h4ppy's page

Hi. It's been a while!

Just thought I'd drop by to say that somebody at my local board game club pointed me in the direction of the app and I'm mighty impressed. Dropped the cash for the full bundle and can't wait for the full release and a bit of polish to knock of some of the bugs.

And then I look forward to seeing the adventure paths I haven't played through yet appearing in the (not too distant) future!

It looks gorgeous, the extra dialogue is well done and it plays intuitively enough.

Well done to the whole team!

The wiki is an important first step. The QR codes come later (if at all).

As I've said many times before, I think a wiki would help enormously to both (a) clear up and organise rules and errata and (b) provide a place for more detailed back-story and plot.

Even if you want to lock it down and only give access to people that have bought the physical game that would be possible too - you'd need to put a unique code into each box then people could register for access and redeem the code.

If there was no Mammy Graul in this scenario, how would it work?

I think it would go something like this, but would be nice to check I've got it right!

Before the encounter: Roll d4 -> get a 4 -> Ogrekin is going to the bottom of the deck after the encounter

Encounter: Defeat Ogrekin -> He is considered "defeated" but his card trumps the general rule to banish cards so you put him on the bottom of the location deck.

Attempt to close the location -> If you succeed then the location deck (exc Villains) would be banished, including the Ogrekin

Seoni's one of my favourites. She leads out my party of 6 characters so gets the guaranteed extra turn from the holy candle.

Here's how I play her:

1) Card feats were Spell, Spell, Blessing. Next one will be another blessing. Have discovered that too many spells dilutes her ability to exlpore quickly so maybe should have gone Spell, Blessing, Spell instead.

2) Powers were +1 blast and recharge arcane item. +2 blast would have been equally valid. I was too scared to give her 7 cards before, but probably will next time I get a power feat.

3) Skill feats: CHA, CON, INT in that order.

4) Spells: Attack spell, Glibness, Augury, Strength/Speed, Second Attack spell (in that order). Don't forget to cast Glibness before your first explore!

5) Items: Holy Candle, Masterwork, Sihedron

6) Allies: Father Zantus, Shalelu (the archer, have I spelled that right), two others that give her extra explores.

Seoni is going to cycle her deck. Really fast. And need some healing, probably more than once. Lem often hands off the staff of minor healing to her for this purpose.

Seoni can blow up almost anything - she's a better fighter than Val in many ways, even when using her power instead of a spell card. BoPharasma is very handy too - BoP played by any character + Seoni discards any card = 3d12 + 1d6 + 4 = KA-BOOM!

The Sihedron is your get out of jail free card, but I haven't used it since I took it. Nice to have it there, though!

Seoni can explore really fast (often 3-5 times per turn if you don't find too many monsters that burn up cards), so you want her to be able to acquire whatever she finds. When she finds blessings or allies they give her even more explores... A good hand with Augury gives her a fighting chance of closing almost any location in one turn.

If you can pick up spells early in the scenario do so - gives her a lot more hit points and lots of options, even if you don't plan on keeping any of them.

Don't forget that other characters can give her stuff, but it's tricky to do so since she's often standing in a closed location (since she explores so fast)!

Note: I play Seoni in a 6 character group. Strategies for smaller/solo play will require completely different builds.

Awesome - thanks for the link.

So the answers are:

A1) No, you cannot close the location, since the location deck is not empty. It still contains one "phased out" card as Mike put it.

A2) N/A since you cannot close the location. However, if you closed the location through some other means (e.g. defeating a Henchman/Villain) then I think my original answer would be correct, i.e. the card "phases back in" as the top card of the closed location's Location Deck.

A3) my original scenario is incorrect. A location cannot be closed whilst there is a still a villain in its deck so this will never happen. (If you try to close the location then all the cards in the deck will be banished except the phased out villain, at the end of your turn the villain will become the entirety of the still OPEN location's Location Deck)

If you haven't read the Scenario card "Them Ogres Ain't Right" and the Villain card "Mammy Graul" from Hook Mountain then be warned... there are spoilers below...

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So... in the rule book it says:

Rules: The Golden Rule

If a card and this rulebook are ever in conflict, the card should be considered correct. If cards conflict with one another, then Adventure Path cards overrule adventures, adventures overrule scenarios, scenarios overrule locations, locations overrule characters, and characters overrule other card types. Despite this hierarchy, if one card tells that you cannot do something and another card tells you that you can, comply with the card that tells you that you cannot.

Now, Them Ogres Ain't Right is a Scenario card so it trumps almost everything else.

There are several times during this scenario that you have to summon and face a henchman (Ancient Skeletons and a Bandit are almost guaranteed). I just finished playing it and also managed to find Zombie Horde and Skeleton Horde barriers.

Q) Should the Summoned Henchman be placed next to the Scenario card?

Just for kicks I decided to say that they definitely ARE. I also, long ago, decided to ignore the rule about ignoring summoned cards above the card limit, so used some dice to keep track of the number of henchmen defeated during the scenario so I didn't run out of Skeletons or anything silly like that.

As a result I had a count of 24 Henchman cards the first time I (finally) found Mammy Graul in the eighth location... and 27 Henchman the second time we fought her.

Valeros dealt with the first encounter with his trusty Glaive. Lem helped out with Poog + Zarongel (2 dice + 3) + singing a rousing ballad, Harsk added a Blessing of Lamashtu and others chipped in too for "7d10 + 1d4 + 8 + re-roll once if you fail". No problem :)

The tricky thing now was that the villain was now shuffled into the woods, so couldn't be sure who would find her and time was running out.

On the 29th turn, Seelah had the pleasure of finding Mammy and THAT was (finally!) a villain fight worth having! The game was 6-character solitaire and Seelah had "5d8 + 1d6 + 4d4 + 11 + 1 re-roll if you fail the first time". Managed to get 51 on the first roll which just over the 46 needed to win.

Two and a half hours well spent!

First of all, thank you for posting an intelligent question after researching this area yourself. It's great to answer questions from people that have taken the effort to find things, but still come up confused!

So, for example, I am currently playing with Lem and the weapon he has is a heavy crossbow. He gets 1d8 +1 for Dexterity and the weapon adds 1d10. If a blessing is played on him, he must add a second d8 and cannot choose to add a d10 instead. Is this correct?

Yes, this is correct. The blessings always add whatever the die of the skill set in the first action of the "attempt the check" step. I think you've figured this out already from your reading around the subject?

You definitely do NOT get to choose what die to add and do not just add the highest die you can!

E.g. if you have an ally that adds 1d10 to a perception check, but your character's PERCEPTION skill is 1d4 then you currently have "1d4 + 1d10". If you then play a blessing it gets you to "2d4 + 1d10".

Why was it reworded? I think the rewording is to address cards like Wand of Force Missiles (to which blessings add extra d4s). It is a little cumbersome and, personally, I think it could be more clearly written. Maybe third time lucky? ;)

I think your suggestion is ok, but note that you've put a mention that "the character must already have an appropriate skill to make the check". This is not actually the case. You can always choose to roll 1d4 for a check (e.g. Valeros can always attempt an Arcane check, he just rolls 1d4).

As a final note I think it IS over-powered to let the players choose which dice to add. In the perception example above it would change it to "1d4 + 2d10", ie. move the average result up from 10.5 to 13.5.

Side note: snake isn't very good for a druid, they don't have the Melee skill, so it defaults to a d4... Snake makes it 2d4, effectively. I would rather just roll a d10 (by discarding a card).

+1 for this :)

Now, if they were trying to find that elusive tiger I would have more sympathy!

Didn't expect to find such strong feeling about that one!

The comment about gaining popularity was because somebody (on another thread) mentioned it as a valid variant and it was nice to see something I had thrown out there (on BGG) coming around back to me with a positive spin on it.

FWIW, I almost always play with six characters and always use the variant mentioned above. It's never been a problem and the worst we got hit was 1 card per character. It's amazing how many locations you can close when you are incentivised to do so!

Although you have a certain amount of time pressure when exploring with more characters, you also usually find a fair amount of loot. The aim of this variant is, for those that wish to do so, to provide an in-game risk to the otherwise painless (except for the real-world time cost) of exploring with no regard for the task in hand.

If you want to push the limits and explore a bit more than you think is 'safe' then go ahead... but know that there's a risk that the villain's plans will come to fruition and you'll drop a few items being chased away before you can regroup.

It's optional, it's a variant, it works well in my limited play-testing and several people have told me that they enjoy using it. That's rewarding enough for me!

You rebuild your decks after the scenario then try it again. You do not need to restart the adventure and you do keep things you found in the failed scenario.

If you think this is too easy then my variant is gaining in popularity :)

My variant is: after a failed scenario each character should banish one random card for each unclosed location. E.g. if there are 3 characters and you run out of time with two unclosed locations left then each character has to banish two random cards from their 'pile' (deck, discards, buried cards + hand) before rebuilding their decks.

Sorry to drag this thread up again, but the recent rules clarifications have stated that ALL damage from monsters is "combat damage" unless the monster card says otherwise.

That changes the Q&A from the OP to:

Q1) If I choose to fight the Spectre using Wisdom, does this count as a 'combat check' for any purposes? (For some mystical reason, since it's 'against' a monster)

Q2) By extension, if I fail the WIS check, can I use armor, Bracers of Protection or anaything else that reduces *combat* damage?

Q3) Can I use the Sage (recharge to add 1d6 to your noncombat Intelligence or Wisdom check) to add to this check?

Q4) Can I use Sheriff Hemlock (discard to add 1d6 to a combat check)?

My best guess at the answers is:

A1) No
A2) YES (this is changed)
A3) Yes
A4) No

If there is anything else that's changed let me know!

Try it a different way: In all currently known circumstances, MELEE is a sub-skill of STR (for those characters which have MELEE on their character cards. The others just use 1d4 which is not based on anything).

When you test your MELEE skill, you are rolling your STR die and adding your MELEE bonus. It's a Melee check but you can also play any boon which boosts a Strength check. For the purposes of Gorum it is a STR-based combat check and you get two dice.

When you use the Longbow you have a DEX-based combat check (RANGED is a sub-skill of DEX in all known cases) but then add a Strength die as a bonus. It's not the basis of the check (which you chose in the "Determine which die you're using" action of the Encounter resolution). As such BoGorum would only add one die to the check.

For all sub-skills you have to remember the following:

- if a sub-skill is not written on your character card then it has no parent skill for you. E.g. If Lini tests MELEE it is 1d4 with no 'parent'. (Maybe she is using her charisma to get the foe off-guard, then 'kick him in the nads', rather than her strength... but whatever she does she isn't very good at it and only gets 1d4)

- if a sub-skill is written on your character card then it has a parent skill as written. This relationship exists for your character in the way it's defined on your card. (E.g. Seoni's ARCANE is based on her CHA, Ezren's ARCANE based on his INT)

- each check has one 'base' skill. It's the skill/die you choose in the "Determin which die you're using" action of the check.

- if you're testing a sub-skill written on your character card (i.e. you chose this as the basis of your check) then you can play cards/powers which boost either the sub-skill or the parent skill to help you out.

I hope that helps!

Note that some of the banes also have the Basic (and Elite) traits - so they will get removed at some point.

...I Binged PACG cards and got a small glimpse of a few cards in future packs which got me excited again to be part of this from the beginning...

I had to think twice about what "Binged" meant. Then I figured it out. I never thought anybody actually used MS Bing!

Glad you're enjoying the game and we're all waiting (not so patiently) for Skinsaw to drop. Very soon. Hopefully...

Speaking of which... when's the app version out ;)

The only justification I've seen for having the space for the boxes is that you have to completely banish some cards (back to their boxes, so they're not in the game at all any more) as you move through the AP. E.g. once you get to Scenario #3 you completly banish (out of the game) any basic cards that are banished by a game effect.

Having said that, I'd much rather just have bigger spaces for the card types and some dividers to separate out 'in game' and 'out of game' cards!

@Mike - I think the problem referred to is mainly the cards that let you defeat/evade/etc something (i.e. the whole 'implicit you' conversation from the Thieves' Tools thread).

These cards say something like "Discard to defeat a barrier". They do not say "Discard to defeat your barrier" but they are actually limited to only being played by the player doing the encountering.

I understand the rationale behind this but it's a common mistake made by new players (and otherwise experienced ones) and in direct contradiction to the rulebook's wording that 'cards can be played any time unless they say otherwise'.

These cards do not explicitly say otherwise unless you understand that the wording actually means "Discard this card to allow you to defeat a barrier (that you are personally facing)".

Is there any chance of an official wiki being created for this game?

That way each card could have clarifications and errata in one place (that's quick and easy to find on a phone/tablet whilst playing) and people could even have a space to discuss tactics relating to certain cards and share stories of their adventures, like "The time we found a Bunyip in the Apothecary and blew up its tank with a Blast Stone".

It would also give both official and unoofficial sources a place to create and share back-story relating to each card, location and scenario.

Pretty please with chocolate sprinkles on the cherry on the ice cream on top?

There are lots of questions around about when certain cards can be played and when certain things happen.

To try and address these and summarise everything I've learnt so far, I've made a first attempt at a timing structure document and posted it on BGG:

http://boardgamegeek.com/filepage/95118/turn-sequence-breakdown

I've probably made some mistakes, but the doc is based on my current understanding of the rules. I hope that people can take a look at the doc and comment here or on BGG to provide feedback so I can improve it further.

Over to you to take it apart!

(P.S. I now understand a bit better the complexities faced by Mike, Vic and the Paizo team in writing a succint, comprehensive and entirely correct rules document!)

Hi @cmastah - welcome to the wonderful world of PACG :)

1. Each character can use one of each type of boon and each of their powers once to help a check. E.g. play one legal spell, one item, one blessing, etc. However, the boons you play have to be legal to use in that situation. E.g. Harsk has a power that you can use to help characters in combat at different locations, Valeros helps people fighting at the same location.

The spells you mentioned CANNOT be used, because they say "your combat check". (@OberonViking - it's not because they have the Attack trait per se). However, you CAN use spells like Strength (if it's a check related to STR), Aid, Guidance etc.

2. If the creature has a combat check listed (not all creatures do, e.g. the Siren can only be beaten with Wisdom) then you can use any legal combat power. Seoni's power is a combat power so you use "1d12 + 1d6 + 2" and try to beat the Goblin's "Combat 9".

Note that this power of Seoni's CANNOT be used to pass an Arcane/Charisma/etc check. It can ONLY be used in Combat, even though you end up rolling your "Arcane die" for the combat check.

3. Yes, you can still use Melee even without a weapon in hand. (Imagine that they always carry some small weapons on them if it helps, or that they're really good at wrestling!)

4. Yes - take blessings from the blessings timer (or the box if you defeated the villain), shuffle them up then place one card onto each open location. Then shuffle each location that had a card added to it.

5. No - you just lose the cards and cannot 'activate' them in any way.

This game already take a VERY long time to set up (and tear down). Longer than Mage Knight in my experience, especially if you play with different groups and have to rebuild character decks as well as building then shuffling 5, 6, 7, 8 location decks.

If you really want to theme the decks then nothing is stopping you from extracting relevant monsters/barriers from the deck (you can use the traits to do this) and then randomly choosing from them.

But to impose this upon all players... please no.

As an alternate, you could put the token cards in some of these: http://paizo.com/store/byCompany/l/litkoAerosystems/stands

Or use my awesome standees ;)

http://boardgamegeek.com/filepage/94381/pacg-standups-with-scaled-mirrored- characters

@h4ppy

How is that consistent. in the first example a die is just a piece of plastic, in the second example the die is the skill (die plus modifier).

You are also asserting that things happen in certain phases while the cards make no reference to what phase they take place in. With the vague meaning of the word die you can make several cards fit into either step 1 or 3 (I can post examples when I get home and can look through the cards).

No... in all three cases the die is just the polyhedron. And in all three cases you still get to add all your bonuses for the skill being tested after you've rolled that polyhedron.

Lets see if there's a way I can share my enlightenment :)

For each check you need to pick ONE skill, and one skill only that is the basis for the check. This is done in step (1) and the party may play one card to change what skill is being tested. You then play cards to boost this skill and/or your ability to pass a certain type of check (e.g. some cards boost COMBAT checks but don't care what SKILL you're testing for the combat check, as alluded to by QuantumNinja in his most recent post).

Lini: You may discard a card to roll d10 instead of your Strength or Dexterity die for any check.

To me, this means, in long-hand: "When you are performing a check where the base skill is Strength or Dexterity you can change the physical die that you roll for that skill to 1d10 instead of whatever it normally is. As usual, don't forget that when you get to step 5 add any bonuses you have which affect that skill."

Sajan: When you attempt a combat check without playing a weapon, you may use your Dexterity die instead of your Strength die ([ ] and add the Magic trait) ([ ] and the Fire trait).

To me, this means, in long-hand: "When you face a combat check you can choose to set Dexterity as the base skill for that check. This means that you may play cards to boost your Dexterity to enhance this check (and cannot use cards that only boost Strength). Since it's still a combat check you can still play any cards that apply to Combat checks. When you assemble your dice pick up the physical die associated with Dexterity (either as printed on your character card or as improved by the cards/powers you played on this check). As usual, don't forget that when you get to step 5 add any bonuses you have which affect Dexterity."

Seoni: "For your combat check, you may discard a card to roll your Arcane die + 1d6 ([ ] +1) ([ ] +2) with the Attack, Fire, and Magic traits. This counts as playing a spell.

To me, this means, in long-hand: "When you face a combat check you can choose to discard a card to set Arcane as the base skill for that check. This means that you may play cards to boost your Arcane to enhance this check (and cannot use cards that only boost Strength). You may not play another spell on this check since this power counts as using a spell. Your attack gains the Attack, Fire and Magic traits. Since it's still a combat check you can still play any cards that apply to Combat checks. When you assemble your dice pick up the physical die associated with Arcane (either as printed on your character card or as improved by the cards/powers you played on this check) plus an extra 1d6. As usual, don't forget that when you get to step (5) add any bonuses you have which affect Arcane and add in the extra feats from this power if you have achieved them."

In other words, they're all consistent and work in exactly the same way. It's just that Lini's doesn't let you use a new skill for a given check but Sajan and Seoni's do.

Mike Riley 302 wrote:

Sajan can play any number of Blessings on HIS combat check. So, Myriade, you are correct.

Hmmmmm... I'm still a little confused on Sajan's "Play any number of blessings on a combat check" card.

So let's say I have several Blessing of the Gods cards in my hand and I am fighting a Scout monster.

I'm unarmed so I use my Dex d10+2 for starters. I then discard a Blessing of the Gods for an additional d10 (which I get to recharge instead of discard). I did not play a SECOND Blessing of the Gods card from my hand because pg. 15 of the rule book says, "Each Player may play only one of each type of boon on a single check."

Thus, my final combat roll on the Scout was 2d10+2 and not 3d10+2. Did I do that wrong?

Sometimes Sajan has 2-3 Blessing of the Gods cards in his hand at a given time. If I get to pile all those blessings on combat rolls and always recharge them, Sajan seems unbeatable.

Am I missing something?

Thanks in advance for the wisdom +2,

Ben
BensRPGPile.com

There is a "golden rule" which means that the rulebook is just the starting point for what you can and cannot do. This is true of most card games with varied cards that do interesting things.

THE GOLDEN RULE

If a card and this rulebook are ever in conflict, the card should be considered correct. If cards conflict with one another, then Adventure Path cards overrule adventures, adventures overrule scenarios, scenarios overrule locations, locations overrule characters, and characters overrule other card types. Despite this hierarchy, if one card tells that you cannot do something and another card tells you that you can, comply with the card that tells you that you cannot.

This means that Sajan can play any number of blessings on his combat check and recharges them all. He's only marginally less tough than Chuck Norris.

OK. Just when I thought this was clear in my head I went to sleep. And after sleeping on it I have come up with something slightly different...

Here's the new thought process...

Encounter resolution follows these steps:

1) Determine the Skill You’re Using
2) Determine the Difficulty
3) Play Cards that Affect Your Check and/or Use Characters’ Powers [that Affect Your Check]
4) Assemble Your Dice
5) Make the Roll
6) Take Damage, if necessary
7) Resolve the Check

In step (1) you need to fix which 'stat' you're testing for this Encounter. E.g. if it's an unarmed combat check your choices are, by default, "Strength" or "Melee".

Some cards may allow you to replace the required skill for a check with a different one; you may play only 1 card or use only 1 power that changes the skill you are going to use.

During this step the party (you or another character) can play ONE (character or card) power that makes a new stat (or stats) eligible for this situation, and you must then choose one of the stats from the power played. E.g. Seoni's power lets you choose "Arcane" for a combat check.

Step (2) is straightforward.

In step (3) each character may play one of each type of card and may apply each of their character powers once, provided that the chosen power makes a difference to the stat you've already chosen. E.g. if Seoni used her power, you can only play powers that affect/improve Arcane. During this step you cannot play random cards like Cure since they are not relevant to the encounter (before my first game I wondered how 'healing during combat' was prevented and this is the key).

Players may not play cards at this time unless the cards affect your check; players may not play cards that modify a skill unless you’re using that skill, and players may not play cards that affect combat unless you’re attempting a combat check. If a card states that it is immune to a particular trait, players may not play cards with the specified trait.

For step (4) you assemble the physical dice determined by the Skill you're using and the powers in effect.

In step (5) you roll the dice, add them up and then add ALL (fixed number) bonuses that apply to the skill being used and/or the check itself. In other words Lini does still get to add her strength feats after using her 1d10 Strength power. You then compare your total (dice + bonuses - penalties) to the check level and pass or fail.

Steps (6) and (7) are fairly straightforward. After step (7) is completed you then roll any checks to recharge cards used during the encounter, each one having its own, isolated, check. You do these in any order you wish until there's nothing outstanding left to check.

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So, to summarise...

the answer to my question, after all the comments above, would seem to be that a 'die' is a 'die'... it's easy when you know the answer :)

The bonuses/feats/etc are not part of the DIE. They are just added in step (5) if you used the related skill for the check.

This reverses my assertion from my previous post:

Having voiced my opposition to your opinion on that part of things, I must say I totally agree with you (having played the game again tonight) about "Skill die" meaning "the physical die you use for a given Skill plus all bonuses". This means that Lini's power is slightly worse but that's the way it is.

This is not the case. I now believe that a "Skill die" means just that... the physical die you use to test the given Skill.

I would now explain Lini and Seoni's powers as follows:

Lini: "You may discard a card to roll d10 instead of your Strength or Dexterity die for any check"

This power is played in step (3). It changes Lini's Strength/Dexterity die to a 1d10. Whichever skill is chosen still gets to add its feats and other bonuses in step (5).

So if Lini has (and uses):
Strength: 1d4 + 2
Animal Power: "You may reveal an ally with the Animal trait to add 1d4 ([x]+1) ([ ]+2) to your check."
Bear strength power as above

When doing a strength check without using any powers she would get to roll: 1d4 + 2
With using both her powers she would swap the physical die for 1d10 in step (4), add an extra 1d4 to the pool for step (4) and also get an extra +1 bonus from the animal power's feat in step (5). She ends up with 1d10 + 1d4 + 3

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Seoni: "For your combat check, you may discard any card to roll your Arcane die + 1d6 ([ ]+1) ([ ]+2) with the ... traits. This counts as playing a spell."

This power is played in step (1) and lets her choose Arcane instead of Strength/Melee for the combat check. It also prevents her from playing any other spells for this check.

In step (4) she assembles 1d12 + 1d6 for her dice.

In step (5) she adds +2 (her bonus for testing Arcane). If she has any relevant feats they would add more bonuses here.

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OK, that's got to be right this time. Surely?!?

Well, at least until next time...