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Milo v3 wrote:

Realname wrote:

Spellcasters will always be the powerhouses in d&d, the fighters should be able to compete with weapons of tremendous magic. In 1st edition, belt of giant gave the fighter the strength of a titan (or cloud giant). Here is another example.

Assuming the fighter had a Strength of 20 before putting on the belt, a belt that put his strength to that of a storm giant would cost 225,000 gp, which would take basically all the money of a level 15 fighter. If it made him as strong as the weakest titan it would cost 625,000 gp which would take basically all the money of a 19th level fighter.

Pretty sure the point of the rant intentionally ignores the book value of these items Milo. He's trying to address a problem in the system, problems in a system are seldom fixed by operating within the rules of said system. Just look at American Politics :P

That being said such flat 'increase strength to X' items favors characters who can do great things using abilities OTHER than Strength. It's the wrong solution, but thinking outside the box is how we find solutions.

Yep, that's what I meant. Like maybie the belt of storm giant might give more strength, and cost less.

Also (someone pointed out) that the vorpal weapon still exist. Yes, but in 1st edition, the head was not severed on a 20, but on a 17+ if the sword was a +3 sword, and on a 15+ if the sword was a +5 sword. So yeah, this magical property has been nerfed.

(Granted, this was super powerful.., but so is the spell Time Stop from the wizard side.)

Hi there, I am a fan of 3.5 but only recently subscribed to pathfinder website (paizo).

I don't like some of the new features of the pathfinder fighter to start with, any fighter type should be allowed to move at max speed with a full plate.... so there, there's already a problem here.

Now as for the fighter and D&D, the aim of the fighter imo should be what Gary Gygax did with him in the first edition of D&D (his game).

1- Be the hardest to kill at low levels in a party
2- have some of the best weapons and magic items at high level to compete with magic users

1- dunno if pathfinder rules allowed that because I am new to pathfinder, but with a d10 hit points and full plate, it should be alright to survive better than a wizard, to begin with. Also more often than not he should carry a shield, and sometimes a tower shield for "moving concealement".
2- the fighter at high levels probably needs even better magic items. Gary Gygax gave him in D&D 1st edition the Vorpal sword, essentially a good chance to instantly kill his opponent. This item was erased/changed in 3.5 edition (or 3.0 already). Spellcasters will always be the powerhouses in d&d, the fighters should be able to compete with weapons of tremendous magic. In 1st edition, belt of giant gave the fighter the strength of a titan (or cloud giant). Here is another example.

Now that was my short answer to this thread - From what I have read though, the fighter just needs several books to compete, one day someone will make a compilation, hopefully!