Seppukumon's page

I would actually consider 'playtesting' legendary games kineticist as a (extremely loose) way to see how a class that focuses more on spell attacks and dcs works against the chassis in paizos kineticist. Obviously there are a ton more factors, and legendary kineticist might be a bit overtuned while paizos is maybe undertuned, but it could be a fun comparison.

That was my original intent with this, but people were more interested in arguing over homebrew vs 3rd party.

I would agree with you, but most tables I have played at don't like using 3rd party materials to replace officially released materials. While I will at my table, you should assume that official trumps 3rd party. Not that they will coexist.

Seppukumon wrote:

You mean the ones who asked for the class to be ported over want it to feel like it used to? Shocking.

Oh yeah cuz that's how balance is achieved.

Wait it's not.

Not very shocking though

Very easy to balance it while keeping the same feel.

Just because you can't see that doesn't make it not true.

You mean the ones who asked for the class to be ported over want it to feel like it used to? Shocking.

I mean, the playtest is the time to complain the most, and I'm mainly keeping it here, and only then because no one was interested in actually playing along with the prompt of the thread.

Which wasn't is it as powerful, but how do the comparative playstyles feel on the table.

Ignoring the semantics argument only one person actually answered.

But if you want the current version scrapped that's your perogative. Just don't be surprised if some people state that they like where current playtest is heading and just want to see some basic changes to better realize it.

There are people who will like anything, that's why I said in my original post, if this is near how it will be when released I am sticking with the Legendary Kineticist for my players.

Same damage means nothing when the damage between the two systems isn't the same nor health values. Plus, that's base damage. What 1e kineticist was functioning at base even half the time.

But it you want to remove most of the classes versatility. Locking it mostly be to single Target or self buffs and completely focus on blast's I guess that's an option.

One I don't expect to happen. Because it would require a complete rewrite. While revision happens often, I don't think I've seen a complete and utter change to that extent yet.

I still maintain 1e was a fundamentally flawed and broken system and should never receive anything more than a nod for lore reasons.

You seem confused, infusions still used base damage, and often used half base damage on success. At the cost of your level in hit points. Composite blasts did 2d6 instead of 1d6 per level, but cost (2*lvl) in burn damage, so that wasn't an all day every day ability. That is without any other augment on it.

2e is just as broken and flawed as 1e, just in different ways.

Yes, they should do a full rewrite, playtesting is THE time to do full rewrites, and no you don't need to remove versatility to balance it, you just add a resource to limit the number of uses of the versatile features. Focus points, a burn pool similar to reagents or spell slots, etc.

They want to change it because the pf1e design has no actual place in 2e biome so it must be changed.

Obviously given the feedback on this forum this won't be the final version of the class for this edition.

That's not true at all, there are clear ways to take something from 1e and translate it in 2e terms. This is why we still have things like power attack, which itself is just vital strike from 1e except that it multiplies on a crit.

You don't HAVE to change it in its entirety when there is a clear way to do it in the new terms that doesn't break it, and something being broken works both ways, overpowered and under. They have focus spells, those are clear perfect uses for infusions instead of overflow which would remove the infinite use excuse for it to be so underwhelming in what it can do, they have drained or stunned for burn as an optional consequence for overchanneling in desperate situations, they have the same cones lines columns bursts and auras that can be used for form infusions, they have new more specific terms for status effects to be used for substance infusions, put flourish on it to make it once per turn but don't make its main thing provoke AoO, use con for attack or bonus damage so that it has SOME use outside of DCs and 1 ability that lets you use it to name a number of creatures to not be effected by an aura.

The change they are doing is not because the design has no place, it's change for change sake.

Verzen wrote:

Seppukumon wrote:

What the title says, I am curious what people think when comparing what the homebrew brought compared to what the playtest has.

Mainly, cantrips vs "strikes", focus abilities vs overflow, burn as stun vs no burn at all, proficiency progression going to legendary for blasts vs master.

If the class releases anywhere near how it is in the playtest I believe I personally will continue to use the homebrew as I personally find it to be better thought out and implemented than how the playtest reads.

I am unfortunately not in any PF2E games at the moment, my group is running a few other systems right now so I probably wont get to play to see how it really feels. So I wanted to hear what anybody who has played with the Legendary Kineticist homebrew and the playtest, which do you prefer?

I like what the Legendary did with elemental defense. I really, really want it back.

Good news for you! The Legendary Games Kineticist exists. If it does what you think the kineticist should do, talk to your GM about using it. If they don't want to then talk to them about why. It doesn't seem like the developers at PF2 want to make that exact same class for their game.

It feels like they want to change it just to change it but don't really know what to do with it honestly.

It seems that Adapt Element "Gather" option allows you to Gather any element in your environment, no matter your inner gate. Then, even without specific impulse, you use this "gathered element" for generic purpose, such as Element blast "...using your gathered element".

Not gamebreaking, but quite nice to have options.

Choose a non-magical portion of an element you can channel that’s within 10 feet of you.

You have to be able to channel the element, so your 1 element as a dedicated, 1 of 2 for dual, or any of the universal.

*Edited formatting.

The homebrew is imbalanced is my opinion.

It isn't like game breaking imbalanced, it does need a few tweaks. I played the Legendary Kineticist from level 1-20 in a campaign and had a player play one from 1-20 in one of my campaigns. Neither were doing too much more than anyone else to where it was noticeable or game breaking. Though again, yes it does need a few tweaks to keep it in line with other classes.

Martialmasters wrote:

DM_aka_Dudemeister wrote:

It's weird to refer to Legendary Kineticist as "homebrew" when it's by a reputable 3rd party publisher and an author who has worked for Paizo in the past.

Imo if it's not official paizo material it's home brew, even if it's been licensed and put up for sale.

Heh, in all fairness tho, even if kinda-sorta technically correct, it's prolly better to differentiate the commercially available 3rd-party stuff with somebody's completely free homemade game stuff- so as to minimize confusion. ;p

In my defense I was very tired and forgot the term 3rd party when I was writing my original post.

What the title says, I am curious what people think when comparing what the homebrew brought compared to what the playtest has.

Mainly, cantrips vs "strikes", focus abilities vs overflow, burn as stun vs no burn at all, proficiency progression going to legendary for blasts vs master.

If the class releases anywhere near how it is in the playtest I believe I personally will continue to use the homebrew as I personally find it to be better thought out and implemented than how the playtest reads.

I am unfortunately not in any PF2E games at the moment, my group is running a few other systems right now so I probably wont get to play to see how it really feels. So I wanted to hear what anybody who has played with the Legendary Kineticist homebrew and the playtest, which do you prefer?