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A few things:

Man In Black; I think there is some mis communication. Out of everyone in the party I have not shined. I have good mid ranged stats and a build designed to be a tank but that is about it. Mostly everyone else has 16 in their main stat. The most powerful character is the +4 LA dwarf barbarian. All in all the group is far from weak.

Concerto; No, the DM pretty much forgot about the powers I have. He wanted to have it be a per day limit instead of what it is written up as. But then again I have not used any of my abilities the past few games because of different issues. But I will and see what happens.

Sean; Thank you a lot. You bring up big points and I realize that. Now I just have to do the duty I designed for myself. You are right. Bad rolls are bad rolls. I have gotten some good ones but that is neither here nor there. Just means the dice are random.

Anywhos thank you all and have a wonderful day.


Thank you. I will drop a line after the Ren Faire this weekend. All are welcome to come sfrenfair.org. Also waiting for Boarders to bring in my copy of Pathfinder. Just a little wait at a time. Anywho ty agaim


Good points but I am not the main damage dealer in the group. In fact the dwarf with the +4 LA does way more damage. As a quick stop the DM had us roll our stats, 4d6 drop lowest reroll 1's and 2's. My stats came out as 15 Str, 14 Dex, 15 Con, 14 Int, 12 Wis, and 15 Cha. So my stats are above average but no 18s. I am mostly the tank of the group trying to do trip attacks and such. Have had bad die rolls with weilding any weapon while doing a strike, though i get good rolls with using unarmed/spiked gauntlets and my secondary weapon.

I think once we get out of the modual and not follow pre written session things will smooth out. Though now I am unsure if I bring up to them DM the fact that the dwarf is a +4 LA. I know the player really like his dwarf but the LA will hurt him as we will hit levels 5-6 quickly while he bearly will hit 3. Of course the DM can rule it void and do what he attempted to do with my crusader. Make powers have a limit. Again thanks all.


Hi again. It seems either everyone got their answers or people have not had time to log in to post. So are there still Pathfinder people looking for another player or even to do a play by post game? Thanks again.


Greetings all. New poster here and love all I have seen so far. Now I got a small problem. I game with a group of friends on friday nights. There are six of us then the DM. We are nearing the end of the Sunless Citidal modual.

So far things have been ok. There are times I have to leave early and I miss out on some fights but that is not the issue. See I am playing an optimized human crusader. I had asked the WotC Char Op board for help and they helped out a whole lot. Thin is when I used any of my abilities they seem lackluster to what everyone else does. I used strikes and been in stance yet doing more by just attacking.

I know everyone has bad luck with die rolls so it is not so much that. Just seems I optimized my character enough that it may be overkill. To finish the party's makeup we have an elf sorcerer who is a pyro (which means one fireball is availible he is taking it) with combat casting feat, halfling rogue with lightning reflexes feat, half elf cleric with extra turning feat, half elf bard with with one the dual skill boosting feats (I think persuasion), and an orecutter dwarf barbarian (A +4 LA race from races of faerun).

So my question, after the wall of text, is can optimizing a character be more of a hinderance then just making a character based on how you role play?

Thank you.

P.S. I know about the Stormwind Fallacy and I am not debating it. Role playing vs crunch is not the problem. It is more of is the extra cruch of being optimized more trouble then any old way of making a character?


Hey all,

Santa Fe here. Just joined Paizo after a friend told me about Pathfinder. There is a gaming group here in the capital city. My friends in Amtgard run it. We meet on friday nights from about 7:30 to when ever, I usually leave by midnight but the group plays longer. Feel free to hit me up if you wish to know more. We are a friendly group.

We play 3.5 and, well honestly I am the only one who optimized my charcter but the group has super dynamic. If you do not mind silliness we have a lot of fun. Anywho Super to see New Mexico people gaming. Hope you all have a lovely week.

PEACE!