Kbold Chieftan

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Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber. 23 posts. 1 review. No lists. No wishlists.




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Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber

I have a concern with regards to the mythic resilience ability that is available to mythic NPCs. My concern is that it could make casters almost useless as debuffers and battlefield controllers at high levels due to Mythic Resilience on all three saves effectively shutting down casters as if all their spells had the incapacitate trait.

Imagine this. You're a party of level 11 PCs and you're a caster. You're going up against a mythic creature that is PL+2 with all three mythic resilient saves. A level 13 creature's low save is a +20, and as a level 11 caster you likely have a spell DC of 30 at this point. This pretty much means that the only way that the creature can fail a saving throw with their weakest save is for them to roll a 1. A caster should not be struggling this hard to hit the weakest save of a PL+2 creature.

Suppose though that we should instead be judging mythic casters by their mythic spell DC. In the case of a mythic 11 caster, they would have a mythic spell DC of 36 if they spend one of their mythic points. In that situation, the chance that that same creature gets a failure on their save would be 30%. It is as if you're targeting the low save of a creature that is PL+4. Even with mythic points and mythic DCs in play, casters seem to struggle way too much to target even low saves of PL+2 mythic creatures.

If we go up to level 20 mythic PCs, a mythic 20 caster would have a spell DC of 45. With mythic DCs in play, that would be 47. A PL+2 mythic creature with all three mythic resiliences has a low save of +33. Without mythic DCs, the only way the creature can roll a failure in their weakest save is to roll a 2 or less for a 10% chance of failing. With mythic DCs in play, the creature would have to roll a 4 or less for a 20% chance of failing with their weakest save. In this case, it'd be like targeting the moderate save of a creature that is PL+5.

This seems incredibly unfair to any class that relies on DCs to do their main thing, particularly casters, kineticists, and toxicologists. It shuts down an entire playstyle for casters and restricts them to being buff-bots. Classes like kineticist cannot utilize feats that use their Class DC and pretty much are restricted only to making elemental blasts. Toxicologists cannot use their poisons at all.

Is this the intended design? If so, is PL+2 meant to be the new PL+4 in mythic games? Or is there something I'm missing here? Because so far, mythic resilience seems to make high level mythic games feel horrible to play in for anyone that isn't a martial. Some party members would just not be able to contribute effectively in fights at a certain level.