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Skylancer4 wrote:

As partial casters their spells aren't the 'main focus' of the class. They have amazing saves and full BAB, among othere abilities that scale with their level. If you really want more spells, I believe there is a feat that grants additional spells and there are racial favored class bonuses that grants spells for other classes, look to see if there is one for paladin.

Also, samsaran paladins can gain extra spells through one of the racials.

Bard is another partial caster class that is much more consistent with it's new spell levels known. Most casters don't seem to gain the final level their progression their pattern would imply, (as bards would get level 7 at 19 and clerics and wizards would get level 10 spells at 19) so paladins not getting level 6 spells at 19 would be consistent with other classes. There doesn't seem to be a reason for missing level 5 spells at 16 though.

If you are relying on their BaB and saves for the power of the class wouldn't that put them as overpowered at levels 4-15? For those levels they gain caster progression and full BaB.

Every class with at least some spell casting I've seen outside Paladin and Ranger gains new spell levels at a consistent rate throughout their leveling process. Fighters gain bonus feats and weapon/armor training at a consistent rate throughout their leveling process. Paladin and ranger both seem to be getting less per level at level 16+ than they got from previous levels because they don't get level 5 spells.

I'm not saying the paladin is over or under powered as a class. I'm saying it's inconsistent between early game and late game.


Paladins gain a new spell level at 4, 7, 10, and 13. The obvious continuation of this pattern would be gaining level 5 spells at 16 and level 6 spells at 19. They don't.

Is there a reason why their spell casting is capped out? I don't see any other class abilities at high levels that would make make up for them not having level 5 and 6 spells.


2 people marked this as FAQ candidate.

How does the anti-paladin work with the feat ultimate mercy? They channel negative energy so raising the dead seems inappropriate. Creating undead on the other hand would make tons of sense.

Are there any offical rules on this or should it be homebrewed like I posted here?


I'm playing an evil campaign and I'm running an anti-paladin. For a lot of the paladin-themed feats it's a pretty simple conversion. The Ultimate Mercy feat doesn't fit very well with the anti-paladin though.

Here's my attempt at making the anti-paladin version. I'm posting it here to get feedback on how balanced it is.

Ultimate Mockery:

By using touch of corruption, you can bring the dead back to a mockery of life.

Prerequisites: Cha 19, Greater Mercy, 10 uses/day of touch of corruption, cruelty class feature.

You can spend a number of touch of corruption uses equal to the hit dice a dead creature had to raise it as an undead mockery of what it was in life. The corpse must be mostly intact as the raise dead spell. You must provide the material component for create undead or choose to accept 1 temporary negative level; this level automatically goes away after 24 hours, never becomes a permanent negative level, and cannot be overcome in any way except by waiting for the duration to expire.

Type: The creature's type changes to undead. It retains any subtype except for alignment subtypes (such as good) and subtypes that indicate kind (such as giant). It does not gain the augmented subtype. It uses all the base creature's statistics and special abilities except as noted here.

The creature gains all undead traits.

Abilities: A creature so raised has no Con score, but other abilities remain unchanged. It uses Cha for bonus hit points and fortitude saves instead of con.

What happens to the soul: The soul of the creature has the option to return if ultimate mockery is cast within 1 day per anti-paladin level of the creature's death. If it refuses, then it gets a will save with a DC equal to half the anti-paladin's level plus cha modifier, minus the number of days it has been dead for. If the soul of the slain creature is imprisoned in a soul gem or similarly under the control of the anti-paladin it does not get a choice and is transferred into the newly raised undead.

If the soul returns, the undead created has the int and wisdom it had in life. If not, it has no int score and a wisdom of 10.

Control: The newly raised undead is not under any special control by the caster and is either mindless or free willed depending on the status of the soul. However the process of raising it may be delayed to attempt once to add another form of control such as the control undead feat as it is being raised.

Adjusting to un-life: A raised creature's alignment will slowly change to evil over the next 1d20 weeks, (law/chaos axis remains unchanged.) If uncontrolled and free-willed, being raised into an undead shell can be quite a change. Crusaders of good often find themselves resenting their new form and are frequently drawn to revenge against both the one who raised them and their killer. Often becoming anti-paladins themselves after a fall caused by a chain of revenge. Evil creatures often have no problem with their new form and may even seek undeath out, (although usually in a form with more turn resistance and defensive powers than ultimate mockery gives.)