KingDrache64's page

KingDrache64 wrote:

So it seems like the PC has to be actively involved in the encounter to gain xp from it.

And being "involved" in the encounter is probably up to the GM as well.

But I do have the feat Master's voice which allows me to have constant mind link with them so hopefully that will be enough to convince him.

Remember that cohort's and the like are usually weaker than your main character, your GM might rule that the encounter was to easy for you to learn anything from it because of that.

He'll be traveling with a level 6 party and my Thrall is level 5 with my Thrall Heard level 6 (thralls are only your level -1 instead of 2)

So it seems like the PC has to be actively involved in the encounter to gain xp from it.

And being "involved" in the encounter is probably up to the GM as well.

But I do have the feat Master's voice which allows me to have constant mind link with them so hopefully that will be enough to convince him.

KingDrache64 wrote:

When it comes to classes with thralls, or cohorts from leadership feat, perhaps familiars from summoners things that are part of your character, do you gain the same xp or diminished xp from them?

I am wanting to play as my Thrall and let my Thrall herd retire for a few missions. Assuming my GM is okay with this (he is) would my thrall heard continue to gain xp as I level the Thrall?

This also adds the prospect of sending all my believers on mini missions to gain a miniscule amount of steady xp for me... Just pushing the idea further here.

short answer, they don't. they cannot get XP on their own without stopping to be a familiar or cohort.

Well, I think the better thing to focus on is do they earn xp for their PC owner. If a cohort kills a dragon, I assume that xp goes to the PC

When it comes to classes with thralls, or cohorts from leadership feat, perhaps familiars from summoners things that are part of your character, do you gain the same xp or diminished xp from them?

I am wanting to play as my Thrall and let my Thrall herd retire for a few missions. Assuming my GM is okay with this (he is) would my thrall heard continue to gain xp as I level the Thrall?

This also adds the prospect of sending all my believers on mini missions to gain a miniscule amount of steady xp for me... Just pushing the idea further here.

You read it right. You can.

The real question is, "Should you?"

The answer, of course, is "Probably not." Or "Almost certainly not." Or even "Abso-friggin-lutely NOT!".

Whew, sorry. I got carried away there.

I don't remember if the race builder suggests that not all spells are created equally, but the section on creating custom magic items make this one very clear. A ring of at-will magic missile should cost 2,000gp while a ring of at-will True Strike should cost 800,000gp (priced as a +20 sword).

I think the same kind of consideration should be applied to the race builder when adding Spell-Like Abilities (or any other trick to gain magic spells as a custom racial feature). Don't make the mistake of thinking all spells are created equal and don't make the mistake of allowing races that exploit that thinking in a way that makes them imbalanced.

You are so right. This system should not be allowed to players openly. My GM gives a 29 rp balance. Using this budget I have made characters starting with 30 strength, etc. It's super easy to game break (which isn't all it's cracked up to be)

But the further implications of mage armor and etc are staggering...

This system seems broken

I am trying to gain better understanding of the race builder to make sure I am not abusing it. I've chosen to use this question as a vehicle to drive me towards that understanding:

Spell-Like Ability, At-Will (Variable, see Special):
Prerequisites: None; Benefit: Choose a 3rd-level or lower spell that does not attack a creature or deal damage. Members of this race can use this spell as an at-will spell-like ability. The caster level of the spell is equal to the user's character level. Special: This trait costs as many RP as twice the level of spell chosen (minimum 2). Up to five spells can be chosen when you take this trait. Each time you take an additional spell, adjust the RP cost of this trait appropriately.

If I am understanding this right I can make a race that can cast true strike at will for a measily 2 rp?

Am I misunderstanding this?

Again, thank you for all your hard work. With this guy I wanted to see how far the game could be broken within the scope of the rules. (A fiendish desire I know)

The 30 Cha was from exploiting the advanced race guide

Slow -1
Light sensitivity -1
1 paragon charisma +4, -2 physicals
4/5/6/7 and cha +8
4 adv wisdom
1 object of desire +1 charms

And note the terminology for negative levels refers to thralls not believers which you can see per the table "thrall heard leadership and believers by level" that you have 1 thrall and many believers. This is also supported by this

"A thrallherd’s thrall and believers arrive within 24 hours. Lost thralls are replaced within 24 hours. Believers arrive and are replaced at a rate of the thrallherd’s leadership score per day, with the lowest level believers arriving first."

This establishes a dichotomy.

But yes this character is clearly out of control which is why I took the personal responsibility of replacing him with a harder to play character and banning myself from the advanced race building guide ha ha.

KingDrache64 wrote:

Yes my Cha is 30. That's another story. Lol. But ignore that.

And regardless of negative levels we have long moments where our characters simply live between missions, working professions etc. If legal my character would do this in a few week time span between missions.

Again, this is a jerk move in my opinion and highly evil. And definitely game breaking. That's why I'm choosing a new character. (I plan on this thrall herd guy being an NPC for an evil king later on) but the core question here is "is this legal by game terminology alone?"

For all the reasons and quotations you posted (which THANK YOU BTW for going to such effort, you're awesome!) I'm thinking it is legal.

Alright, well you are asking if something is legal, because of the idea that it can be exploited at lv6. Which is a more than reasonable request, and then you say you have a charisma score of 30.

Because of this, it really isn't much of a concern to be addressed.

Also as I have stated before, if you strip down all your characters, and 6 of your 35 lv1 NPC thralls die, then you die.
The negative levels stack, and having your cohorts roam the world without any of the provisions they have effectively heightens the chance of them dying.

I hope your GM is a merciful GM. If he doesnt care that you are killing a lv5 NPC every other week to loot his corpse, then thats on him for gamebalcing issues, not on the class itself.

Edit: I guess it only applies to your current thrall at hand in the case of negative levels.

however, leading people to death might strike the proper authorities to investigate the mysterious remnants of naked followers.

Added note: you have 1 thrall, and the rest are believers. So the negative level terminology only applies to my one main thrall who I actually don't kill.

P.s.
Truth be told I payed for mind switch true to be cast on my First thrall who was a barbarian so my character would have awesome mental and physical stats... I know I'm a monster...

Yes my Cha is 30. That's another story. Lol. But ignore that.

And regardless of negative levels we have long moments where our characters simply live between missions, working professions etc. If legal my character would do this in a few week time span between missions.

Again, this is a jerk move in my opinion and highly evil. And definitely game breaking. That's why I'm choosing a new character. (I plan on this thrall herd guy being an NPC for an evil king later on) but the core question here is "is this legal by game terminology alone?"

For all the reasons and quotations you posted (which THANK YOU BTW for going to such effort, you're awesome!) I'm thinking it is legal.

Thanks for the clarification on the forum. Is there a way for a moderator to move this? I'm still new to these boards and there are so many sub forums to navigate I'm afraid I'll just put it in the wrong place again.

Added note, it's sad that paizo didn't want to embrace psionics especially as they were official 3.5 books. I much prefer the power point system vs spells per day.

At level 6 my Telepath became a Thrall Heard.

I gained 1 level 5 cohort.
1 level 4
1 level 3
3 level 2s
And 35 level 1s
(Leadership score 18)

Assuming they are mind compelled slaves/followers/believers I am assuming I can do as I wish with their wealth? (Using the wealth by character level chart)

If so this seems to be an imbalance of the wbcl chat for my character as I calculate my loot to be over 42,000 not to mention if I get them killed my numbers replenish in 24 hours...

Your thoughts community?

Added note: I am the most experienced player in my group (I own all the books and let them borrow them and still help most everyone with their characters) so the party lets me get away with murder but I don't want to be that guy... I am just curious if this is actually valid/allowed not necessarily a question of fairness as I've already decided to re-roll to a harder to play Soulbolt archetype prestige into elocater (just for kicks).

Sorry I had 3 minutes to type this at the time. (Please excuse the typos and terminology).

I find it strange that there is no chart or specific rule for this. It seems like every new GM makes the mistake of dolling out too much cool stuff, I did it when I was new, all GM's I've taught since then have fallen into that (which is about 5 people).

I've also wanted to run gear based characters vs ability based characters. (Running an expert NPC class with high tech gear to feel like Ironman lol)

But the rules don't seem to support or even entertain the idea of a gear based advancement. This would be a great system to plug into an ultimate equipment book or something... Just saying.

Your party doesn't have a CR, they have an APL.

I am unaware of any rule for bumping up their APL based on loot.

My first suggestion is to talk to that other GM and get the two of you on the same page about giving out loot - hopefully it's the official page with the WBL chart on it...

Secondly, if you follow ALL the rules and guidelines but you raise the APL because they have extra loot, then that means you have them encounter higher CR encounters. No problem. But, that does mean MORE treasure for them because higher CR = higher loot values per encounter. So if you're going to raise the CR, go for it, but probably DON'T raise the loot (which means you won't be following ALL of the guidelines).

One solution to that second point is give them loot that they CANNOT use to make themselves more powerful. Give them a castle somewhere, or at least some empty land bequeathed by a grateful king or duke or some such. If you give them gold, they spend it on magic stuff, but if you give them land (and then don't have any rich NPCs available to buy it from them), well, they gain value but they don't gain power.

But really, just fix this with the other GM. You guys are friends. Show him the rules and explain how he's wrecking the balance of the game. He'll come around. I hope.

I have looked everywhere and can't find anyone talking about how to calculate CR fit adding too much loot.

I co-gm with a lesser experienced gm who gives away too much loot so when it's my turn to GM I have a difficult time determining correct CR for the party

Thanks! I tend to run my world with low magic, usually because my players don't do their research and just take what they randomly are rewarded
Also no one really plays magic users, I usually have a magic companion join them.

Does anyone have any suggestions for my system or think they would like to use it for their games?

Hey thanks for the feedback! I was afraid of the crit imbalance as well. But I would like players to have some control over that. I have been planning on using more constructs/immune to crit creatures if I still needed to challenge the payer. But getting a longsword to -3 crit would require a craft check of 30. Maybe I should limit crit to a max of -1? What do you think?

As far as the complexity/dice rolls, I do have to walk my players through it a few times but once they get it down it's just roll roll roll. Swap points around, done. :) I had a player who went crazy and crafted his armor shield and multiple weapons, it took about 5 minutes for the whole ordeal.

By lower the crit I mean a long sword has a crit of 19-20x2. This would be lowered to 18-20x2
And thank you for your interest in my post. What do you think of my system?

I love crafting in games but I found d&d and pathfinder crafting a bit too unusable for crafting centered players. So I made up this system which my players have enjoyed. I wanted to get some seasoned opinions on my rules however. Here is what I wrote, sorry for any typos I wrote this on my smart phone at work.

Crafting for pathfinder:
This is my preferred system for crafting. In my opinion it is more rewarding and plays more to skill and acts as a mini-game.
New terms/rules:
Scavenging: when you loot equipment you can roll an appraise check (DC 10) followed by a craft check (DC = craft check for item being scavenged, result = material balance)
Material balance (MB): this is a floating number gained from scavenging equipment. This number/bank can be used for crafting costs instead of money. Ex: crafting an item would cost 1000sp, you have 500MB. You empty your MB so now you only have to pay 500sp for the item material cost.
1. Decide what you would like to craft and pay for the materials. With either sp or MB.
2. Find out the DC for the craft check according to the normal rule set. Then subtract 5 to a minimum of 5. Write down that number and the original number twice. Ex: DC = 20. So write 15,20,20.
3. Categories: identify each category for the numbers.
For armor: the DCs are labeled fitting, padding, and protection.
Fitting: (DC -5) this determines how well your armor fits. (Max Dex/armor check penalty/spell fail.)[for bonuses choose one stat]
Padding: this determines the HD of the armor. (HD)
Protection: this determines the AC of the armor. (AC)
For weapons: the DCs are labeled hilt, make, damage.
Hilt: (DC -5) this determines how easy the weapon is to wield. (Attack/crit.) [for bonuses choose one stat]
Make: this determines how well the weapon holds together. (HD)
Damage: this determines how sharp a sword is or how damaging the head of a war hammer is etc. (Damage)
4. Roll your checks for each category. Place the d20 to the side or write the numbers down.
5. For each category you can allocate the numbers as you wish between each other. Ex: for DCs 15,20,20 you roll 18,17,20. You can take 3 from the 18 and add it to the 17 making your new results 15,20,20.
6. Determine weapon quality. For each DC category, add +1 (or +10 HD/-1 for crit.)to the affected stat for every 5 you beat the score by (max +3/+30HD/-3 crit). Subtract 1 (or 5HD/+1 for crit.) if you missed a DC by 1 to 5, the item is scrapped if you miss any DC by more then 5. An item with any + in any category is considered masterwork. Any item with bonuses in all categories is considered a +# item (+1 long sword). Categories that affect multiple stats (fitting/hilt) can apply one bonus for each stat per +5. Ex: you beat the hilt category DC by +10. You could get +2 to attack or +1 to attack and lower the crit by -1.

Ex: crafting a longsword.
1.Pay 66sp or MB. For item cost.
2. DC for longsword is 15, so write 10,15,15
3. hilt|make|damage
10|15|15
4. Roll 3d20 + craft skill (+4)
Rolls 14|12|22
5. Allocate:
10|15|23 that's (14-4)(12+3)(22+1)
6. Quality:
Damage category exceeds DC by +8. So for being +5 over but not +10 damage gains +1. The finished product is this:
Long sword: attack +0, HD 10, damage 1d8+1, crit 19-20x2.