Nightfox's page

I have some 26 x 32 conferencing grid paper (stuff for stand up easels) that I made my maps on, using other 8x11 paper tossed on to simulate the fog of war. Mostly, each of the level maps can be split into a North and South section. I draw each starting at the north and south and work my way to the middle. The middle section then duplicates on each map giving me encounter space I can play in until I need to switch from north to south section. This way my double map is never all on the table, just the large half section the party is in.

If you count things out, 32x26 x2 with middles overlapping works for s decent number of levels. Once things got to big I then taped 2 sheets together to make 40x32 x2 maps with duplicated middles. This even helped me increase the space of the map dimensions to account for the 7 person party I'm running.

Needless, I now have a large roll of maps.

Hunting grounds is next, and I will probably just make that into sections, use some generic maps, theatre of the mind and what ever else to get through that huge level

Nightfox

Having a good ticketing system is wonderful. I can see peoples point about the forum being more open and communicative and email in the past being horrible (because email is the oldest thing there is on the internet). But a good ticketing system should get rid of the bad parts of email, help keep track of things better than a forum, which is not designed for support. It will also allow for reference, accountability and tracking.

We will miss some of the interaction on the CS Forum, but not necessarily the things like "This book was missing" and "Order #######". I think that some of the things we will miss will show up other places, and the things needing a ticketing system finally have one. You folks did an awesome job without a ticketing system, I think that you will do an even better job with one.

Yet even with all of that, yes, SKR's take says a lot to me. There are serious problems at the top. While I actually think hiring a law firm to do an assessment is a good step (this is my professional background so I see it differently than some others), there will only be positive results from that if senior management is willing to implement them. I may well be late to the party on this, but I'm not seeing a capacity to enact meaningful change after what sounds like years of mistreatment and indifference.

As to the law firm hiring, I also view this as a decently good move to protect employees. I was under the impression that now that there have been revelations with possible discrimination issues and/or sexual harassment, Paizo (who is missing an HR person) needs to investigate these allegations themselves, because if they don't and something comes up in a future court case, they will be held more liable.

I too hope that there are some major changes in how the company is run.

...
This whole affair has been really hard on the trans community on these forums, because we can't have a conversation about someone doing something transphobic without having to also have to educate everyone about everything to do with being trans, and dealing with a bunch of people debating us on whether we get to exist or not. But those of us who do speak up often don't feel like we can step away from the discussions regardless of how draining it all is, because we know that there are probably dozens of other trans people who are too afraid or don't have the energy to do this stuff who are silently being hurt by this stuff.

Tender Tendrils and others.

Thank you for taking the draining effort to reach out and further educate. Your efforts and that of others have made me realize that my support for and knowledge of trans people is not enough and that I need to further educate myself through research and not questions.

Thank you

Counterpoint: Ancient Elf, the heritage that requires you to be over 100 years old, gives you just a Multiclass Dedication.

Base assumption is apparently that elves who aren't active PCs or important NPCs basically don't do anything noteworthy, don't go anywhere, and learn very little over the course of a century.

"Henlo, i am a human who has been adventuring for 3 weeks, I'm now a level 5 wizard and can lob massive magic explosions"

"I am an aged and wise elf, who has lived for centuries. My stats are actually worse than yours because im a level 1 investigator with the wizard MC. I can't quite cast magic missile."

Simple explanation, "I used to be pretty good with a sword, but I put it up over 20 years ago and haven't really touched it since". Leveling up now is just relearning things that I have forgotten. Or, I never cast those high level spells anymore and I am really rusty, I would have to work on the concepts again: This is rather similar to having learned Calc I - III, but not using them for 20 yrs, so not remembering any of it.

Nightfox

Thank you

Is there an RMA slip in with the new book? Or what do I do with it?

And thank you for the quick reply.

Nightfox

It looks like my PF2E Core Rulebook was damaged in shipping. USPS thoughtfully left it with the large gapping hole facing away and under, so it was not noticeable at first glance. It was highly evident on lifting the package though.

I have not yet fully opened the package to assess the damage, but it does look like the spine of the Core Rulebook has been damaged. From what I can see from the hole, only the PF2E Core Rulebook was damaged. The pretty new hardcover (probably 2nd printing I was hoping), protected the more fragile adventures in the box.

Do I need to talk to Paizo or USPS about this issue and about getting a possible replacement?

Photos of the package and damage.

https://photos.app.goo.gl/E4PWaKUJwcPoEuns9

I think I would go for a combination of both of those for Magus. Unfortunately I would probably not be the person who gets to play it anyway. All said and done, Magus does not look like a fun class. It currently does not seem "magical" and is very "fiddly", you have to "Hit Twice" with two different proficiencies, and you can either cast cantrips or 4 high level attack spells.

Ohhh, and use a focus spell that gives you an extra attack to try to get off the spell you missed with earlier, but now at a -10 to hit,

ohh, and you have a focus spell to give your main weapon +2 and +2d6 (+2 greater striking)..... Just like that rune you found and put on it two levels ago.

The Magus is a bit under-tuned currently, as long as you are attacking Casters in no armor, and singular minions it is fine, but in high stress situations, many minions and Bosses, it does not deal well, and does not provide any support to the other party members.

A very disappointed
Nightfox

Doing more builds of characters from various franchises, people who cared on the Discord opted for me to post Akali from League of Legends this week. I was happy that I could use the monk as her main class and I honestly like how she came out, but lemme know what you think!

https://bjacobt1.wixsite.com/monstermonday/post/full-build-friday-akali-the -rogue-assassin-pf2e

Link does not work ...akali-the -rogue-assassin... has an extra space.

For decent overview I tend to like

Pathfinder (2e): Basics of Character Alignment
Basics4Gamers
https://youtu.be/xTSoM7JE4u8

It's been a few months since I watched it, but in general I agreed with most of it's points.

Woot !!!
I got to see it right after you posted.
Nice and Fun !!

The Copyright was most probably do to an automated algorithm. Not sure why they could pass but you didn't. We are not meant to understand how these things work as then, if we did understand, we could then tell others and let them do the same.

Curses !!!!!
I can not see it !!
Those darn Troglodytes, keeping me from watching this !!
But the Show MUST go on !!!

:)

Resources

The best (and official) web resource for reference is Archives of Nethys http://2e.aonprd.com/

I would also recommend the Demo Adventure Torment and Legacy https://paizo.com/community/blog/v5748dyo6sgx7?Pathfinder-Second-Edition-De mo-Adventure
And the Pre-generated characters https://paizo.com/products/btq01zt5?Community-Use-Package-PF2E-Iconics-Preg enerated-Characters

For some video learning the following might help

Paizo Countdown to #Pathfinder2E - "Building your Character" w/ Mark Seifter https://youtu.be/WrPyhppm-Ag
Paizo Countdown to #Pathfinder2E - "Playing the Game" w/ Logan Bonner https://youtu.be/FgiX9QY00TQ

And Maybe from other reviewers
Pathfinder 2e Basics: Fast Start & Introduction | How to Play Pathfinder 2e | Taking20 https://youtu.be/sP1HIWyv8DI
Combat Basics in Pathfinder 2 https://youtu.be/-oPMrasuMOU

I would also recommend the Basics for Gamers series on Youtube for a good look / explanation of concepts
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLYCDCUfG0xJb5I-wDIezuDkTfbd8k21Km

Finally - some of the simple concepts that it helps to remember

Everyone gets 3 actions and maybe a reaction
Most actions will be simple actions (1 action) and well defined Strike, Move, Step, Sneak, Interact (with something)
More complex actions (Activities) like Spells can take 2 actions 1 Verbal, 1 Somatic (had waving) (most spells take 2 actions)
Finally - You the GM can determine how many actions a strange activity will take (max of three actions) Just keep in mind they generally have seconds.
So Move (into position), Strike with right hand sword, Strike with Left hand dagger
Cast a spell (verbal and somatic) and then move away
Or maybe a three action cinematic activity of Grabbing the Chandelier rope, cutting it and holding on for dear life (player, please make DC 15 Athletics check) while getting rocketed up the next level. (which is basically an Interact with the rope, Strike on the rope and a Jump of some type). Some people might say that it would take more actions, but then you couldn;t do it, and we have all seen it in movies in 6 seconds.

Success vs failure Critical success > Success > Failure > Critical Failure
Critical success is 10 higher than what you needed
Critical failure is 10 lower than what you needed
Roll a 20 = Increase success by one level (so usually a Critical Success, but sometimes it can turn a failure into a success)
Roll a 1 = decrease success by one level (so often a Critical Failure if there is one, and will often turn a success into a failure )

Skills and other checks run off of DC's so remember the simple DC chart for people who wing things when starting off
10 Untrained (someone untrained succeeds about half the time)
15 Trained (Someone trained succeeds about half the time)
20 Expert etc...
30 Master etc... (pretty much never at 1st-3rd level)
40 Legendary etc...

Also with failure there is failure, and critical failure (10 below). Failure does not HAVE to be bad - it is just not success.
Failure while Climbing = You make no progress (which is a success)
Critical Fail while climbing (10 below or roll a 1) = you fall

Failure while tracking something = You lose the trail for an hour but try again in a hour.
Critical fail = You lose the trail for 24 hours

Though they do not discuss this concept in books, they have designed it into many rules, in their discussions Online they call the concept Fail Forward, you fail, but eventually succeed. Swimming across a still pond DC 10, and you get a 9. Do you drown? no because that would mean that 50% of the people who don't know how to swim (not Trained in Athletics) will die.
Instead, it takes you a while to make it across and you are maybe fatigued.
The other option is to use the drowning rules and them roll lots of dice, where they get 3 chances in the round to get a 10 or higher (they will most likely do so). And you waste a lot of time having them roll when they will eventually succeed. = no fun, as they probably can't roll 10 less than a DC 10 and get critical failure Of course, if they do roll that one, maybe look into making them start to drown.

Nightfox

Yeah see that's actually incorrect, and I can just add yours to the list of names that have "contributed" (nothing of substance) to this thread without reading the OP or the posts following it.

[CUT]

So, to be clear I wasn't expecting to derive maximum value from feinting every turn in combat from the start, but I thought it would be more than literally once through 6 levels. Even with a Cleric of Nethys, Paladin of Iomedae, Fighter, and Wizard making the rest of my party....

So, is what you are trying to say that you don't find the Scoundrel, very scoundrelly? That it tends to be more Rogue and less Scoundrel, with not much in there that says "Scoundrel", like how a "Swashbuckler" very much seems like a "Swashbuckler" right from the get go. I would have to say that you are RIGHT, it doesn't look like you are quite getting the build of Rogue you want, the feel you want, right out of the gate. Maybe the Advanced players guide would help when it comes out, maybe being "Swashbuckler" fits more. But it is disappointing and it stinks.

I think that part of this issue some of the following issues.

Rogue is the best Exploration class, their abilities are good in combat, but they truly Shine and "Rogue" or "Scoundrel" out of combat. With all of their skills and skill feats, that where they lay.

Secondly, there are more "Scoundrel" oriented feats (high charisma) but they are only for a certain variety of "Scoundrel Rogue"
Distracting Feint
You're Next
Dread striker

These entail a lot of Chr, and some dark roleplaying, Fit some scoundrels well, not others.

Final thoughts, Is it just this character that is a disappointment? or do you see many other characters that you might build could head this way as well. I hope it is the first, because the second can only be alleviated by many off-sets (group, campaign, etc)

Nightfox

Oooh nice one... Having to resort to use a spell malus to be "coherent" is a little sad... I'm interested to know, do you often launch Perception check only on sound ?
If yes, what malus or bonus do you give to enemy if someone is moving behind a big wall with "Stride" and with "Stealth" action...

But for their defense I have to say that the "Hidden" mechanic has always been one of the most "I try to cheese it" mechanic in D&D since it can really overpower a rogue if you rule one side or under-power them if you rule it the other way... The more complicated it was the less anyone was keen to use it...
1e rules were over-complicated, and really, really subject to interpretation, so much so that I have used third editor rules to do it...
2e rules are a little less complicated rule-wise, letting the GM more "in control" but at the same time more lost in what rules to use...

No rules on hearing, smelling etc. all to the GM to do... Only view really detailed... Mweh... Not a fan.

My table wants consistency, changing rules from one session to another is difficult especially since I've played with them for more than 20 years, being master or player... I know...

Well, now days I never ask for perception checks <grin> They being secret and all (I actually tend to do a mix of secret and player rolled dice). Everything depends on the situation, environment, the players and the type of game being run. It's for fun, and the kids are new to playing, so I try keep the DC near the targets Stealth DC. Often, I'll ask for a roll and just remember the simple 2E 10,15,20,30,40 dc's.

As for the wall, it depends on what the situation and an understanding of what the players think is going on. Is it "theatre of the mind"? Or are we on a grid. What did the player say, and what was their intent, and finally what do the rules think about their intent? Do people have any idea that the other party exists?
In the simplest way, I would have the "sneaking" person roll vs DC of the opponents stealth. IF they are close, but not over, I would think about what modifiers there might be, like the +4 Circumstance bonus to Stealth for full cover. Once I have that +4 Circumstance bonus, nothing else positive circumstance is going to help. Do they have a Noisy armor penalty? It doesn't matter if they win by 4 or 9 or loose by 3 or really. How much time do you spend getting it perfect (never perfect) vs moving along the game.

Currently, some of the bad guys are "Blind" because they don't have darkvision and the party does.
For the kids game I tend to do the following
Do your best, look at the rolls, keep it moving and worry more about accuracy when it matters to the plot and Character lives.

Over all, I'm ok with the generalities of the 2e rules, just roll and see where the dice lay.

Other senses. Hearing, Roll stealth while sneaking, if they could not see you (+4 circumstance) but you fail, then they heard you.
Scent. You quickly become noticed (Hidden) in their "scent" range. Other non-scent opponents, they don't notice.
The explanations are a little lacking for each because they use Keywords like Precise and Imprecise, but they are there.

I personally got a better understanding on ALL of this from watching the Basics 4 Gamers series on Youtube.
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UChtQk-wDX5F15f1dYGO5SQQ

Perception and Concealment (Especially Schrodingers goblin)
https://youtu.be/9Xm_1IBdU6A

Stealth
https://youtu.be/CFR-7N_nOS0

Nightfox

I would say that you would have the effect of Deafened towards detecting the silenced person. -2 Status penalty

But this would really be up to the GM and "what else was going on". I originally used the word "Circumstances", but since this seems to be a Status penalty I have excised it from my sentences.

Deafened
Source Core Rulebook pg. 619
You can’t hear. You automatically critically fail Perception checks that require you to be able to hear. You take a –2 status penalty to Perception checks for initiative and checks that involve sound but also rely on other senses. If you perform an action with the auditory trait, you must succeed at a DC 5 flat check or the action is lost; attempt the check after spending the action but before any effects are applied. You are immune to auditory effects.

You sir, are my Hero Punster

So, I fall in the other camp it seems like :-)

--

Disarm Single Action
Attack
Source Core Rulebook pg. 243
Requirements You have at least one hand free. The target can’t be more than one size larger than you.You try to knock something out of an opponent’s grasp. Attempt an Athletics check against the opponent’s Reflex DC.

Critical Success You knock the item out of the opponent’s grasp. It falls to the ground in the opponent’s space.
Success You weaken your opponent’s grasp on the item. Until the start of that creature’s turn, attempts to Disarm the opponent of that item gain a +2 circumstance bonus, and the target takes a –2 circumstance penalty to attacks with the item or other checks requiring a firm grasp on the item.
Critical Failure You lose your balance and become flat-footed until the start of your next turn.

--

1) Until the start the opponents turn they
a) Take -2 circ penalty on attacks (most of oppotunity)
b) -2 circ penalty on "other checks" that require a firm grasp

Since AC is a DC :) and therefore a check, it does follow that your opponent would take a -2 circumstance penalty to AC negating the benefit of a steel shield throwing them off balance with a smaller one.
This also works cinematically as "knocking the shield out of position"

2) It falls to reason then that on a crit the strap breaks (or the buckle bends and the straps fly loose) and you knock the shield out of the opponents hand.

In my opinion, these results fall more closely with what we would expect to have happen on successful "disarm" of a shield by someone in the game. I don't see another way in the rules to get the cinematic effect of pushing the shield out of the way purposefully. You obliviously can still use that description for a successful hit by someone using a shield (and not blocking with it).

Nightfox

Wizards in PF2 once again have the least number of skills at creation of any character (before Int). This was true in the early days of the playtest, but was later changed to equal many of the other classes.

The Wizard is often given less spells as a class because Intelligence is their primary attribute. The main problems with this are. (all estimates of skills are class based and ignore backgrounds, ancestries and other creation differences)

1. The other Intelligence primary stat class, the Alchemist, gets 4 skills + Int to the Wizards 3 + Int. This breaks the paradigm that the Wizard should get less skill becuase they have a higher Int.

2. "we need to make sure the wizard does not compete with the Rogue for number of spells"
At minimum, the Rogue gets 9+ skills before Int, while the Wizard gets a maximum of 7 skills at 1st level. Would one more threaten the Rogue (like the Alchemist does")

3. They focus most of their studies on learning their spell books. This is true, which is why the Wizard has the least number of proficiencies of any class and the lowest HP. While this is true, the Wizard also stresses that they may "Have an unquenchable intellectual curiosity about how everything in the world around you works—magic in particular." Having the least number of class skills does not coincide with having an "unquenchable intellectual curiosity about how everything in the world".

4. The low number of skills is there to balance the class. The class does not get significantly balanced by having 1 less skill.

The Wizard should have 4 + Int at creation (one being arcane). This will not significantly unbalance the class but would indicate that they are a class that pursues knowledge and believes in Mind over Matter. (Wizards use the minds to control matter, and other minds)

Nightfox

My version of spell strike, based somewhat off of power attack

Spell Strike Free Action
Magus Flourish
Trigger Finish casting a touch attack spell
You unleash the force of your spell through the weapon in your hand but this leaves you a bit unsteady. Make a melee Strike. This counts as two attacks when calculating your multiple attack penalty. The attack uses the weapon proficiency. If this Strike hits, combine both the damage of the spell and the damage of the weapon. The weapon attack gains the traits of the spell and keeps any of it's traits.

Balance
Cantrips, equalish to power attack.
All or nothing, no wording of holding the charge.
Next attack is at the third multiattack penalty.
It's a flourish attack.

Notes
Easy to add ranged spell strike, and close range spell as feats to modify it. Attack is based off weapon proficiency and not spell.

Not sure if I will homebrew it or wait but Both Magus and Summoner are faves of mine and would like them back for 2e.

I'm also going to try and homebrew Magus for my son in our RoRL game that I'm going to try and convert to PF2

Ah man, I am also running Rise of the Runelords converted to playtest rules and barring my players getting way off track or dying they should beat Xanesha next session. When I was wondering what to do with the mask I had decided to replace it with a Demon Mask, but it still does irk me that it doesn't fit her snake motif as you said. I may just give her the ability to cast flesh to stone once per day though I'm thinking the DC would be 23 since I'm running her stats as using the Night Hag from the bestiary but with different spells, and without some of the night hags abilities.

Pumpkin

Do you happen to have a listing of changes that you made / implemented? Having something to base mine off of as well would help. DC's are probably one thing from the Playtest that will probably need to be done again.

Nightfox

I plan on doing some conversions for RoRL from PF1 to PF2 when the books come out as I am introducing some teenagers to Pathfinder, we will be moving mid-way through Burnt Offerings

The hard planning part is one character is a Magus
Another is a WarPriest, but I am just turning that into a Cleric since the original player left and is now a GM PC

I think I will probably share a google doc to the forums to help with conversion

I think in this case, since it is confusing enough to warrant a FAQ entry, that the entry should be change for production to include a note about AC being included. Frightened should also include extra wording

Part of the reason for this inclusion is the wording "Gives a penalty to your checks and saving throws" does not lend itself to including your AC. Your AC is not a check YOU make, it is the DC for someone elses check. With the inclusion of saving throws in the wording (which is also a check) it could be misconstrue to not include your AC as you never make checks against your AC.

The wording could be changed to the following to make it more understandable

"You take a conditional penalty equal to this value to your checks, including your AC and saving throws"

Just to clarify: the half-level scaling only applies to the part of the spell that says "Heighten", right? You'll deal less damage and get weaker effects, but your to-hit/saving throw bonus would be the same as your highest level spell?

All spells use the same to hit and save bonus now, So enemies resist against your first level spells the same as your high level ones.

Spells when heightened first become a that higher level, so a 3rd level dispel magic heightened is now a 5th level dispel magic and affects 5th level and lower spells.

Finally, if a spell has a heightened entry, it uses the extra increase according to what it's new spell level is. If you cast a 1st level spell heightened at 9th character level to 5th level; 9/5 = 4.5 round up to 5th, (depending on what the inconsistent rounding says, first world is rounded up, Paladin is rounded down for powers). Then you look at the heightened entry and see if is says something different for a different level (ie, 2nd level this, 4th level this) or whether is has positive increase depending on level ; +1 level +2d6 (so 2nd +2d6, 3rd +3d6)
or +2 levels 1 more missile per action (3rd +1 missile per, 5th +2 missiles per)