Bailey Allen's page

KingOfAnything wrote:

LoreKeeper wrote:

From my read of this, Mark, doesn't this essentially lock in the monk-bard as the ultimate multi-class build?

[/onlyhalfserious]

I like ranger-bard, personally.

I fully intend to go druid-bard at some point during the playtest, to see how that behaves.

Actually seems like a really good stand-in for the witch during the playtest to sate that witch-itch...

...unless remove curse isn't on either of their spell-lists. Then I suppose you'll have to ask your party cleric to look at your witch-itch...

Bailey Allen wrote:

For how diverse the bard seems to able to built (between compositions, spell cantrips, spell powers, class feats and spell repertoire), the 1st level seems uncharacteristically forced into taking inspire courage and counter performance. If I wanted to build a reclusive scholar, it seems unfitting for her to have inspire confidence. Is this something that all bards must take and if so, is there hope of us dropping it in the future?

You could flavour it as instead rattling off handy knowledge based fighting tips to your allies.

"If you can, the chitin under it's mandibles is thinner than anywhere else on the beast."

"According to Malthar's Tome of Unearthly Horrors, you really shouldn't be listening to the gibberring."

"Did you know that most monsters have testicles? Kick them for fascinating results!"

This is why Malthar's Tome of Unearthly Horrors should be required reading. They always underestimate the gibbering...

Xenocrat wrote:

Mark,

Xenocrat wrote:

Ctrl-F: "Charisma"

[No results found]

Is it feasible to make a Bard that doesn't pump Charisma? (I'd really prefer an Int based Occult caster). I'm sure Charisma is the Bard's casting stat, but I'm guessing that unless you insist on mind controlling people with your spells you've got enough utility/buffs that you might get by without worrying about your DCs too much.

If you didn't use the maestro stuff or rely overly much on spell rolls and DCs, I feel like you could do pretty reasonably, particularly in some of the "Bardic Knowledge" type stuff.

I really want to build a scholar character now as a bard with 10 Charisma, high Int lore muse. To add to that ...

Finally, you begin play at 1st level with two compositions, the inspire courage cantrip (which has been detailed above) and the counter performance power.

For how diverse the bard seems to able to built (between compositions, spell cantrips, spell powers, class feats and spell repertoire), the 1st level seems uncharacteristically forced into taking inspire courage and counter performance. If I wanted to build a reclusive scholar, it seems unfitting for her to have inspire confidence. Is this something that all bards must take and if so, is there hope of us dropping it in the future?

In all honesty it would pretty appropriate for someone self-centered with minimum Charisma to have the ability to buff their teammates, and just choose never to do it in favor of anything else more pragmatic.

Really, really (really) love the changes to bard. You can see in Wayne's art that Lem knows good things are on the horizon for him.

Bailey Allen wrote:

Quandary wrote:

Bailey Allen wrote:

The Gold Sovereign wrote:

The only thing I'm not liking so far is that Spontaneous Heightening has nothing spontaneous in it. Two spells per day, and not two spells chosen at the start of the day. That would solve it to me.

Sorcerers are meant to be spontaneous, to have magic in their blood, so choosing the spells they want to heighten in the heat of the battle, as their blood is running wild, is far more thematically appropriate and mechanically enjoyable.

-Some other stuff was said-

But anyways, here is other compromise:

Two spells designated as "Spontaneously Heighten-able" but you can change those two spells AT ANY TIME by spending a full round or 1 minute or whatever.
So it is not necessarily only two spells for the entire day, but at same time your choice at any given moment are still limited to 2 spells.

Hey, that's actually a pretty elegant solution. Making it so it can't be redirected without cost, but you still have that option available. Maybe throw in a spell-point cost as well so you have to be sure you want to commit to changing it.

Unfortunately I'm guessing that's abusable. Let's say I'm a Sorcerer who knows both Inflict, Cure, and Summon. I probably walk around before battle with Inflict and Summon, then after battle I can swap into Cure to heal up the party and swap back...

I don't mind the two-spell limit, overall. I did like the idea of choosing spell already known levels for your spells daily, but others don't like the idea of any "prepared" aspects for sorcerers, which is fine.

However, I will say, that if I need to potentially keep re-learning my spells to have the highest two levels, for example, of any given spell, it better be *real* easy to retrain these...

If it cost spell points, you could only do that a few times per day and it would cut into the resource you use for your other, more flexible abilities (which is the beauty of the spell point system). Also that would use twice as much points and time (switching to one then switching back).

I agree that the impact that all this will have on the class is very much dependent on how often you get a retrain, and I very much hope it is better than PF1's one per every two levels.

Bailey Allen wrote:

The Gold Sovereign wrote:

The only thing I'm not liking so far is that Spontaneous Heightening has nothing spontaneous in it. Two spells per day, and not two spells chosen at the start of the day. That would solve it to me.

Sorcerers are meant to be spontaneous, to have magic in their blood, so choosing the spells they want to heighten in the heat of the battle, as their blood is running wild, is far more thematically appropriate and mechanically enjoyable.

The problem is the decision paralysis Mark mentioned earlier. This would run into that same problem, though at a lessened magnitude.

It's really hard to think of an elegant solution that still keeps the theme you just describe. I'm of the opinion the theme is more important, but it would be ruined if every battle was stopped by the sorcerer running through their spells weighing the cost and benefit of heightening them until they used up those slots per day.

Yeah, but some player could feel compelled to look up stats of every Summon Monster they could summon.

Players not willing to deal with analysis paralysis is a problem regardless.

But anyways, here is other compromise:
Two spells designated as "Spontaneously Heighten-able" but you can change those two spells AT ANY TIME by spending a full round or 1 minute or whatever.
So it is not necessarily only two spells for the entire day, but at same time your choice at any given moment are still limited to 2 spells.

Hey, that's actually a pretty elegant solution. Making it so it can't be redirected without cost, but you still have that option available. Maybe throw in a spell-point cost as well so you have to be sure you want to commit to changing it.

The only thing I'm not liking so far is that Spontaneous Heightening has nothing spontaneous in it. Two spells per day, and not two spells chosen at the start of the day. That would solve it to me.

Sorcerers are meant to be spontaneous, to have magic in their blood, so choosing the spells they want to heighten in the heat of the battle, as their blood is running wild, is far more thematically appropriate and mechanically enjoyable.

The problem is the decision paralysis Mark mentioned earlier. This would run into that same problem, though at a lessened magnitude.

It's really hard to think of an elegant solution that still keeps the theme you just describe. I'm of the opinion the theme is more important, but it would be ruined if every battle was stopped by the sorcerer running through their spells weighing the cost and benefit of heightening them until they used up those slots per day.

So wait, are the spells you choose to learn locked into level-slots like in PF1 for sure? Like you couldn't be a 20th level sorcerer with 30 level 1 spells plus your bloodline spells?

As you level up, you learn new spells and can replace some of the spells you previously had with new ones. This lets you get rid of some spells that were great options when they were at your highest level but maybe aren't worth casting anymore.

I guess the big question is how often can you do this? Will you have enough to drop your sleep and color spray equivalents as well as your spells you want at a higher level?

I noticed there was no Infernal bloodline listed. At first I thought it was because all the various evil outsiders were being rolled under on banner as is the case for Celestial but it definitely specifies an Demonic bloodline from the Abyss. Is this one that just didnt make the cut or is their more going on beyond the machinations of our tiny mortal minds?

Please give Sorcerers some basic armor proficiency for free this time! With the improved BAB stuff, they should have a chance to gish it out without dying horribly.

Essentially, don't make them equal to a Wizard in martial prowes...

I wouldn't suprised if we got class feats that bump their proficiencies. Something you had the option of taking if you really wanted to (and yes, some of us really want to)

These changes are great. Now if you want to play a spontaneous caster, there is one place to look and you can fill a variety of character themes with the same infrastructure.

The biggest question I have is with the spontaneous heightening class feature. It seems to imply that in order to cast a heightened spell without the class feature, you must have the spell added to your repertoire at the level you want it heightened. Does that mean I could learn heal as a 3rd level spell and never be able to cast it at anything but that unless I select it with the class feature for the day?

-Edit- Yeah that's definitely how it works. Thats pretty cool actually, you can relearn your heals or your magic missles at higher levels to keep them relevant, then select them with the spontaneous heightening for the day if you think your going to need to expend more spell slots on them.

It creates a balancing act of commodities vs. power depending on what your going for. Im a big fan!