be more of an option to allow the fleshing out of the rest of the distant family members not covered.

In regards to wealthier bloodtypes, I'm wondering if notable servants should be detailed... any thoughts on this?

For nobles I think key servants should be listed as well. i mean sometimes for the wealthy the child spends more time with those servants than they do their own parents. Especially in the time DnD is set. Dad goes off to war or adventure gone for months on end. Mom off at the capital in politics gone for weeks or months on end.

But as the others said random tables would make the product a lot more useful. As it stands now it is a great one shot use product but after that loses a lot of usefulness.

Backgrounds and names are the hardest part of character creation for me. My most valued book has got to be Gygax's Extraordinary Book of Names.

So, this type of product could be very useful. As mentioned though, this is a kind of 'one and done' item. Great for a freebie, but not something I would want to pay more than a couple of bucks for.

Tables would be awesome, even if they are only d6 charts with the one result being, 'this family member is now deceased'.

Parents, Adult siblings, Adolescent siblings and Child siblings would be the most useful. With Aunts/Uncles and Grandparents being options worth considering. And I could certainly see the inclusion of significant servants for the wealthy.

I love the concept, but I'm not entirely sold on the product in it's current form.

Thanks for the input. I checked this board earlier today but did not have time to reply. I gave your idea of the random tables some thought and an addition of this might be possible... though at the time it would be more of an option to allow the fleshing out of the rest of the distant family members not covered.

Reading back through the posts, I see that you seem to be determined to do these as 'whole family' products. That's fine, but maybe you could include more than one in each product? If you could use each one a time or two before having to recycle it, that would be nice. Of course, as I said it also depends on your pricing plans.

To All... Thanks a ton for your help so far! The input is great, especially as we want to know what the customers would want/not want before we invest a great deal of time into the creation of more... especially if we decide to plug this as a priced product instead of a freebie (more on that in a bit). Disenchanter- Don't worry about sounding too harsh, this is exactly the sort of thing you want and you added great detail to explaining what you did not care for. A negative opinion with a worthy explanation is much more valuable to what we are trying to accomplish with this guildship venture than merely getting a one sentence praise that is vague as to why someone likes what we have made.

Now to the different comments/suggestions/etc.

1 shot use versus repeated use- that is something that I am struggling with myself. This first product actually evolved from something that I was creating at our gaming table a while back for my own character. I wanted to detail the family line of my character, who was a ranger hailing from a family of hunters, craftsmen, and farmers. The GM and myself discussed the value of such a product, and then I promptly had to put it on the backburner for about two years... finally, a creation somewhat like my original idea is in development.
I am at a bit of a crossroads here.... with the way that the descriptions are done now, there is a greater ability to add more flavor and story depth to the family members but it becomes somewhat of a 1 shot deal as far as usage. The idea of the random roll chart allows for much greater reuse but it kills on the ability for the writer to add a great deal of flavor.
BUT... I have an idea.... possible future additions will continue to follow a certain theme but may be broken down into two significant sections. The first will be a fleshed out family as with this product while the second will be a set of random roll charts and perhaps some blank family trees if someone wants to keep that aspect but add in the names their own self. If we were to go this route, do you think that A. it would allow the best of both approaches or not and B. would you want to see the family name of the fleshed out family included or left out (as it is right now)?

Family tree symbols for undead/transformation- I liked these as well and decided early on that the standard genogram symbols would have to be altered with the simple inclusion of a unisex symbol for the character (which I decided to make a shield). Since I was changing that much, I might as well add specific bits indicating undead (since they are not exactly dead family members), transformed family members, etc. These will probably change a bit (to improve the looks) as future parts are released.

The intro- we honestly hit a writer's block and I had to scramble to explain the concept in order to allow us to get the initial entry out so we could get this very feedback. That will be improved on definitely. And on a further note.... our software is working halfway correctly now and we've got bookmarks.... Hooray!!!

Changing bloodline to something else (probably Heritage)- I honestly dislike this more that I see it myself... so heritage it probably will be.... or perhaps lineage.

Price- We will probably make another one or two for free to help develop these more and get further input.... after that the amount that I'm thinking about will be in the $1 to $2 range, depending on the exact size. Initially, I was considering a $1 for a family but with the inclusion of the random roll charts for the second section, it is likely that the price may go up to the $1.50 to $2 range... but no more than $2. But, we may be able to keep things in the $1 perspective, especially if they sell particularly well. In the end, we are hesitant about charging much if anything because many of the members of Mossy Mountain Gathering want to keep this as more of a guildship hobby thing and less of a company issue. I myself feel very strongly about that as I have been a published game designer and writer for several years now and I don't want this to become another company venture for profit... I don't want to have to worry about who gets paid and keeping ahead in the money earning scene and what not... I want us to work towards making our products look and feel more and more professional as well as the general quality and depth of the product itself, but such things must be accomplished with in house efforts or cheap resources... no major investments. So, in the end, price is a lesser issue.... the greater issue is providing products that we our own selves want to add to our gaming experience.

Oddity of the first one- Yes, the first one did become a bit strange for the average peasant family, but I kept it as well because I didn't want the backgrounds of the other family members to come off as too bland... especially for our first release. So it is an "odd peasant" family I guess.

Okay. With what you present:

$1 to $2 is acceptable to me as the product is now - as long as it is a bit clearer what the product is. (I know you said that is being worked on, just being clear.)

If you include blank family trees, that price is just about perfect.

If you also include some randomising tables, I think it would be a great product. If I could reasonably get 3 or four uses out of it, I would even go $3 to $4. But that being said, I wouldn't be out to buy all of them. Just the themes that fit what I am looking for at the time.

And I vote for lineage. Heritage and bloodline bring different things to mind for me.

And finally, good luck. I respect the desire to keep it guildship. I've done "hobby" and community use projects before, and it is amazing what people demand for free... Try to keep your vision, and not allow the consumer to frazzle your nerves over it.

Lovely, a lost connection just ate my post. :-/

I think this is a pretty good buy for that price.

I don't think you should hardwire a specific family name to them, I prefer a list of options or nothing at all.

Okay. With what you present:

$1 to $2 is acceptable to me as the product is now - as long as it is a bit clearer what the product is. (I know you said that is being worked on, just being clear.)

If you include blank family trees, that price is just about perfect.

If you also include some randomising tables, I think it would be a great product. If I could reasonably get 3 or four uses out of it, I would even go $3 to $4. But that being said, I wouldn't be out to buy all of them. Just the themes that fit what I am looking for at the time.

And I vote for lineage. Heritage and bloodline bring different things to mind for me.

And finally, good luck. I respect the desire to keep it guildship. I've done "hobby" and community use projects before, and it is amazing what people demand for free... Try to keep your vision, and not allow the consumer to frazzle your nerves over it.

Thanks again for your comments and advice! You've given me an idea and I want to ask your further opinion on this if you don't mind.... as far as additional blank family trees... would these be good perhaps to add as a seperate pdf file or would they be better to add in the main product?

We are looking heavily at "lineage" now as another guild member mentioned this preference to me as well.

Yes, ther name is confusing when most customers will at least be familiar with D&D's Sorcerer Bloodlines. I almost didn't even look at this because I expected some kind of parody sorcerer option, definatly not my thing, but curiosity got the better of me. I like Heritage myself but Lineage is a good choice also. You could also do something like "Character Heritage: Peasant" So as to have a unified title with differing subtitles to identify the specifics. It would be easier to search for as well.

I just read it and thought I'd add my thoughts.

As a product that only adds flavor to a character this would appeal to certain types of gamers. It appeals to me, for example, but I don't think it would garner a lot of attention from about 3/4ths of the players at my regular weekly table. Many people would prefer to come up with this kind of background for themselves, at least for their own characters. Your work could be used as inspiration but I'm not sure many would adopt it completely. The writeup could be useful for a DM that needs to flesh out a family.

In the price range of $1-2 I might consider getting more mainly because I enjoyed reading it. I don't foresee much practical use for it for one of my PCs. As a DM I might drop this family somewhere when needed.

More on the 'bloodlines' name. I also thought it would be a parody on sorcerer bloodlines.

Hey Dave, the description says y'all are in the Appalachian Mountains. What area of the range? I'm down in Asheville NC.

I want to ask your further opinion on this if you don't mind.... as far as additional blank family trees... would these be good perhaps to add as a seperate pdf file or would they be better to add in the main product?

I don't mind, as long as you don't mind waiting for my screwed up sleep schedule to respond. ;-)

Either could work really.

The "big draw" to the Peasant sample for me was the tree. So I could be all for blank trees. But generic blank trees present problems, as you already are aware.

So I would toss out this suggestion.

One very generic blank tree. But then each product you produce has at least one blank tree with the very same format that the product used.

This way, true free form is available (but I wonder how you can really do a generic blank tree without the customer having some editing software) but customers have more specialized blank trees to adapt to their plans.

More on the 'bloodlines' name. I also thought it would be a parody on sorcerer bloodlines.

we will definitely be going with something other than bloodlines... most likely lineage... and I agree with your idea of making it something to the effect of Character Lineage: Peasants and so forth.

hallucitor wrote:

I want to ask your further opinion on this if you don't mind.... as far as additional blank family trees... would these be good perhaps to add as a seperate pdf file or would they be better to add in the main product?

I don't mind, as long as you don't mind waiting for my screwed up sleep schedule to respond. ;-)

Either could work really.

The "big draw" to the Peasant sample for me was the tree. So I could be all for blank trees. But generic blank trees present problems, as you already are aware.

So I would toss out this suggestion.

One very generic blank tree. But then each product you produce has at least one blank tree with the very same format that the product used.

This way, true free form is available (but I wonder how you can really do a generic blank tree without the customer having some editing software) but customers have more specialized blank trees to adapt to their plans.

On the note of the blank tree... I was actually thinking about this today and it wouldn't be too hard. What I could simply do is release a couple of bmp files... one as a blank family tree and the second as a set of the images to add family members... honestly, the initial layout for this is created in Paint... why not, its not a very graphical thing (one doesn't really need to say, have a 3d polygon family tree) and anyone with an idea of copy and paste and turning off the opaque for white should not have a problem doing this.

But we could also release pre-drawn family trees... even as seperate packs to be used with pre-existing and upcoming random charts for families.

Hey Dave, the description says y'all are in the Appalachian Mountains. What area of the range? I'm down in Asheville NC.

Southwest Virginia... in fact, of all the states that we are close to, the North Carolina line is the absolute quickest... particularly from my place out in the country... I can stay on backroads and reach the line in about 30 to 45 minutes. Maybe less on a good day.

To All.... a fellow guild member and I have been discussing the random roll charts and after a few roughs that I hashed out this weekend we've come to a solution that we are happy with as well. We will be putting together an initial version of this over the next several days and should have it available within a week or two.

We hope you will check out the new alternative... if this one is desirable then we will be creating variants of it down the road that are tailored for the specific family themes (the first will have a decent enough flavor potential with the random roll charts and listings but be mainly a basic, universal version).

Thanks!

By the way... the next file will also be a freebie as we are wanting to present it in the interests of the ideas that you the gaming community have given us and thus it should be openly tested for approval and further input.... thus free works best for that interest (and we like to do free whenever we can anyways).

Thanks again!

I think you should include a coupon for a free pizza

I think you should include a coupon for a free pizza

More appropriate would be a recipe for a peasant's stew, or perhaps shepherd's pie...

As to the product itself, I found the idea of icons for building a family tree to be a nice touch. It seems that your idea could easily be developed into a randomized list of names, traits, relations, and conditions that could be rolled for or chosen at the player's discretion. While I have no problem coming up with backgrounds and histories for my PCs, I could see that type of product being invaluable for gamers that have difficulty coming up with that sort of thing...or for a DM or player that needs one on the fly.

All in all, an inspired piece. Thank you.

tulip wrote:

I think you should include a coupon for a free pizza

More appropriate would be a recipe for a peasant's stew, or perhaps shepherd's pie...

As to the product itself, I found the idea of icons for building a family tree to be a nice touch. It seems that your idea could easily be developed into a randomized list of names, traits, relations, and conditions that could be rolled for or chosen at the player's discretion. While I have no problem coming up with backgrounds and histories for my PCs, I could see that type of product being invaluable for gamers that have difficulty coming up with that sort of thing...or for a DM or player that needs one on the fly.

All in all, an inspired piece. Thank you.

Thanks for the comments and good news... we are now working on the randomized charts!

More appropriate would be a recipe for a peasant's stew, or perhaps shepherd's pie...

I'm a blonde. Need I say more? ;-P

Shadowborn wrote:

More appropriate would be a recipe for a peasant's stew, or perhaps shepherd's pie...

I'm a blonde. Need I say more? ;-P

I love me a stew full of peasant and a pie full of shepherd! Taste a bit like pork, they do.

I was severely ticked when I took a closer look at the ingredients listing on Girl Scout cookies...the nerve! Talk about misleading advertising...

tulip wrote:

Shadowborn wrote:

More appropriate would be a recipe for a peasant's stew, or perhaps shepherd's pie...

I'm a blonde. Need I say more? ;-P

I love me a stew full of peasant and a pie full of shepherd! Taste a bit like pork, they do.

Eh... it depends really on how you field dress 'em and how long you leave them hangin' to cure....

To All...
Thank you for your input and also your patience. There's been a few delays, but the MMG Guild is now in the process of releasing Family Lineages: Human Villagers. This product is in response to what you the customers say that you want... there's random roll charts, blank family trees, and extended rules on creating families. We are in the process of working on an Elf edition for Family Lineages.

Best of all, this one is also free.

Look for its release very, very soon at paizo.com

I'd go with yes, include the servants. Well at least the note worthy ones.
Depending on what kind of world you're playing in, that taboo child born of lechery might end up the next ruler, in which case, it would be nice to already have a handy candidate for their other parent. Or perhaps there's a personal bodyguard, which they may consider practically like a brother. ECT. It makes it much simpler than having to decide who these people would be on your own.
Admittedly, it IS a lot more work to have to detail out ... But I know *I* for one would love having some basic frameworks for that sort of thing. All the better if it just needs fleshing out. ;D

<.< *goes to download and look over current book*