Roget Thesaurii's page

I am running the Tyrant's Grasp AP and I have a player who is stretching my adaptability and acceptance of her character build.

The PC initially created an Inquistor (Witch Hunter archetype) of Gorum. Not exactly Gorum's focus, but her backstory let me justify this, to an extent. I still had issues with her basic disregard for how poorly Gorum and the archetype fit, but I was willing to be understanding and give her time to round out the character. That did not work out.
Without discussing it with me, she opted for an Inquisition over a Domain, and chose the Spell Killer Inquisition. This gave her a very powerful build from the jump.
In my opinion, the inquisitor is a hunter of enemies and heretics of the faith, and Gorum has little to no interest in hunting down spellcasters, per se. Cowards and those who avoid or object to battle or who pervert the 'purity' of battle makes FAR more sense.
In addition, as a spell caster herself, in a party that is made up of spell casters (bloodrager, oracle, paladin, wizard, inquisitor) she could not justify her lack of focus on the other party members (or herself) as a caster, either in-game via RP or in discussions with me outside of gaming sessions.
She is combat focused (makes sense for Gorum) and her RP adheres to a worshipper of Gorum, but her abilities and build do not reflect this.
I could have worked with her, but a review of her character sheet at 5th level revealed she had given herself extra feats (two, one combat and one extra teamwork), super nice (and expensive, unaffordable) starting gear, and extra bonuses to stats (initiative, attack and damage, AC) which she could not explain, except as 'an accident'.
Rather than drop the inquisition (my only request) for either an appropriate one, or an appropriate Domain, the player completely abandoned the Inquisitor class and rebuilt as a fighter to keep the Gorum-related combat feats they'd chosen (after reducing them to the correct # of feats).
She declared the Inquisitor archetype/class weak and ineffectual without the Spell Killer inquisition.
I'm staunchly against retraining, but I am trying to be adaptable here, so I am letting the player simply switch out her levels to facilitate this update.
Does anyone have any suggestions as to how to moderate this person? I feel like abandoning the class bc you lost access to your RP-inaccurate, non-GM Approved ability is petty and in poor taste. However, its my first time GMing the player and I don't want to alienate them. Had they not been so egregiously built, I might have been able to come around, however with no effort on her part to justify this with RP and backstory development I just decided she couldn't have that Inquisition.

I'm getting ready to launch this as well and was going to do the same thing since it worked quite well when I ran Rise of the Runelords. I was planning in addition the primary NPCs, to have secondary and tertiary NPCs. With the secondary NPCs having full names, personalities, and a generalized description. Then for the tertiary NPCs I was going to rely on a table to pre-generated names, descriptions, and character traits that I was going to put together as needed dependent upon the behavior of the PCs.

My GM asked us to all work up a handful of low level NPCs each, so the 5 players (original party, up to 8 folks now) each made 4 NPCs, generally commoners or experts, between lvl 1 and 3. The GM added names to them when we encountered them. It made it more personal for us as PCs when 'one of ours' was taken down in the AP somehow (random encounter, AP thing, etc). My character has now developed a secret romance with one (who is the father of her as-yet-revealed pregnancy) her besty is another and several more (notably the children. Each PC made one child NPC) are her constant worry. How many 6 yr olds you think are walking around Golarion with potions of healing and such? Cuz all 8 of ours have a CLW and a Hermean Potential (CL5 for both)... Having the PCs take creating a few of those NPCs off your plate as a GM is invaluable as a time saver. And it might make them more inclined to care about them as individuals as opposed to a number (oh, we lost three refugees vs that giant anteater? Oh well, down to 37 refugees now, vs: The anteater trampled Seth, Geary and little Shawna, always by her dad's side. Oh no!)

It sounds like you're in Book 3: Assault on Longshadow, so at least you can buy things. The Frontier Healer trait certainly improves your cure spells (and healing hex by my interpretation). Still, in-combat healing is a last resort; you don't want to be spending too many of your actions on it.

Sleet Storm is good for countering archer troops. You should take the Toughness feat, if you haven't done so already, and buy a Belt of Mighty Constitution. False Life is worth considering. I also recommend getting an Aegis of Recovery — you find one earlier in the AP, but my Shaman has gone through two or three of them (we're now in Book 5).

If the other players are complaining, ask them why they aren't throwing around fireballs or healing people!

I am indeed in Book 3. My little Communist Witch has a real nice side when it comes to her fellow refugees but she's about as coldly evil as they come with regards to hobs at this point. The illusionist gnome DOES throw fireballs and we picked up a PC with cleric levels so my in-combat healing has come down to emergencies (excess bleed dmg on an injured character between me and certain doom, for instance) but he stays invisible a lot, which witches do not get as a spell option. Toughness is on my list of feats, just got shoved aside at 9th for a healing feat for outside combat (I can treat deadly wounds as a full-round action instead of an hour, do not require a healing kit, and can treat someone multiple times/day rather than just once. Average hp returned is around 20-30. Its great post-combat). Due to s%#$e hp rolls party-wide the Belt(s) of Con have gone to the party muscle. Got a Dex belt atm. Am I missing something with the shield stuff and witches? Had a recommendation to get myself a mithral buckler as well. Does the Aegis not act as an actual shield? Don't I need shield proficiency?

"Curse spells heal less than an average enemy does as average damage per round. You're using your actions to remove the effects of half of what an enemy did with their action."

I took a trait within the AP that allows me to add my level to a cure spell I cast, meaning at 5th level, my minimum healing for CLW was only 2 below the MAX of most casters at the same level. I'm a wicked awesome healer with the healing hex, too. My healing in a fight comes after stuff like 'The main party fighter takes a giant crit and a hefty damage attack from a mounted warrior and his mount. With bleed (from the crit) he will fall within two rounds. No one else can take these kinds of hits (as a party we have rolled low for hp, except the gnome illusionist).

I have been heading in the 'clouds' direction (stinking cloud, Obscuring mist, Euphoric cloud, etc), as I got the murksight hex, so I can see through even magic clouds. But my party b&%#%es about not being able to get into melee with their enemies. They dont get that this is my only/best means of defense. My witch does fly, but that has made me a target of the archers. Ironfang introduces a 'creature' called a troop. Imagine a 'swarm' of medium creatures. They love to target me when flying. As a standard action they are getting 4! Reflex sv for half effects each round on me. More than half the party has evasion so by now they know its pointless to fire at anyone but me. 4 saves a round, even when I get them all, adds up quick in damage.
My healing in combat is usually my hex, but I have done emergency healing to keep people in the fight. My signature spell is Ill Omen, so I am adept at nerfing hits on my guys (Accursed Glare and Pugwampi's Grace are good followers along those lines). They just want to see me throwing fireballs or super-healing them when they make bad combat decisions, never mind that witches don't get fireball and my character has half the hp they do, so rolling up next to a creature that just dropped them in 1 round and then demonstrating that I can keep enemies alive is a bad recipe. Thanks for the advice. It sounds a lot like the direction I was already heading. My party can b~!*& as much as they want... I'm trying to stay alive...

I am playing a witch in the Ironfang AP. I played the role of party healer early on, and with a dhampir in the party I had to spend some of my learned spell slots on cure spells on both sides. My role now is more battlefield control. The problem is, as an arcane caster AND a healer, I'm a double target. Witches don't really have all the flashy escape spells of wizards, or the awesome defense spells of clerics, so I'm getting pummeled, a lot. Poor hp rolls has made this more than problematic. What items/spells might you suggest to help minimize my being targeted/aiding in my evasion/defense? My fellow PCs don't seem to get it when I REPEATEDLY explain "I am not a wizard! I don't do that!".

we be goblins too, #4. Well done sir! This is being kind for kindness sake. Good luck to all and congrats to winners!

1) I love the rogue. They have aways been my favorte class. THief, rogue, backstab, sneak attack. Whatever.
2) When it comes to combat, the fighter, generally speaking, always wins the "who creates the most carnage" competition. HE"S SUPPOSED TO! He's the FIGHTER, emphasis on the part "fight".
3) A full attack round for a rogue is only 1 attack until 8th level at best, where a fighter has had it for a couple levels and is soon to the level he gets three, without going TWF.
4) SA in the flank exists because SA is a representation of the damage someone SPECIALLY TRAINED in jabbing weak spots for maximum effect doesnt have your complete focus. He doesnt have to stab you in vital spots, he knows how to sever that muscle in your arm so you defend less effectively with it, how to slash open a veign in your leg so you bleed to death slowly standing on your own two feet.
5) ANy rogue who runs around with a two handed weapon for the extra damage deserves the quick death he invites. Rogues, especially at low levels need to take that nagging voice in the back of their mind that says to charge into battle and murder it silently. ROgues are used for that sudden spike in damage as the "little guy you ignored the first couple of rounds of combat" suddenly hands you your spleen on the end of his dagger. If you want to charge into combat and slash wildly about, dont be a rogue; its not what they do.
6) Yeah, I could slaughter a 10th level 5 man party with 4 4th level rogues jumping them. But I dont beleive for one second that all 4 rogues are walking out of that alley. Hell, if the fight goes poorly quickly, I may not even scare your party let alone murder any of them, but thats dice falling
7) If your party cant handle two first level rogues at first level without someone getting killed, maybe it was/is a badly-manned party. That happens. Ever seen a party of all fighters? WOnderful at combat, they crush all kinds of things. SUck at nearly every other aspect of the game. Charm wizard and one surprise round, especially if he has a good initiative, and they are done for. Balanced parties excel. If they cant handle stealthy, give them at least a couple of levels to fix it. they will, belive me.
8)Hope some of this helped. I just couldnt sit idly by while my favs were maligned for doing what they do best. HAve you played CoT AP? If you fear what rogues can dish in damage, I do not reccomend it. My party was well-suited for it and we feared lower level rogues in combat with us pretty much throughout the entire AP. And yes, I was the rogue in the party.

I have been dm-ing for over 20 years. Sometimes you have to TPK the players before they remember you are not "on their side". In this adventure path my players have been forced to run from these trolls twice, other trolls once before (they were only two at the time, and both only 4th level. It cost them their mount and supplies as they fled their camp to get away) and other monsters have beaten them senseless and driven them off. They are 20-plus year gamer vets themselves. I can be a kind and benevolent dm, but usually I am not. Let them die, because you gave them plenty of outs, but make sure they learn from it. Their next set of PCs will likely be more defensive and cautious. The nature of this AP sometimes almost demands that type of party. If they happen to not get killed, they will surely find another place to die. SUch are adventurers...

Name:Momas Thagnum
Race/Class:1/2 orc druid 6
Adventure: Rivers Run Red
Catalyst: PC overconfidence
The Gory Details: Once my pc's found Hargulka's stronghold, they figured they were sneaky enough to make it up to the door without being seen. The druid and the witch both appeared as animals, the ranger and his animal companion and the rogue were all pretty sneaky. They didnt take into account that trolls eat EVERYTHING. Animals are on the list. The trolls waited until the pc's entered and immediately attacked. The druid, backed by an invisible rogue, charged up the stairs to the tower to dispatch the sentry there. Waving around a flame blade is a sure-fire way to get a troll's attention. Not a good idea, but a good way to get attention. He got it alright. A claw/claw/rend/bite flurry from one troll left the druid in pretty rough shape. Halfway through the attack routine from another troll, the druid was at -26 and his body was hurtling down the stairs to slide in a bloody smear across the room. The invisible rogue wisely held his AOO as the trolls passed him on the way down to grab their "snack". Without any fire or acid and with VERY limited healing, the rest of the party fell back and were chased by trolls until night fell. Wisely, they decided to avoid frontal assault on the second try and kept up the stealth, quickly dispatching lone trolls until they reached Nagrundi. He was still a solo encounter, but the other trolls knew the players were there by then and they attacked as soon as Nagrundi stopped twitching.
My players are 20 year veterans and they still sometimes make what I consider rooky mstakes. Its all those years of play. Sometimes we "Fat Beards" think we've seen it all and can handle anything the dm throws. Often, we end up rolling up a new character.

My pc's took care of gregori so fast it wasnt funny. They walked back into town the first day he started disturbing the peace and trumped his "the pc's are off galivanting and not taking care of the people" by showing up with the little lost kid from the quests inside the back cover of Rivers Run Red, having rescued him and then force-marched themselves home, sans spells for the witch and with single-digit hp left for the ranger, without a rest to get the kid home safely. Gregori had so little time to rile up the crowd that it took little to convince the people he was creating problems without a foundation. By the end of his first day in town, Gregori was walking back to Pitax, stripped and whipped, with splinters in his bum from being "run out on a rail" by the populace. No taxes and a strong economy go a long way to keeping a populace loyal.

I am the dm of my kingmaker campaign and with only two players its been interesting. The 1/2ling ranger is the baron and he's adopted every animal he's come across (the trapped thylacine from Stolen Lands is his animal companion, both the owlbear from the Stag Lord's fort and the baby giant one at the end of Rivers Run Red are currently being trained by him for war and guarding and Crackjaw the turtle currently makes the castle moat a dangerous place to swim). He's a ranged specialist and he's the "normal" one. His wife is the 1/2 orc witch (animal patron) Symantha. She has a bite attack, hair that attacks and a centipede animal companion named darren. I've seen her beat a hill giant with his own club with that hair, rip out a tatzlwyrm's throat as it tried to kill her in its coils (she criticaled it and hit it again as it tried to flee from her-because she nearly killed it with the crit- and critted AGAIN!) She even joined the hag cultists for a while.
The nation's leaders are oleg and his wife (treasurer and high councilor) Jhod (high priest), Akiros (warden), Khesten (general), Lily Teskerton (spymaster), Tiressia (dryad druid, marshal) Melianse (nixie, magister) Horace (royal assassin, a human rogue and cohort of the 1/2 orc witch. Both my pc's took leadership to get a party of four. The ranger had a druid named Momas Thagnum with a constrictor snake animal companion named Huggins. He charged into a troll lair waving a flame blade. Almost made it a full round when he slammed into three trolls solo. Now he's forest compost. These days its a blind oracle who gets to be the grand diplomat) and my Pc's are the rulers.
Its a true neutral nation called Elken and the capitol is named Sabretown (we are using variations of the names of towns in our state. WV represent!) that has no taxes, accepts anyone until they prove to be a liability and generally lets "live and let live". Even the boggard and the Sootscales (sans the shaman) get a pass. The boggard watches the swamps and the Sootscales represent the nation's mining contingent.
We just got through with the main villain of the Varhold Vanishing and it was AWESOME! I love it when my pc's think they may have to flee and the monster is thinking the same b/c he is in as rough a shape as them. Well-done with your villain, Greg A. Vaughan! He made my evening.
I saw a post where someone asked if anyone managed to get e certain hill giant on board, as it were. Mine did, sorta. They managed to intimidate him into co-operating and sent him on a will-o-wisp hunting expedition. He did WAy better than they did. But when he didnt find moonshine-making berries he came looking for them and smashed into their town. The local inn the pc's built that month is now called Munguk's End. Take a wild guess why...
I am wondering how other dm's work aroud "good rolls" for the event phase. Almost nothing bad ever happens to the nation. Its all the time with good weather, food surpluses, economic booms and twice they have had outstanding successes. When I do get a "bad roll" for the event, they have always handled it easily and well. Minimal damage from monster attacks and disasters, easily capturing the flamboyant thief, etc. I kinda want to see some tough times for them, but I also dont want to be the dm who screws over his pc's just to screw them over. Suggestions are appreciated.