teddywolf's page

I'm just glad the Mac platform's been added, as a relatively dedicated Apple user.

Can I be in any way subtle when casting or do you have to go all out with movement and vocals for each spell? (Wizard and cleric schools must have some spectacular cheerleader competitions if that is the case)

Can a vocal component be delivered like a regular spoken sentence? If I have the spells vocal component as part as a password or other sentence can I then cast a spell without anyone noticing the vocal part?
Can I use surrounding sounds to mask vocal components, can I sit in a bar full of loud people and cast on someone the other side of the room without them noticing me?
Is it possible to hide somatic components? If possible in what ways? Up your sleeves, behind your cloak, as part of some other movement such as a dance etc?

Still and Silent spells are still the best ways for the job but there has to be some more mundane ways to do it even if they are not as surefire.
Sleight of hands to hide somatic components?
Can I mumble my magic words or just speak very softly?
Can I whisper the vocal components into a targets ear?

Also on a somewhat unrelated note, what skill would be used to sound like someone else, be it a specific person or just not yourself?

If you are using any v3.5 books, I suggest you look at Complete Adventurer. One feat in particular is good for anybody with Bardic Music, namely Disguise Spell (pg. 108). In short, when you are doing a performance, you make an extra Perform check that's opposed by other people's Spot checks for them to even notice that you are casting a spell during your performance. Even if they succeed on the spot check, they cannot use Spellcraft to identify what spell you're casting.

There's an additional feat, Subsonics, on pg 112 of the same book, that could work nicely in combination with Disguise Spell. To quote: "You can produce music or poetics so subtly that opponents do not notice it, yet your allies still gain all the usual benefits from your bardic music. Similarly, you can affect opponents within range with your music, but unless they can see you performing or have some other means of discovering it, they cannot determine the source of the effect."

In short, you have a performance so subtle that opponents don't notice it, which you then work your spell into, which opponents must then make a Spot check to tell that you are casting, but they can only do this if they can tell that you are performing. If you have a faceplate or a mask over your face, or maybe even a heavy veil, your opponents probably won't know that you're singing or storytelling.

To sound like somebody else, you'd probably want the Perform (Acting) skill. Bluff might work if you have some sort of magic disguising you. DMs choice there, really, but acting should always work.

Let me know if this is of any help.

Feat creepage has been a major problem with 3.5, not just the power in some of the late splatbooks but also the number. Some of the feats are really cool, but then suddenly the bar for being master of a weapon just got that much higher and will, guess what, suck up more feats.

I did a little DMing a few years back - badly, I'll admit. I did have a concept for extra feats on top of the basics, though: you could train for new feats or occasionally find them in magic items, a la the various books which give inherent bonuses to stats, or wish for them, or in rare cases get them through roleplay for feats that are based on character interactions, such as various vows from Book of Exalted Deeds. It would cost 5,000 gold per feat to find it in an item that would give you a permanent feat, but this number would be multiplied by the minimum level needed to get a feat times the number of prerequisite feats needed. Dodge, Power Attack, Combat Reflexes, those would all be 5,000gp. Mobility would be 10,000 - you can get is at first level but you need Dodge. A book that teaches you Spring Attack would be worth 40,000gp. You'd still need the prerequisites to get the feat.

I also envisioned a cap on how many of these bonus feats you could get, capped at the number of unrestricted feats you could have from level or other factors (being human, for example).

When the base book has over a hundred feats its already impossible to get them all. When every new splatbook introduces at least 20 new ones it just makes the system that much more difficult.

I have no problem with the multiclass feats as such, though some are far more powerful than others. I do have more than a small hint of Munchkin in me (alas), though I do enjoy roleplaying. But, there should be a means of keeping the clutter down. I did not like the way feats were put in to add new uses for skills when the skill should simply have been able to do that - maybe with a minimum number of ranks needed to do it. If you can have a prerequisite for a prestige class, why not a prestigious skill ability?

I would love to see feats arranged something like this:
Combat feats (for combat abilities and modifiers)
Skill feats (for feats that improve skills)
Metamagic feats (yeah)
Magic feats (for feats that require you to be able to cast spells - such as Spell Focus)
Racial feats (well, they kept putting them under General... frustrating!)
Background feats (which could include racial, I suppose... but based on character history, aka background)
Style feats could still be included in their own category, as they are very specialized feats.
If you want certain feats based on certain class-based abilities, you could keep their own category like in the splatbooks - Rage feats for Barbarians, Performance feats for Bards, Divine feats for Clerics and Paladins, Wild feats for Druid, Fighter feats for Fighters, Ki Feats for Monks and so on. Feats to improve the ancillary abilities of a class are excellent to have around. The question then comes up: why isn't there a progression for those feats in the class itself? Only the Fighter and the Wizard had that in original 3.5, and that's because the feats are the top ability of the fighter and the distinguishing ability of the wizard from the sorcerer.
I would love to see the cleric class, supposed to be the best at channeling energy, have a progression that gives them more versatility at doing so. Paladins could have a progression that could be used for channeling energy or improving their smite or perhaps their lay-on-hands.

Too late for this printing, but my thoughts on the matter.

The current Epic Level rules are a mess.

The way to make the game more mythic in scope is not to make it more bloated with math.

So if Paizo does an "Epic Level" book, it will probably be a complete re-do. With that in mind, I'm very curious to hear what people think about the idea of play beyond level 20.

What are you looking for conceptually?

What are you looking for mechanically?

If you're skeptical, what can we do that might get you to give this one a try?

Any deal breakers?

Epic, to me, means grand scope and breathtaking power in the concept. Characters will be going up against major powers and upsetting all sorts of applecarts whether they know it or not. The wizard whose magic is so strong she emits a wild magic field when she's not paying attention; the warrior who beats an incognito King's Champion; the thief who can hide in a brightly-lit bare room and steal the locked collar off a lord's pet pegasus; the cleric who talks to the dead as easily as to the living; the bard whose simplest melodies carry such meaning that the iciest heart melts.

Mechanically... well, the first thing I think needs be done is take out the mechanical line demarcating Epic from High Level. The ELH had a good number of feats with abilities that should be available to experienced non-Epic characters.

Having epic prestige classes are fine, but it might be an idea to simply have Epic abilities that any character can choose at each level - like feats but more powerful. Maybe that dwarf has such a strong constitution that he regenerates ability damage and drain without a cleric; maybe the wizard figures out how to cast a number of 1st level spells at will, and only needs the slots to memorize a few other spells. Maybe the thief even hits the supposedly-non-existant tricky spot in the jello mold he's fighting. Maybe the paladin or the cleric becomes a living font of positive energy. Maybe an elf gains truesight.

Making a proper Epic progression for base classes is also useful. Wizards and clerics might gain access to 10th level spells at 21st level, 11th at 25th and so on. Bards might have their own 7th level spells at 22nd level. Rogues might have Epic special talents.

The biggest thing I think needs to be changed on a mechanical basis are the magic item rules. There's the insane price tag for most any item, which keeps players from owning epic magic items and also makes it nearly impossible to craft anything epic in a short period of time. I want the chance to use a possibly very dangerous ritual to create an item quickly, or in fact invest part of my soul (such as XP or even on a level by level basis). Maybe each favorable factor allows it to be faster, such as the right phase of the moon, the right season, near a ley-line, a blood sacrifice, a host of people praying and chanting, a magician using the right sequence of spells. Some of the best magic items in myth and folklore gained power from prolonged use, true; but many artifacts are either created over the span of years or in the course of a day to a month, with powers far beyond mortal ken.

As a thought...
Possibly, if you do not meet the prerequisites for making a given item (non-trigger), instead of making the Craft DC based on the caster level you could make it based on the market value of the item. Say, a Craft DC of 10 plus (cost/1000GP, rounded up) if you lack the prerequisites, or (10 + CL) if you meet them yourself, or (10 + CL + modifiers) if you have others assisting you who fulfill your missing prereqs.

You could, thus, have a master blacksmith who makes a +5 keen longsword (he has Improved Critical, see), and the DC is 46 (10 + 36,000gp/1000) - tough job, but doable. He could crank out basic magic weapons easily, or spend long times working on total masteries of his craft.

I'll speak about magic items that allow somebody to make a single MW item in a single day another time.

In regards to the Perform skill, I think that as it stands it's a bit too focused. D&D 3.0 had a fairly good mechanic: you get one type of performance you're good at for each rank of skill you have in the class. Sure, it approaches a laundry list; but it makes it easier and also keeps down a little skill clutter.

I do not know why Spellcraft should not be folded into Knowledge: Arcana. It seems like it would be a subset skill.

I also don't know why Diplomacy and Intimidate should be separate skills. They are both used to influence people, after all, albeit in different ways - much like fire can be used to make a nice meal or burn up a nice chair. I'd be fine seeing an Influence skill containing both, and you can give racial bonuses to one use or the other, so particularly scary monsters like dragons are better at Intimidate, particularly charming monsters like most fey are better at Diplomacy.

This is short on flavor text, but the idea is to give the shield its due.

Shield Focus (Combat)
Prerequisites: BAB +1, Shield Proficiency

You are practiced at parrying with a shield, just as you are practiced attacking with your weapon. You gain an additional +1 to your shield bonus per attack you may make in a round. If you have a BAB of +12 and three attacks, you gain an extra +3 to your shield bonus.
Normal: You gain the listed shield bonus.

Improved Shield Defense
Prerequisites: BAB +1, Shield Proficiency, Shield Focus

You know how to apply your full skill to a shield. You may choose to subtract any amount from your attacks, up to your full Combat Maneuver Bonus, and add it as a shield bonus to your AC. This may work in conjunction with Fighting Defensively or Total Defense. This must be done at the beginning of your turn and lasts until the beginning of your next turn.
Normal: You cannot improve your defense with a shield more than anybody else.

Greater Shield Defense
Prerequisites: BAB +6, Shield Proficiency, Shield Focus, Improved Shield Defense

Your shield bonus improves your Touch AC as well as your normal AC. It still applies to your defense even against effects that normally disregard a shield.
Normal: Your shield bonus does not apply to touch AC.

Superior Shield Defense
Prerequisites: BAB +11, Shield Proficiency, Shield Focus, Improved Shield Defense, Greater Shield Defense

Your shield bonus, including all bonuses, is added to all defensive uses of your Combat Maneuver Bonus, including to avoid being tripped, grappled, disarmed and suchlike (yes, I know - it's not cleaned up, I'm not near my copy of the rules).
Normal: Your shield provides no defensive bonuses aside from bonuses to armor class.

Shield Ally
Prerequisites: BAB +4, Shield Proficiency, Shield Focus, Improved Shield Defense

You may subtract any number from your shield bonus and apply it as a shield bonus to a target (usually an ally) within your normal reach who takes up the same space or less. If you have advanced Shield Defense feats, they may be applied to the bonus granted. You must make this decision at the beginning of your turn, and it lasts until the beginning of your next turn.
Normal: Your shield bonus cannot shield others.

Shield Style
Prerequisites: BAB +3

Choose a class you have class levels in. If that class has a restriction to class abilities if you should use a shield, not including spellcasting, you may use a buckler and still maintain use of your class abilities normally unusable with a shield.
Normal: You don't use any shields if you want to use those abilities.

teddywolf wrote:

The idea is that they improve their skill and gain potent abilities with a bow. The Arcane Archer focuses on the bow and perhaps dabbles in other things.

The class could be scaled back from this, I suppose. I'd say remove the caster levels, if anything.

I put in the Archery Pool to put the class more in line with the base classes that have pools (such as the barbarian's Rage pool) and also to make the special abilities of the class... well, usable. As it currently stands it's not a very good class - I can't see why anybody would want to take Arcane Archer instead of continuing with Fighter. You'd be better with the bow as a Fighter.

What would you put in to make it even better than a Fighter with a bow?

That's the point to mixing in the magic. The Arcane Archer as it stands is not bad. The one thing it's missing is an advancement to spellcasting levels to make the Imbue Arrow feature more useful. Like I said, something like the Arcane Archer is intending to blend two different aspects (magic and archery in this case) into a system that works well together. An uber-archer that goes for being a more focussed ranged combatant than the Fighter through pure skill would be better dealt with through a separate prestige class (there were a couple of these in 3.X, but I'm at work without my books).

Well... see, sometimes class names don't always go completely hand in hand with what they actually are; the name is more flavorful. The Elemental Warrior (Planar Handbook) does not get a full attack progression and gains no weapon or armor proficiencies, for example. But I digress.

There are very few classes that could touch the fighter in Core 3.5 with their weapon of choice. Only certain weapons got anything remotely like a good prestige class. The bow was one of the best of the (bad) lot for prestige classes build around a weapon, and it really only had two prestige classes I can think of with any lasting merit: Arcane Archer, DMG, which was mostly lame; and Order of the Bow Initiate, Complete Warrior, which was for the most part OK and which will survive the transition to Pathfinder quite nicely IMO.

One problem with weapon-based classes has always been that they don't stack with Fighter for Fighter-only feats related to the weapon. To my mind this is ludicrous. I mean, yes, preserve the power of the straight fighter; but if somebody is uber-specializing in a weapon doesn't it make sense for them to be able to get, say, Weapon Specialization?

In olden times, long before pen-and-paper RPGs, there used to be a progression to delineate how good somebody was at a trade. The breakdown was something like this:
Neophyte - barely understands the trade or how to do it. Example: me with web-page coding.
Apprentice - has a basic grounding, can do some simple items well. Example: George W Bush, President version 2008.
Journeyman - has a solid grounding, can be the tradesman for an area in that field and provide good service, though likely not exceptional. Example: my company's network system guru.
Master - aside from the honorific given from student to teacher, who did not have to be an actual master of the craft, this denoted great skill, somebody who would be actively sought out for their abilities in preference to most others. Example: Steven Brust, Author (seriously, go read him).
Wizard - a very rare title, given to somebody whose wares/skills command respect anywhere by anybody who has even the slightest inkling of who the craftsman is. Example: Kurosawa, filmmaker.

I only bring this up because you can put the Arcane in the Archer without spellcasting, simply by making their abilities so good as to be mystical - even make them somewhat magical in and of themselves.

I can see this being a bit too much. The Arcane Archer is a warrior who combines ranged combat with magic. I can see a lot of your special abilities (Dextrous Shot, Melee Bow, Adjust Pull) being more in line with someone who improves their archery with raw skill, but not someone who dabbles in two different fields. Not only would it make the class overpowered, but it makes less sense than even the current abilities the class has.

About the only part of your abilities that I'm in complete agreement with is the +1 caster levels.

The idea is that they improve their skill and gain potent abilities with a bow. The Arcane Archer focuses on the bow and perhaps dabbles in other things.

The class could be scaled back from this, I suppose. I'd say remove the caster levels, if anything.

I put in the Archery Pool to put the class more in line with the base classes that have pools (such as the barbarian's Rage pool) and also to make the special abilities of the class... well, usable. As it currently stands it's not a very good class - I can't see why anybody would want to take Arcane Archer instead of continuing with Fighter. You'd be better with the bow as a Fighter.

What would you put in to make it even better than a Fighter with a bow?

I have a proposal for Arcane Archer, open for discussion, that I think might be of the general flavor of the base classes. Apologies for formatting.

Arcane Archer

Elves are known as being masters of magic, nature and the bow. While all elves know how to use the bow, the Arcane Archer goes from mastery of the bow to outright wizardry, performing feats that even the most dedicated non-Elf archer can only dream of achieving. Rangers and Fighters are the most common members of this class owing to their ease of meeting the requirements, but any class can manage if they desire. Multiclass wizards who don't mind slowing down their magical progression find the class particularly appealing.

Requirements:
Race: Elf or Half Elf
Base Attack Bonus: +6
Feats: Point Blank Shot, Precise Shot, Far Shot, Weapon Focus (any of shortbow, longbow or greatbow, including composite versions of each)
Skills: Craft Bow 6 ranks
Special: Must have made a masterwork bow and used that bow in combat.

Class Skills: Intimidate, Knowledge (arcana), Knowledge (nature), Perception, Stealth, Survival. (2 + Int) Skill Points per Level.

Hit Die: d10.

Progression:
Level Fort Ref Will Special
1 +0 +1 +1 Enhance Bow, Archery Pool, Bow Skills, Bonus Feat
2 +0 +1 +1 Enhance Arrows, Melee Bow, +1 caster level
3 +1 +2 +2 Enhance Bow, Dexterous Shot, Enchant Bow
4 +1 +2 +2 Enhance Arrows, Bonus Feat, +1 caster level
5 +1 +3 +3 Enhance Bow, Adjust Pull
6 +2 +3 +3 Enhance Arrows, Extra Shot, +1 caster level
7 +2 +4 +4 Enhance Bow, Bonus Feat
8 +2 +4 +4 Enhance Arrows, Bullseye Shot, +1 caster level
9 +3 +5 +5 Enhance Bow, Refocus Arrows
10 +3 +5 +5 Enhance Arrows, Bonus Feat, Extra Shot, +1 caster level

Enhance Bow: At first level the Arcane Archer can enhance her personal masterwork or better bow to fire as a magic weapon with a +1 enhancement bonus. This bonus improves by +1 every two levels after first, to a maximum of +5 and ninth level. If this bow is destroyed, she cannot enhance a new bow until the next day during magical studies and preparation. This bow only works as a magic bow for herself. The personal bow of an elf deity the arcane archer worships may be enhanced at any time as a swift action.

Archery Pool: The Arcane Archer gains a pool of archery points that can be used to a variety of special effects. She receives her Dexterity bonus +2 points at each level. She cannot use more points in a round than her class level, but she can apply multiple abilities to a single arrow within this restriction. She gains one ability at first level, then an additional ability every odd class level after:
Far Shot (1) The archer may make a single shot to maximum range with no penalties for range. Precision damage like sneak attack applies at any distance.
Exact Shot (1) This arrow automatically confirms all critical threats.
Attach Spell (1) The archer may attach any spell she has ready with a range other than Personal to an arrow. The spell is centered on who or where the arrow hits instead of its usual center. The shot and spell take one standard action.
Seeker Arrow (3) The archer may shoot and have the shot go around obstacles, even around corners. This shot ignores all cover short of total cover and all concealment.
Hidden Arrow (3) This arrow is unseen except by creatures with blindsight, see invisible, true seeing or a similar effect. A target unaware of the arrow is flatfooted and loses its Dexterity and Dodge bonuses to AC. In addition, firing this arrow does not break somebody's Stealth or any Invisibility effect that would normally be broken by attacking.
Phase Arrow (5) This arrow will go though all cover except force effects and ignores all armor, shield and natural armor bonuses that are not force effects, although other sorts of AC bonuses are still fully effective. It also functions as a ghost touch shot.
Arrow Pulse (5) As a full round action, this arrow attacks all foes in a straight line, 5' wide, for one range increment. If a spell is attached to the arrow, it affects each enemy hit by the arrow, although area spells only affect the targets and not their usual area.
Arrow Storm (7) The archer may, as a full-round action, fire one shot at each enemy she perceives within one range increment of her bow.
Deadly Shot (7) This arrow is an automatic critical if it hits.
Death Arrow (9) This arrow slays its target unless the target succeeds at a Fortitude save of (10 + class level + Int bonus). The target does not need to be subject to critical hits but does need to be alive. This is a death effect.

Bow Skills: The Arcane Archer continues proving her mastery with the mundane skills of the bow. Her Arcane Archer level stacks with her level in Fighter for determining her extra attack and damage bonus with bows only, as well as for any Fighter only feats that relate to bows.

Bonus Feat: At first level and every three levels after, the Arcane Archer gets a bonus feat. These feats must come from the Point Blank Shot tree, the Weapon Focus tree (for bows only), or be a combat feat specifically applied to use with bows.

Enhance Arrows: At second level the Arcane Archer enchants every arrow she fires from her personal bow. She makes her choice during magical studies and preparation time and may not change it until the next day. While her arrows are not magical, she may add a +1 bonus ability to her arrows. Every two levels after she may add better or extra abilities, adding a +1 bonus to what her arrows may have as an enchantment. She may not enhance her arrows in ways that are opposite of her alignment, nor two conflicting alignments - a Neutral Good archer could have Holy plus either Axiomatic or Anarchic but not Evil.

Melee Bow: At second level the Arcane Archer knows how to use her bow in close quarters. She may use a bow in melee combat without drawing attacks of opportunity. At sixth level she threatens all squares around her with her bow, having an effective reach of 5' and providing flanking at that range. At tenth level she has a 10' effective reach.

Spellcasting: At second level, and every even class level after, the Arcane Archer improves her spellcasting in one class, but does not gain any other benefits of higher level in that class. If she has no caster levels, she gains spells as a wizard.

Dexterous Shot: A third level Arcane Archer adds her Dexterity bonus to damage rolls with her personal bow. This bonus damage cannot damage creatures immune to the Rogue's sneak attack.

Enchant Bow: At third level the Arcane Archer can make magical bows and arrows as if she had the Craft Magic Arms and Armor feat. Aside from basic enchantments, she can only add abilities for which she has the appropriate spells or has the appropriate Arcane Archer ability from the Archery Pool.

Adjust Pull: At fifth level the Arcane Archer can adjust the Strength pull of her personal bow as a swift action.

Extra Shot: At sixth level the Arcane Archer can fire an extra arrow at her full base attack bonus when making a full attack with her bow. She gains an additional arrow at tenth level. These extra attacks stack with Rapid Shot and Haste.

Bullseye Shot: At eight level an Arcane Archer can, as a standard action, fire a shot against her target's touch AC instead of their full AC. (This can only be used once per round)

Refocus Arrows: At ninth level, once per day an Arcane Archer may spend 1 hour to change the enhancements on her arrows.

The critical feats bother me.
I'm not so bothered by the effects but the comparison to certain spells not quite right. Polar Ray may have no save, but it is subject to SR.

I think perhaps a better approach could be taken by making them fighter talents, say gotten at 1st level and every 5 or 6 levels after that. I would further suggest fighters get Maneuver points.
The way I think it could work would be: the ability triggers automatically on a crit. Alternately, before an attack roll is rolled, the fighter can spend a Maneuver point to say "I'm going for a Blinding Critical". If the attack misses, the point is wasted. If the attack is a crit... well, I'm torn on giving the fighter the point back or saying it's still spent.
You could also include one additional trick:
Spend 1 point to automatically confirm a crit (spent after rolling the attack). This would give the axe and pick wielders more versatility.

This way the abilities are built into the class, are still nifty, and can still be restricted by level.

I do have one other point: somebody with the Mettle ability would still reduce the tough critical abilities from Still A Penalty to No Penalty with a successful save.

I love the new Duelist.

I play a Dervish (Complete Warrior) and after reading the new PRPG Duelist, I was hard pressed to decide Dervish or Duelist. Upon taking a very close look at both classes, both are almost EXACTLY on the same power level.

This has further convinced me that all the Complete Books need no power adjust, and that PRPG Beta is directly importable in any 3.5 campaign as-is.

I think the first three complete books were a bit less powered than the latter 5, although some of the classes in Complete Adventurer were a bit weak except in theme. The ones in Scoundrel, Mage and Champion were generally quite powerful (Ultimate Magus? Spellwarp Sniper? Paragnostics?)

I have not slogged through the 1000+ posts on this topic.

My thoughts on the Paladin:
Lay on Hands should remain a separate ability from Channel Energy. If you link them, this begs the question of why Clerics don't lay on hands.

I do like the notion of a Paladin having very limited Favorite Enemies of Evil Outsider, Undead and Evil. This is not currently implemented. It would perhaps trod on the Ranger's toes a little, but not necessarily too much.

I like the Weapon Bond ability.

A Paladin having Mettle seems appropriate.

My biggest beef with the Paladin from the beginning of D&D is that the class, in my opinion, should be a bastion of Good as opposed to a bastion of Lawful Good. Hear me out: form follows function. The Paladin has plenty of abilities against Evil, as well as plenty of spells. The class has only a few spells relating to chaos and absolutely no special abilities against chaos. This was true in AD&D, AD&D 2, D&D 3.0, D&D 3.5, and is still true in Pathfinder.

The change would mean they may disagree over the means to the end, but they agree on the end. It is a very strong feeling on my part.

I would suggest that the Paladin is allowed to associate with evil characters when undercover or when trying to turn somebody to Good. Those would be two valid reasons for such an association - he would highly disapprove of the actions of the evil one but would try to moderate their attitude by example and soft words/gentle persuasion/lectures/hanragues/etc.

I do not think the Paladin should have access to Fighter feats, as they are not as devoted as Fighters to the arts of fighting. Let the fighters stay the fighters. I do think that the AC bonus fighters get might be in order, to represent their excellent defenses.

My last note for now: many others have referred to the caster level for Paladins (and likely Rangers in similar threads). I do think that the Paladin should get access to spells at a lower level and should have their caster level be their class level. They should be tertiary spellcasters at best - the cleric, druid, wizard and sorcerer are primary, the bard is a secondary - but they should be good at their very limited spell list.

See the problem is if all those things are fulfilled then people start saying, "that's too munchkiny!"

I wouldn't want all of them in a single class. It would be entirely too munchkinly and detract from roleplaying.

However, what about a 5 level prestige class that requires a couple of perception-boosting feats, maxed out Sense Motive and Perception and is focused on exceptional senses as opposed to combat, magic or general skills?

How about a Shadowdancer who actually dances around? And, maybe, doesn't suck?

Maybe a racial prestige class for each race, as opposed to just the eldest (Dwarf and Elf)?

I do love the classic types. Assassin was a core class in original AD&D.
I'd love prestige classes that allows characters (at high level) like Quai Chiang Caine (Kung Fu and Kung Fu: The Legend Continues) who is somewhat of a monk with magic and highly sharpened senses; the Dread Pirate Wesley (The Princess Bride) who is a strong fighter/rogue combo; or Sherlock Holmes, the consummate detective and fully-versed warrior.

teddywolf wrote:

I want a prestige class focused on channeling positive or negative energy in powerful ways.

Oh yes, I want a Prestige Class that goes one step further, and *replaces spellcasting* with a channel energy mechanic. X channelings per day, usable in a wide variety of ways, to heal, to smite, to buff, to put up a protective barrier, etc. Instead of 'praying for spells' like a lame divine wannabe Wizard, the channeling priest will call upon her faith to repel the evildoers or bolster her allies or smite the unrighteous, right at the moment she needs that assistance.

She gets a ton of channelings per day, and that's all she does, channel the power of her faith, and, as levels accrue, she learns new ways to channel her faith (to buff allies or ward away evil) with the very base abilities being channeled healing and channeled smiting.

That would take the 'Cleric' in a sexy new direction that feels more like a 'priest' from fiction, raising their holy symbol and radiating an aura of faith, and less like a fighter/magic-user hybrid with some healing spells.

Channel Energy refers to Positive/Negative energy channeled by clerics and paladins. I don't want to see it made as versatile as spellcasting. I just want to see it expanded.

I look at prestige classes from several angles.

As a sometimes-munchkinly player who thinks in crunchy terms I think prestige classes can add some extra heft in 3.5 - and I say this as somebody who has come up with optimized builds without using optimizing boards, some of which seem to beat the boards by what my fellow players tell me. The ones I've seen so far in Pathfinder... not so much aside from the Eldritch Knight and Dragon Disciple. The Shadowdancer, Loremaster, Arcane Archer and Arcane Trickster are mostly unchanged from their counterparts in 3.5 DMG.

As a very occasional DM, prestige classes allow the players to be uber-munchkinly and crunchy, which can detract from the roleplaying and can make posing challenges tougher. I enjoy it when they use the class to enhance roleplay.

As a player who enjoys roleplaying, some classes add more potential than others. The Pathfinder and the Dragon Disciple both have very good roleplaying hooks and character development.

I view prestige classes as being a way that a character becomes an exemplar/guardian of their race, a way to represent their status in a prestigious organization, or a way to show that their character has focused on some aspect to become truly deadly in that aspect. It can be some combination of the three as well. On the whole I like them, even as a DM.

What do I want?
I want an archer who makes you think of Legolas in the movie trilogy of the Lord of the Rings.
I want a Dwarven Defender who is truly considerably more dangerous than a highly-trapped and defensible section of defensive castle wall.
I want to see prestige classes that advance all different kinds of abilities from base classes, not just Fighter BAB or rogue sneak attack or sorcerer/wizard/cleric spellcasting.
I want a prestige class with senses so acute they have true seeing and blindsight unless put into total sensory deprivation.
I want a prestige class focused on channeling positive or negative energy in powerful ways.
I want a prestige class that makes Favored Enemy into an incredibly dangerous weapon, or offers wider categories or Favored Enemy.

I would have said I want to see a new class that progress bardic music properly, but the Pathfinder Chronicler is a very worthy addition to that - even if hobbled by a loss of the most powerful bard spells.

I think the Power Attack and Combat Expertise feats, among others, being limited by stat is not very helpful. While there were definite cases for abuse under 3.5 with Power Attack I would say they were uncommon. Pendulum swings by definition go too far, and this is a pendulum swing.

At the same time, having individual feats that change AC to damage, BAB to damage, AC to accuracy, Damage to accuracy, Damage to Attack Bonus, AC to Attack Bonus... it's a mess. It gets even messier when you add in special effects like poison. For example, what powerful poison-relying monster wouldn't want to guarantee a pinprick attack that kills the wizard with Constitution damage?

There's the additional delineation of ranged attacks and melee attacks when it comes to this. Again, it's a mess.

I would suggest three sets of feats:
Power Strike, which allows you to trade accuracy or defense for a damage bonus, capped; Improved Poweful Attack, which allows you to mix and match and removes the cap.
Aimed Strike, which allows you to trade damage or defense for an attack bonus, capped; Improved Precision Strike, like Improved Powerful Attack, above.
Defensive Strike, which allows you to trade damage or accuracy for a dodge bonus to AC, capped; Improved Defensive Strike, like the other two Improveds.

In real combat, you frequently balance your defenses with your offense and your striking power.

I would further suggest that classes with a full BAB get at least one if not all of these three feats regardless of meeting prerequisites. Barbarian would get Powerful Strike, Ranger would get Defensive Strike, Paladin would get Aimed Strike, and Fighter would get all three. That, however, is optional.