CuttDeep's page

JonathonWilder wrote:

Have you considered possibly showing this to a third party and getting it published?

WotC still holds the copyrights on all the beguiler stuff so I probably wouldn't actually be able to get it published without significant alterations to the class and its core abilities.

You've done so much to add to the class, I think you would still be able to publish it if you didn't use the beguiler name itself.

So here's the replacement for Arcane Fidelity:

Arcane Infiltrator (Sp): At 6th level, a whispering initiate gains the ability to cast any one of the following spells as a spell-like ability: forced quiet, invisibility, or undetectable alignment. She can use this ability once per day at 6th level and she gains an additional daily use for every four beguiler levels she gains thereafter (to a maximum of four daily uses at 18th level).

At 10th level, she adds glibness, and nondetection to the list of spells she can use with this ability.

At 14th level, she adds modify memory, and shadow walk to the list of spells she can use with this ability. This ability replaces silent spell.

How do you determine the save DC and caster level for these spells?

CuttDeep wrote:

That seems really powerful. Intimidation builds are already pretty good, but being able to do so at range seems a bit much.

The power of the ranged demoralize options is significantly offset by their save + check structure. It leaves the ability in the hands of two separate d20 rolls, either of which could have severe consequences on the action.

I hadn't thought about that. I guess the addition of the save also means that there's potential for a critical success there (while there's no crit fails on skill checks, so the Intimidate could always succeed).

That seems really powerful. Intimidation builds are already pretty good, but being able to do so at range seems a bit much.

Alright, I've been working on this for a while, but here is the updated spell kill replacement for the ghastly claw beguilers.

** spoiler omitted **...

Oh man, that is SO COOL! I LOVE IT! I was starting to give up, but you knocked it out of the park!

Any update on the update?

I'm torn, the visual you painted with the vitrifying sand was so incredibly visceral but I can definitely see penumbral's point. Also I think it would be very cool to give some variation to the tactics used from one ghastly claw beguiler to the next (sort of like how the baleful shadow beguiler picks a few tricks to customize his character) so choices of combat maneuvers would be great. I look forward to seeing all the options :D

So here's my idea for a spell kill replacement ability:

** spoiler omitted **

Oh wow. That sounds absolutely brutal. I love it!

CuttDeep wrote:

I'm not looking for more power, just different. I guess what I meant to say is that spellkill seems out of place in the current ghastly claw order because of the overlap of "magical combat beguiler" from the new baleful shadow. I really feel like the ghastly claw would benefit from a more melee/martial option than spellkill. It would definitely contribute to giving them a more unique story.

CuttDeep wrote:

I guess the idea I have in my head is that the ghastly claw beguiler would use his spells for infiltration and then use his combat skills and paralyzing touch to take down his opponents while the baleful shadow beguiler is more along the lines of slinging shadow evocations for fun and profit.

Okay, now I see what you're thinking. Sorry I misunderstood what you were looking for in your first post. Give me a few days and let me brainstorm to see if I can come up with something more martial that might replace spell kill.

Awesome! Thank you for listening to my concerns. It's so cool that you're still fine tuning this after such a long time.

CuttDeep wrote:

ertw wrote:

I'm afraid I'm going to have to agree with Penumbral Shadow, the balance of the ghastly claw beguilers was a pretty tricky thing; I wouldn't want to give it more power at the risk of upsetting this balance.

I'm not looking for more power, just different. I guess what I meant to say is that spellkill seems out of place in the current ghastly claw order because of the overlap of "magical combat beguiler" from the new baleful shadow. I really feel like the ghastly claw would benefit from a more melee/martial option than spellkill. It would definitely contribute to giving them a more unique story.

The beguiler's spellcasting really makes any combat oriented beguiler a "magical combat beguiler" though.

I guess the idea I have in my head is that the ghastly claw beguiler would use his spells for infiltration and then use his combat skills and paralyzing touch to take down his opponents while the baleful shadow beguiler is more along the lines of slinging shadow evocations for fun and profit.

I'm afraid I'm going to have to agree with Penumbral Shadow, the balance of the ghastly claw beguilers was a pretty tricky thing; I wouldn't want to give it more power at the risk of upsetting this balance.

I'm not looking for more power, just different. I guess what I meant to say is that spellkill seems out of place in the current ghastly claw order because of the overlap of "magical combat beguiler" from the new baleful shadow. I really feel like the ghastly claw would benefit from a more melee/martial option than spellkill. It would definitely contribute to giving them a more unique story.

I've been following this conversion for a while now (first saw it on reddit then followed the conversation here), but haven't had a chance to play with it yet. The other day I was discussing it with a friend and we both agreed that the ghastly claw order seems to have lost its focus.

I remember when I first saw this there were mountains of complaints that the ghastly claw was too much of a stand out, that the others all kind of faded into the background when placed beside it. Over that time each of the other orders have been polished, but the ghastly claw seems to have been left behind. Its original role as a combat-focused beguiler has been stepped all over by the baleful shadow. While I see you kind of meant to have ghastly claw be more melee focused while the baleful shadow is more magic focused, key abilities like spellkill put both back into direct contention.

I think ghastly claw needs a bit of a rethink, not much, but something other than spellkill for the third tier order power. For example you could go more in the necromancy direction by giving them automatic threnodic spell for all their casting, or more combat focused by letting them use their beguiler level as BAB a few times per day. I'm not sure, but something really needs to help this really cool order.