CommanderC2121's page

Ive played PF a few times with friends but due to changing colleges and losing contact with my friends I have no one else to play with. Anyone know a good way I could find a group looking for a PF player? Or maybe a good way to meet people who play PF?

CommanderC2121 wrote:

Hello! I am still relatively new to anything pathfinder, having only played 2 campaigns, neither of which played past level 6, but from what Ive seen in play, and what Ive been told, spell casters are very powerful. I, however, am a stubborn man and have never been one for spell casting as a primary source of damage, no matter what the game. So Im wondering is there a way to create a martial character that can rival the output of a caster in any sense? Or if I cant, what can I do to get close in power?

Well good news! If you're defining power as single target damage output you've already won as a martial character.

If you're defining power any other way...you've lost. And there's no way not to lose. The closest methods of getting those power levels are spell like abilities or supernatural abilities or other things that are all magic, even if they're not strictly spells.

If "not spells" are okay, then kineticist is going to be your best bet. Though I suspect what you really want is non-magical means of replicating magic. In which case, you're pretty much SOL.

One thing that might be affecting this is the level of play you're reaching. Martial characters become the obvious best single target damage dealers at higher levels, but there are so many other things that caster can do that are much better than dealing damage. If you can play in a campaign that goes up to level 12, you will really see where the disparity comes into play.

If you think flaming sphere's 3d6 points of fire damage at level 6 is a peak of power, well I'm a bit confused. You're martial character is probably dealing 1d10 weapon damage + strength + power attack, as a baseline, possibly twice per turn. The average of 3d6 is 10.5 damage. Power attack on a two handed weapon at level 6 is +6 on its own. Add strength and weapon damage you're doing better, potentially twice a round. You shouldn't have any trouble keeping on top in terms of damage.

I was playing a unchained monk that campaign, and a dex monk at that (i didnt realize how important strength was so i had the base level 10) so my damage was unarmed strikes (dealing a d8) and getting a small +4 for damage dealt due to an agile enchantment. I didnt have power attack. Thats IF i hit.

The big power gap is the ability for caster classes to emulate martial class abilities somewhat, or make them entirely unnecessary. Beyond that, casters can do things that aren't accessible to mundane classes. Certain spells like teleport, disintegrate, and raise dead, can end encounters or adventures in a way that you can't using impact trauma. If you want to make a character who fights using weapons, but has the utility of a caster, then you'd still want to start with a caster and work the combat stuff in as you go.

There are plenty of 6th level caster options that give you a decent mix of caster power and martial power such as the inquisitor, hunter, magus and occultist. There's also the old standby of the shifting focused druid. When it comes down to it, you could play a wizard who cast defensive spells and ran around with a falchion if you really wanted to.

When I was playing my monk, although I never got the chance to use, let alone get the feat tree, I saw the dimensional door -> savant feat path, and that sounded like a very cool mechanic with which you could make a martial fighting set. Are there any other martial classes, besides the monk, that could effectively use that feat tree, and if so, is it even worth doing such a thing?

A vanilla fighter should usually out-DPS wizards on single-target attacks, unless it's one of those oddball monsters that have huge DR but some kind of magical vulnerability.

Summoning an ape is on the SM III list, and thus requires a sorcerer of lvl 6. The ape then needs to go into melee, has at best half of the fighter's HP, much lower AC, his two attacks are at half of the fighter's BAB (thus presumably at less than a third of his actual attack bonus), their damage is low...

I'm not even going to compare with the archer, who would be even better, but compare this big monkey to a level 6 fighter with 22 str (17 starting +2 human +1 level advancement + 2 belt of strength) and a +2 falchion.

Ape does +3/+2 to deal 1d6+2 damage
Fighter does +12/+7 (+6/+1 BAB + 6 str +2 enhancement -2 power attack) to deal 2d4+17 (+9 str +2 enhancement + 6 power attack), without even considering the good crit range on that weapon.

So your first attack has an attack bonus 4x as high, your second attack 3x as high, and your damage output is on average about 2.5x as high per hit.

How is that ape "clearing the field" and making you useless???

I will say i dont believe my character (this playthrough I was the unchained monk) was as properly built as it shouldve been. I build a dex monk with no bonus strength, and so while I rarely got hit (no armor but 28 ac) I also didnt do as much damage. I was playing the role of a distraction for archers and the enemy frontline mostly.

Also Ive actually never played a fighter, due to their class seeming kinda bland compared to other martial classes, so if that affects the way I was playing that could be why.

A true martial, like no magic whatsoever?

A Mutagen Warrior or Viking archetype Fighter using Gorum's Divine Fighting Technique.

The Ragelancepounce Barbarian.

Zen Archer Monk.

Gunslinger, maybe.

Martial focused casters?

Synthesis Summoner.

Wildshaping Druid.

Blood Conduit/Urban Bloodrager (Arcane Bloodline) VMC Magus.

Warpriest.

Inquisitor.

Eldritch Archer Magus.

Arcane Duelist Bard.

Im not against using magic, however I don't want it to be my primary method of damage dealing. Id rather swing a sword at something then be stuck at the backline casting fireball and magic missile every other turn. When I played my Unchained monk I could use the ki powers (which ive been thinking of as secondary casting powers) for things like barkskin that give me a in-combat benefit but still lets me otherwise play a martial character, if that makes sense.

Hello! I am still relatively new to anything pathfinder, having only played 2 campaigns, neither of which played past level 6, but from what Ive seen in play, and what Ive been told, spell casters are very powerful. I, however, am a stubborn man and have never been one for spell casting as a primary source of damage, no matter what the game. So Im wondering is there a way to create a martial character that can rival the output of a caster in any sense? Or if I cant, what can I do to get close in power?

Ive played so far as a raging barbarian and a unchained monk, and while I enjoyed my time in both, I wont lie that it felt useless at times to fight when we have a sorcerer who summons a giant ape and just clears the field, or a druid who just cast flaming sphere, when I go up to a singular enemy and only deal like 30 damage on a perfect roll.

Perhaps the highest powered martial class Ive heard of is the Magus, but Ive never played as/with one, so Im not a 100% sure on that.

Maybe as an aside, what would be needed for any martial class in general to allow it to reach a similar power level as casters? What are they lacking that casters arent?

In the last few years, in our group someone always seems to be playing a monk that dips, or a dip of one or two levels of monk.

We have had cleric dip monk, monk dip cleric, sorcerer dip monk, half monk half fighter, barbarian monk, zen archer.

Currently, I'm playing a slayer with two levels of MoMS using Grasping and Snapping Turtle style. Recently the build finally came "online" and he was able to using snapping turtle clutch to one handed defenestrate an enemy. He has also been able to pin and utilize sneak attack (flavored as beating an opponents head into the wall) due to losing their dex while pinned. It is a fun character to play.

I was just wanting to say this is perhaps the first time I have ever seen someone use the term “defenestrate” and I love it xD

PossibleCabbage wrote:

Since the Barbarian can straight up wear armor with no problem, and a breastplate is cheap. It's going to take a lot of Con for Mage Armor +ConMod to come out ahead of a 200gp piece of armor.

Not so much CON. 16 CON is easy to attain when you get a +4 bonus to the stat while raging.

He has an 16 bade actually. Gets 20 when raging, so with the con to armor boost he actually gains one AC instead if normally losing. 2

CommanderC2121 wrote:

so, I think Im still slightly confused on how flying kick worhs

The first one is correct: As part of the Flurry of Blows, i.e. the full attack action, you can move a distance up to your Fast Movement bonus (10ft at 5th level, 20ft at 6th level, 30ft at 9th level, etc.). The movement is part of the full-attack action.

Does that include the 5 foot re-positioning you can do with something like the "jabbing Dancer" style feat? Say I start a full round action, punch one guy, which afterwards I move 5 feet to the left of him (due to Jabbing Dancer) and then do a flying kick to someone else completing my full round action?

Even with Con to AC (which isn't available in Pathfinder, but w/e) it still seems strange to put mage armor on the barb. A 200g breastplate is +6 AC, and at level 4 you'd get to attune it for an additional +1. So if the barb would need 16 con to *break even* on mage armor vs. actual armor.

Like at most it seems like we're adding +1-2 to the barb's AC when we could be adding +4 to the monk's.

Forgive my ignorance, but why would the barb only get 1-2 AC? according to the Mage Armor page on d20PFSRP it says that there is a flat +4 armor bonus.

CommanderC2121 wrote:

Id be curious how we would be ambushed to be honest. (...) Since we have been in caves the entire time we havent had too many fights in narrow spaces, as the tunnels usually open into caverns by the time we come across enemies

You enter the cavern, there are some enemies waiting, the fight starts immediately? There's also had monsters summoned by traps, invisible or otherwise hidden enemies, and attacks while the party is resting.

It's your call, of course, you know better than us how often you end up fighting enemies 20-30ft away*. Any time you do (with larger distances later on), Flying Kick is better (presuming you can use Automatic Bonus progression to get the weapon attunement to all your unarmed strikes), because it can be combined with the ki bonus attack at full BAB, while the Elbow Slam bonus attack is a) conditional (the original attack needs to hit), and b) at BAB-5.

*) Remember that it's not just about the first enemy, either - even if the first enemy was too far away, after you've killed them, you often have other enemies nearby but out of reach. That's where Flying Kick really shines.

CommanderC2121 wrote:

Actually the witch has been casting mage armor on the barb instead of me.

Wait, what? Is the Barbarian not wearing armor?

I second what PossibleCabbage said. The Summoner can also cast Mage Armor (in the last campaign where I was a player, my Summoner maintained MA on the wildshape Druid - I've no idea what the Sorcerer was doing, but I've never used up my 1st level spell slots, anyway).

so, I think Im still slightly confused on how flying kick worhs (sorry). It lets me do a full action attack from my fast movement bonus as opposed to having to be directly in front of someone? or it allows me to move, and then once within my fast movement range I can do a full action as one turn?

and for Barbs, our DM took from DnDv5 the concept of Barbs using their COnsitution modifer as bonus to AC assuming they arent wearing armor, like how monks get the their wisdom bonus to AC

Well, having flying kick in your arsenal allows you to swift enter stance then use the rest of your turn to flurry if someone is within your flying kick distance on the very first turn. As a monk you don't really need to do a lot of prebuffing (you can just walk around with barkskin and mage armor* on, these are long-term buffs), so you might as well take advantage of that while the enemy is still getting ready.

Does your game allow for retraining? I strongly recommend a generous retraining standard for less experienced players. Since "I want to try this power- I wish I had taken something else, because it's not as useful as I thought" is a pretty standard way to engage with a system you have not yet mastered.

*For Mage Armor, buy your Witch a level 1 pearl of power on the condition they cast mage armor on you once a day. Doing this will be better than the "enhance your clothes" option for APB until level 15.

I don't see why retraining wouldn't be on the table, but I'll ask to make sure. Since most of us are new I'd assume we can use it. and Actually the witch has been casting mage armor on the barb instead of me. Funny enough I still have more AC then him, as he only goes to 21 whereas my barkskin gets me to 23.

Well, you do get a second style strike at 9th level. And the thing is that Flying Kick is not completely outclassed - Dimensional Dervish uses the swift action, which is actually rather costly. Not only could that swift action be a bonus attack at full BAB, you often need your first turn's swift action to enter the Jabbing Style stance! If you want to use Dimensional Dervish on the first round of a combat, Jabbing Master won't be active.

Of course, it depends a bit on the campaign - how often you're ambushed, whether you're fighting more in open spaces or narrow dungeons, and most importantly, how adamantine the GM is regarding the "can't activate a style before combat" thing.

Flying Kick starts a bit underwhelming (10ft at 5th level, 20ft at 6th level), but you can't take Dimensional Agility prior to 9th level, so it's probably "better that than nothing" until then. Or, realy, prior to 10th level, when you no longer care about the ki cost.

Assuming we arent ambushed, couldnt I just take a turn to get into stance?

Id be curious how we would be ambushed to be honest. I already have a perception bonus of +13, and we have a Summoner whose Eidolon has a +15 perception and a special scent ability I think. Then we also the summoner casting “Sense Magic” rather often. Since we have been in caves the entire time we havent had too many fights in narrow spaces, as the tunnels usually open into caverns by the time we come across enemies

CommanderC2121 wrote:

Our DM decided, as a way to streamline things, we can start a feat chain once we have the inital prereqs and can get the first 2 upgrades for free once we qualify, and style feats (which only have 3 upgrades normally) we can start and unlock the rest for free once we qualify.

Sweetness! unMonk is actually a pretty good class for that system.

CommanderC2121 wrote:

I'll get abundant step (as a lvl 8 ki power) and dimensional agility/dimensional assault for free, and get dimensional dervish and then savant when I get the next feat upgrades.

Er, shouldn't you have to take Dimensional Agility, and get Dimensional Assault and Dimensional Dervish for free?

You might think about getting Flying Kick anyway - doesn't eat the swift action, and doesn't cost ki (although the latter is pretty much irrelevant when you grab Ki Leech as your 10th level ki power).

Ill double check about which feat I unlock and then get free following, it was 1 in the morning when I asked so we were both tired, lol. And for flying kick, I just dont see how useful it can be when I could get something that was completely outclass it. The elbow smash would however let me use the jabbing style bonus damage, even if it would be nonelethal.

Don't worry about doing things "wrong"...

My first 5e campaign was broken and wrong on a plethora of different issues, and all ten levels of it were amazing... before life happened to call it short.

Play how your characters want to play, and have some fun.

If you have made a few choices thusfar playing off the party, but realize that your previous choices may be sub-optimal for higher level play, ask to retrain.

Your party characters SHOULD accumulate Fame/Reputation Points @ ~3/level, more if they roleplay their characters correctly...

You can use Fame/Reputation to retrain or learn new things. It's a thing that this game provides...

So you may have a pool of retraining points that you aren't using, but still actually have access to by default.

If you are only a little bit off of being optimized for something, you can still get access to it burning these imaginary (BUT STILL BUILT INTO THE GAME) points.

Can you put YOUR build on the table?
.. race (Dwarf)
.. stats (10,18,17,9,18,5)
.. class (UC Monk)
.. archetype
.. traits
.. feats
.. tactics

There are a lot of people here that may know what to do with it with minimal retraining...

Race: Dwarf

tactics: Our DM decided, as a way to streamline things, we can start a feat chain once we have the inital prereqs and can get the first 2 upgrades for free once we qualify, and style feats (which only have 3 upgrades normally) we can start and unlock the rest for free once we qualify. My plan is, once I level up to 5, is to take the Jabbing style feat, which will upgrade to jabbing dancer since Ill be monk lvl 5, and then elbow smash, so that I can get an extra hit and make use of the jabbing style damage bonus a bit more. Then, once I hit lvl 8, as a way to offset the normally common problem of having to move up to someone and then full attack, Ill start the Dimensional Savant feat chain. I'll get abundant step (as a lvl 8 ki power) and dimensional agility/dimensional assault for free, and get dimensional dervish and then savant when I get the next feat upgrades. I assume thats what you mean by tactics right?

CommanderC2121 wrote:

Also yes, just asked, we are doing the automatic bonus progression. So that's halved income but in return we get other bonuses and stuff

In that case, having a keen or other magic weapon without an enhancement bonus (the +x) is actually OK. RAW (that means "rules as written", by the way), you would need to find or buy such a weapon, but what the GM does there is pretty fine. I'm doing a mix of both for my own campaign (the players need to first find a weapon with the respective enchantment, e.g. keen, but can extract it and use the enchantment on other weapons).

With Automatic Bonus Progression, you don't actually need handwraps (only for special materials i.e. adamantine) or an AoMF - your unarmed strikes, which is your entire body, counts as a weapon, so you should be able to just apply the Weapon Attunement to yourself.

CommanderC2121 wrote:

and yes, the rolls are legit. Our DM uses the same die set for everyone, I just think I rolled a real life luck stat of 1 when it comes to avoiding damage/stunning targets xD

The question was more whether the GM rolls in the open, or just announces the result without anyone seeing the dice. Your GM wouldn't be the first to think that bonus arracks are too strong and thus Monk can't also have other goodies. If that's not the case, it should even itself out.

CommanderC2121 wrote:

Not sure what you mean by rolling HD, is that hit die? like rolling to hit?

Rolling your HD on levelup is the default method, but as you experience yourself, it can create imbalance (and even completely cripple characters) - especially since the effected characters are most often already of one of the weaker classes*. That's why many GMs (including Paizo's own organized play, PFS) uses either a method based on average, a "roll, but ignore results under a certain thresold", or a "roll a dice half as large and add half as a fixed value". My GM uses the second method after my first char, a cMonk, ended up almost unplayable; I myself use...

funny enough for HP level ups we've been rolling twice and taking the greater number. Again though my bad luck has led me to not get more then 4 hp per level up at most :L

CommanderC2121 wrote:

Derklord wrote:

CommanderC2121 wrote:

The Barb traded a lvl 4 weapon enhancement bonus for a keen stat, which is equal to the +1 weapon enhancement, and he was already using a falchion.

Er, are you using automatic bonus progression? Otherwise...

"Magic Weapon Special Ability Descriptions A weapon with a special ability must also have at least a +1 enhancement bonus." CRB pg. 468

Also yes, just asked, we are doing the automatic bonus progression. So that's halved income but in return we get other bonuses and stuff

If the GM is letting the Barb have Keen, you can get Agile since it too is a +1 bonus equivalent.

Didn't realize agile worked for that. Will definitely see if I can change my bonus to that.

CommanderC2121 wrote:

The Barb traded a lvl 4 weapon enhancement bonus for a keen stat, which is equal to the +1 weapon enhancement, and he was already using a falchion.

Er, are you using automatic bonus progression? Otherwise...

"Magic Weapon Special Ability Descriptions A weapon with a special ability must also have at least a +1 enhancement bonus." CRB pg. 468

Also yes, just asked, we are doing the automatic bonus progression. So that's halved income but in return we get other bonuses and stuff

CommanderC2121 wrote:

The Barb traded a lvl 4 weapon enhancement bonus for a keen stat, which is equal to the +1 weapon enhancement, and he was already using a falchion.

Er, are you using automatic bonus progression? Otherwise...

"Magic Weapon Special Ability Descriptions A weapon with a special ability must also have at least a +1 enhancement bonus." CRB pg. 468

Asmodeus' Advocate wrote:

Are you super attached to the idea of using your fists for fighting exclusively? Monk weapons tend to have better critical threat ranges, or reach.

With handwraps, unarmed isn't bad for unmonk - avoids the pesky problem of the bonus ki attack, lessen's the problem of style strikes, and allows style feat chains.

Also, a dex-based unMonks doesn't really profit much from using a weapon: There are no finessable reach monk weapons, nor any two-handable weapons. Unless you're using the Versatile Design/Ascetic Form combo, that is. Mathematically, greater critical thread range isn't actually that good for damage alone. For the OP's character, using a waveblade (the best crit monk weapo) would not increase the average damage.

Asmodeus' Advocate wrote:

Sounds to me like Aggressive Thundercloud from the Advanced Class Guide, but that's got a five foot diameter. But if that's how your DM rules it, no reason to rain on their parade?

The last thing prepared full casters (i.e. the strongest classes in the game) need is ignoring spell's limitations. Seriously, I see multiple very questionable GM calls (the Barb's weapon, the spell, and actually rolling HD). that apparently damage the party balance.

CommanderC2121 wrote:

Feats are Bleeding attack (gives 1d4 bleed damage with unarmed strikes), Weapon focus (unarmed)

Beliar's Bite is actually pretty crappy, because bleed damage doesn't stack, so it kinda clashes with your class concept of multiple attacks -...

I've been kinda just following how the others play, we're just college students, and (including myself) of the 7 people playing, only 2 (the GM and the barb) have played before. But they said that we could add the enchantment bonuses in place of the +1, so for instance I also have flaming, and our rouge group member has the shocking equivalent. so while it may have been mis-interpreted, it was done by everyone, and not solely the barb (in other words the barb doesnt have a enchantment advantage over any of us).

for the spell, i may have mistyped when I said radius. I dont use it (obviously) so I didnt know specifics off the top of my head so I feel confident in saying they do use the correct distance measurements and I just mistyped.

Not sure what you mean by rolling HD, is that hit die? like rolling to hit?

The bleeding damage i get is from the Bleeding Attack feat, not sure what Beliar's Bite is tbh. If its just a 1d4 then i guess its the same. and I will plan to go jabbing.

I think the debate was over things like the abilities you earned with vs without a ki pool and the number of attacks, but in either case, they know more then me so I was just kinda doing what they suggested for class starting base stuff.

and yes, the rolls are legit. Our DM uses the same die set for everyone, I just think I rolled a real life luck stat of 1 when it comes to avoiding damage/stunning targets xD

Kinda worried I asked now because I feel like we mightve done everything wrong but didnt know it D:

CommanderC2121 wrote:

I dont remember the exact name of the thundercloud spell they are using, but it lasts for 1 per level turns thats deals 3d6 damage to all enemies in a 5 foot radius.

Sounds to me like Aggressive Thundercloud from the Advanced Class Guide, but that's got a five foot diameter. But if that's how your DM rules it, no reason to rain on their parade?

Are you super attached to the idea of using your fists for fighting exclusively? Monk weapons tend to have better critical threat ranges, or reach.

I mean, it's fun imagining a 4 foot dwarf just punching the s#&* out of things. I went with fists due to them upgrading in damage as I level up, and I've already invested a bit into them with things like a weapon focus and such. I realize that monk weapons do get the bonuses that fists due as far as them being unarmed strikes, but I honestly just didnt see any weapons that screamed "must use"

I concur that handwraps are likely a better choice than an AoMF. Looking at the style strikes they won't function on flying kick, foot stomp, headbutt, knockback kick, leg sweep, and spin kick if we're being strict by RAW. But the most important one of those (flying kick) doesn't require you to hit the initial attack, and you mostly want it to be able to flurry people who aren't next to you. Elbow Smash is a good 2nd style strike choice, particularly if you're using jabbing style (which rewards making as many attacks as you can.) It should work with handwraps, since you can say you have wrapped them all the way up like Sajan here.

So i mentioned this to someone else, but I heard about the Dimensional Savant feat tree that I could get for my monk, and if I do decide to go for that feat set, would going something other then flying kick be a good choice as far as style feats? Such as Elbow Smash or hammerblow/defensive spin?

Ok, first, some general things.

1) Your damage per hit won't be on par with a Barbarian's or Sneak Attacking Rogue's (unless using Jabbing Master), but that's normal - you have more attacks, after all. In the end, it's the damage done in a round that counts, though, and you should be able to be competitive in that regard.
2) The Barbarian has a +1 keen weapon at 4th level? Seriously? A 6th level character is supposed to have 6000 gp, a +1 keen falchion costs 8375gp.
3) Get magic handwraps ASAP. They do most of what AoMF does (everything except boosting some style strikes, normally) but only cost half as much to enchant. Monk's Robe isn't actually that good - you shouldn't invest in it prior to getting a +4 Belt of Incredible Dexterity.
4) How do a Witch and a Druid "send out massive AoE spells"? If with "thundercloud" you mean Aggressive Thundercloud, that's a single target for on average 10.5 damage per round (Reflex half).
5) What are your feats? (And what's your ki power?)
6) Cleave stops being useful pretty soon, you shouldn't worry about it too much.
7) Yeah, Stunning Fist is kinda underwhelming, but hey, it's free! It was even worse on core Monk...

CommanderC2121 wrote:

Can I stack style feats then? I assume not, but thought I'd ask.

Actually, you can profit from multiple style feats at the same time. The thing is that the majority of them says "While using this style (...)", which refers to entering the style's stance (a swift action that can only be used in combat), and you can only have one such stance active without the methods PossibleCabbage mentioned.

Jabbing Style does not have such language, so you could be in Linnorm Style and still profit from Jabbing Style. This does not, however, function for followup feats (like Jabbing Dancer and Jabbing Master), to profit in any way from those, you...

The Barb traded a lvl 4 weapon enhancement bonus for a keen stat, which is equal to the +1 weapon enhancement, and he was already using a falchion.

Ill see when I can get handwraps

I dont remember the exact name of the thundercloud spell they are using, but it lasts for 1 per level turns that deals 3d6 damage to all enemies in a 5 foot radius.

Feats are Bleeding attack (gives 1d4 bleed damage with unarmed strikes), Weapon focus (unarmed), Deflect arrows and dodge (and mobility is given for free with the rules our DM is using). Then, since they are so common in combat our DM gave us for free: power attack, weapon finesse, Combat expertise and Deadly aim.

I took a Quinqqong Ki power (barkskin)

and I just havent been able to hit a stunning fist because our DM has been blessed to roll high on everything relating to me. I have the highest AC yet also have taken the most hits, and my stunning fist forces him to roll a 16 for DC, but he has rolled nat 20's each time I've tried. Im sure it will be nice if I ever hit it, lol.

Also, I tried monk for the first 3 levels and that was even worse then now, so my DM was willing to let me change to unchained (in our group the two who knew what they were doing had differing views on unchained, one saying it was better and one saying it was worse so I was just unsure)

and for feats, I guess Ill just get jabbing when I can then. I read the later upgrades and those seem insane! I also learned from Reddit about the Dimensional Savant feat tree, which sounds quite fun, so I guess I will try to get that once I can. Unless you would suggest against it I guess. You know more then me

Jabbing style works via: once you hit someone with an an unarmed strike in a round (including through flurry of blows), any further unarmed strikes that hit that person will do an additional +1d6. So if you punch someone three times in a round the latter two attacks will each add 1d6.

Where this gets silly is when you have, say, a hasted 11th level monk who has triggered medusa's wrath making a flurry of blows: you are making seven attacks, 5 of which are at your full BAB. With jabbing master, if you hit with all 7 the last 4 are adding +4d6!

I had'nt seen that medusa feat before, i see why it would be so good. Can I stack style feats then? I assume not, but thought I'd ask.

If they do stack, should I consider Linnorm style? since I will already be leveling wisdom as its a ki component (ha) for monks, that would allow me to by pass ever worrying about strength then, correct? I could use dex to hit and wisdom for damage?

PossibleCabbage wrote:

So the basic question is "how to do damage as a high dex/low strength monk"? Usually the issue with that approach is that you start out weak but get better. Prioritize picking up an Agile Amulet of Mighty fists, and look into Jabbing Style once you qualify. Flying kick at 5th level should help you land a flurry without starting the turn next to someone. If you can find a way to trigger Medusa's Wrath consistently, the Jabbing Style chain can give you a ton of single target damage when you flurry.

But at the very least it's likely that you have the highest AC in the Party, so you can lean on that- barkskin is a good choice for the level 4 ki power (since your amulet slot is for punching better.)

I see, thank you for the help

I was looking at styles and noticed jabbing and Linnorm styles, and I have a question about both. For jabbing, does the bonus 1d6 damage stack in flurry of blows? like one hit, nothing, but then the next 2 (assuming ki point) both get the bonus damage?

and for Linnorm, since I already have a high AC, while also having a wisdom bonus of +4, so first off does the wisdom bonus stack per hit or after all hits as a final additive, and if its per hit, would that be a possible choice?

So the basic question is "how to do damage as a high dex/low strength monk"? Usually the issue with that approach is that you start out weak but get better. Prioritize picking up an Agile Amulet of Mighty fists, and look into Jabbing Style once you qualify. Flying kick at 5th level should help you land a flurry without starting the turn next to someone. If you can find a way to trigger Medusa's Wrath consistently, the Jabbing Style chain can give you a ton of single target damage when you flurry.

But at the very least it's likely that you have the highest AC in the Party, so you can lean on that- barkskin is a good choice for the level 4 ki power (since your amulet slot is for punching better.)

I see, thank you for the help

Hello everyone! I am, as the title says, new to pathfinder. Im playing with some friends and after playing a bit, Im not sure where to best take my character. Im currently classed as a level 4 Dwarven Unchained-monk. I just unlocked the Ki powers, and will get the attack styles next level, but I feel like I do no damage. I looked up some tips and stuff and found that I kinda stat'd wrong for my character (including the lvl 4 attribute rank up, I'm at 10 Strength, 18 Dex, 17 Con, 9 Intelligence, 18 wisdom and 5 Charisma.) I realize that since I have no bonuses from strength my damage is going to be lower, but the hope I had was (at the time of planning) boost the wisdom and dex stats as high as I can to improve my AC bonus (since monks AC scales off wisdom when not wearing armor, and our DM decided some classes (like monk) can use Dex to hit with melee). But where can I go from here?

As for combat, I just feel like I dont do anything. We have 2 casters (a blood drinking witch and a druid) who can send out massive AoE spells like thundercloud that demolish crowds, we have a magus who can throw his sword and pull it back mjlnor style, and since he casts true strike each time he’s guaranteed like 15 damage per throw, or more since he has a spell that duplicates it. We have a barb that crits most hits (has a keen falchion), but when he rages not only does he have 60 hp with 2 DR, but he’s triple critting (Our dm decided if you roll a confirm crit and it is a nat 20, you can roll to triple crit) and he just one shots the enemy with 60 damage. We have a rouge who can backstab for like 30 damage per hit and then theres me. The monk (who granted has like 25 ac) but that barely does anything. Since I didnt stat into strength and dont have power attack (although the DM mentioned possibly making power attack something free for everyone because its so good) all my damage is base hit and feat bonuses. I can do at max 16 damage for a punch (i have bonus fire damage and bleed) but any punch after is a max of 12. So theoretically I can deal 40 damage in a full flurry (using a ki point) but thats so rare. So far every stunning blow Ive tried has failed so I also dont have a super reliable hit (I’ve been rolling averages of 10-11 and only hit because I have a +9 to hit) and just, well, feel useless. Why have the monk there when the barb (who’s getting cleave next level up) does literally everything better. I even have the 2nd lowest hp because Ive been rolling horribly in level ups (only getting 1 or 2 each time)

Im just useless :/

Is anyone able to give me tips?